Islamic Demonic Ritualism Kills

[Freak]

See & read for yourself: http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/02/01/hajj.stampede/index.html

[Freak]

MINA, Saudi Arabia (CNN) -- A stampede Sunday morning killed 80-90 people at a stone-throwing ritual during the Hajj pilgrimage, an event which has been the source of deadly tramplings in the past.

A ministry of health spokesman confirmed there were deaths and injuries, but could not say how many. The incident happened around 9 a.m. (1 a.m. ET) and the injured were taken to a hospital in Mina.

The pilgrims, taking part in the annual Hajj ritual, traveled from Mecca to Mina to cast small pebbles at three columns of stone that symbolize the devil.

[Zakath]

Why is throwing rocks "demonic ritualism"?

It would appear that the real problem is one of crowd control...

[BillyBob]

I heard that the rocks themselves were possessed.



It turns out the land was owned by demons and therefor, the rocks were the possessions of theirs.

[Demonic Possession] :freak:















Hey, it's early!

[Zakath]

Well, as they say, "possession is 9/10ths of the law"...

[BillyBob]

:chuckle:

[Zakath]

Thank you. We do our best... :D

[okinrus]

The Islamic exorcisms are more similar to the Jewish ones that I've read. I don't believe that Muslims believe that the rocks are possesed, but that they symbolize Satan. I think it's similar to how Musilms go to the grave of one of the wicked kings of the Old Testament mentioned in the Qur'an and throw rocks at it.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by okinrus

The Islamic exorcisms are more similar to the Jewish ones that I've read. I don't believe that Muslims believe that the rocks are possesed, but that they symbolize Satan. I think it's similar to how Musilms go to the grave of one of the wicked kings of the Old Testament mentioned in the Qur'an and throw rocks at it. I would agree. None of the Muslims I have talked with here in the U.S. think the rocks are demonic, merely symbols. Jay is demonstrating a common difficulty people have when moving from a fundamentalist religious viewpoint to a symbolic religious viewpoint.

It is easy for former fundies to forget that symbols are not the same as an underlying reality they meant to represent.

As an Eastern philosopher once put it this way,

"Do not mistake the reflection of the moon in the pond for the real thing."

[Freak]

Originally posted by okinrus

The Islamic exorcisms are more similar to the Jewish ones that I've read. I don't believe that Muslims believe that the rocks are possesed, but that they symbolize Satan. I think it's similar to how Musilms go to the grave of one of the wicked kings of the Old Testament mentioned in the Qur'an and throw rocks at it. Strange stuff indeed.

[Nineveh]

It's sad, almost every year we hear of deaths in the Hajj... There are also "pilgrimages" in India that have these kinds of stampede deaths :(

Does human sacrifice have to be "ritualistic" ?

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Nineveh

It's sad, almost every year we hear of deaths in the Hajj... There are also "pilgrimages" in India that have these kinds of stampede deaths :(

Does human sacrifice have to be "ritualistic" ? It's accidental. It's not human sacrifice any more than people being trampled to death at a soccer game in South America is human sacrifice.

It's poor crowd management. The local (Islamic?) governments should be intervening for safety's sake.

[Freak]

Originally posted by Nineveh


Does human sacrifice have to be "ritualistic" ? It's usually is though. :(

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Freak

See & read for yourself: http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/02/01/hajj.stampede/index.html

must be over with, I clicked on it and didnt see anything.
good ole cnn for alerting us though,
who owns cnn?

[Nineveh]

Originally posted by crytahvn

must be over with, I clicked on it and didnt see anything.
good ole cnn for alerting us though,
who owns cnn?

The link worked for me just now...

MECCA, Saudi Arabia (CNN) -- A stampede Sunday morning killed 244 Muslim pilgrims and injured another 244 at a stone-throwing ritual which has been the source of deadly tramplings in the past, according to Saudi's health minister.

***

1998 - 180 people died in a stampede near Mecca at the end of the Hajj;

1997 - A fire in Mina tore through the sprawling, overcrowded tent city , trapping and killing more than 340 pilgrims and injuring 1,500;

1994 - a stampede kills 270 pilgrims;

The link worked for me, who owns Mecca?

[Aussie Thinker]

Its horrific when a fundamental belief in demons and the devil result in death or destruction.

A belief in Demons should be BANNED by law !

Do you think the irony will be lost on Freak..

Seriously though the problem here is EXACTLY what Zakath said.. Crowd Control.. we lose as many lives in the west with poor crowd control too.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Nineveh

The link worked for me just now...



The link worked for me, who owns Mecca?

It was all white when I clicked on it, maybe it is my dial up.

I guess saudi owns mecca.
but jews own cnn and they love to spread anything bad about their enemies to americans so the christians will hate and kill them., which I see freak could not wait to spread.
but then the incite hatred laws were not meant for them :) but only to protect them in case someone gives them a taste of their own medicine.

[Flipper]

Which Jews own CNN?

I thought it was Ted Turner. As in this Ted Turner (http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/06/19/1023864447842.html).

CNN does have a pro-Israeli bias (it seems quite apparent) but you are way overboard on this one I think. Perhaps you are letting your anti-semitism blind you to reality?

[Zakath]

I always heard Ted Turner was an atheist...

Link (http://www.celebatheists.com/entries/atheist_36.html) Page down until you find the article about Turner who divorced his wife Jane Fonda in 2001 when she became a Christian...

[Flipper]

Well, yeah. Exactly.

Ted Turner. Generally not recognized for being Jewish.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
It's accidental. It's not human sacrifice any more than people being trampled to death at a soccer game in South America is human sacrifice.

It's poor crowd management. The local (Islamic?) governments should be intervening for safety's sake. I disagree. We had to have eight people die, here in Cincinnati, at our old (now demolished) football stadium, before the City officials forced the Cincinnati Bengals to buy and install nets for the end zones. The fans were leaning over, trying to catch the ball which had just been kicked, and fell, head-first to the concrete below. Both the fan, who thought more of the ball he was trying to catch than his own life, and the fans behind him doing the same with carelessness towards his life, were worshipping their 'false-gods,' though you might call them by other names. The officials responsible for fan safety thought more of their gods (mammon) than the lives of their fans. I wrote a very strong letter to the editor of the local newspaper, which was published, and within two weeks, the nets were installed. The eighth fan that died was the first one that I heard about, because of the value of the stories being ignored by the media.

[Granite]

Cry also believes the Jews killed Kennedy and started every war in human history. Go figure.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

I disagree. We had to have eight people die, here in Cincinnati, at our old (now demolished) football stadium, before the City officials forced the Cincinnati Bengals to buy and install nets for the end zones. The fans were leaning over, trying to catch the ball which had just been kicked, and fell, head-first to the concrete below. Both the fan, who thought more of the ball he was trying to catch than his own life, and the fans behind him doing the same with carelessness towards his life, were worshipping their 'false-gods,' though you might call them by other names. The officials responsible for fan safety thought more of their gods (mammon) than the lives of their fans. I wrote a very strong letter to the editor of the local newspaper, which was published, and within two weeks, the nets were installed. The eighth fan that died was the first one that I heard about, because of the value of the stories being ignored by the media. Aimiel,
While I may occasionally make jokes about sports as religion in some states, sports is an industry here in America, not really a religion.

I think you're casting your religious metaphor a bit more broadly than it's designed for. When everything becomes religion you dehumanize your fellow men and women in to unthinking sheep, blinding clawing their way toward their deities...

Regarding the stories being ignored by the media, that is dependent on a variety of very human factors, not some great demonic coverup... :rolleyes:

[Zakath]

Originally posted by granite1010

Cry also believes the Jews killed Kennedy and started every war in human history. Go figure. Crybaby comes across as an ignorant, insecure person who is desparately looking for someone to whom she can feel superior. In her case it's the evil "Jews"...

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
When everything becomes religion you dehumanize your fellow men and women in to unthinking sheep, blinding clawing their way toward their deities...You've never been more poetic or prophetic. I might suggest that those who are not headed toward The Lord are goats, but, other than that, it's pretty accurate.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker
A belief in Demons should be BANNED by law !This was the most demonic post ever, on TOL. Seriously, that is exactly what the devil has been trying for over 6,000 years to get men to believe: "There is no devil." How foolish.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

This was the most demonic post ever, on TOL. Seriously, that is exactly what the devil has been trying for over 6,000 years to get men to believe: "There is no devil." How foolish.
(pssssst!)
Read the entire post by Aussie, in context. He may have been less than completely serious. :rolleyes:

[Aussie Thinker]

Amiel…

This was the most demonic post ever, on TOL. Seriously, that is exactly what the devil has been trying for over 6,000 years to get men to believe: "There is no devil." How foolish.

Sigh….

I guess you dind’t see who that (joke) was aimed at.

NO belief should be banned.. perhaps some of the physical activities that stem from certain beliefs should be banned.. like exorcism etc.. but to ban the belief itself would be an anathema to me.

That said.. a belief in demons is as stupid as a belief in the Tooth Fairy.. probably even more so as at least remember getting 20 cents from the Tooth Fairy when I was kid !

Demons, Devil, bogeyman, monsters.. woo oooh.. the most childish of fearful garbage I have ever heard of….

But feel free to believe in them if you must !

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker
That said.. a belief in demons is as stupid as a belief in the Tooth Fairy.

Demons, Devil, bogeyman, monsters.. woo oooh.. the most childish of fearful garbage I have ever heard of…Those who say that they don't believe that demons exist are doing more to promote the message of hell than of Heaven. The Lord cast out demons, spoke to them, asked them their names and now you're going to tell The Lord, "You're foolish, there are no demons?" I don't think so. Either The Lord knows the truth or you do; and I will have to believe His Word over yours, any day.

When the Anti-Christ, the world leader, who 'charismatically' leads all the nations of the world into a false-peace, you will be the first to fall for his lies, since you're already promoting his number one lie: "There are no demons."

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
Read the entire post by Aussie, in context. He may have been less than completely serious.Zakath,

I didn't say that he wasn't joking, but that he was foolish, in his lack of belief that demons exist. That is foolish, and nearly as foolish as believing that God does not exist.

Your 'lack of sincerity' is noted in every one of your posts, as well as your foolish worship of the false 'gods' of mammon, knowledge and any other false 'god' that you might happen to be following and espousing. You claim that you don't believe in any diety, but prove otherwise. You promote more false 'gods' than anyone I have ever read posts by, on TOL.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel
I didn't say that he wasn't joking, but that he was foolish, in his lack of belief that demons exist. That is foolish, and nearly as foolish as believing that God does not exist.Well, I guess you told me, eh? :chuckle:

Your 'lack of sincerity' is noted in every one of your posts, as well as your foolish worship of the false 'gods' of mammon, knowledge and any other false 'god' that you might happen to be following and espousing. You claim that you don't believe in any diety, but prove otherwise. You promote more false 'gods' than anyone I have ever read posts by, on TOL. None of the things you've named is a deity, Aimiel. It's you Christians' fear of "the world" that colors your perspective so that you see demons and gods under every rock. Perhaps, if there was a god, that's why he doesn't kill you when you convert, so you can actually learn about reality, not the imaginary beings you conjure in your mind... :think:

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
Well, I guess you told me, eh?If I didn't tell you the truth, The Lord might require your blood by my hand. I don't want that. I prefer that you get saved, but can't make that decision for you.None of the things you've named is a deity, Aimiel. Didn't say that they were, only that you're serving them, and promoting them. I understand that they are false, but apparently you don't. You believe that you are not worshipping at all, and yet you are worshipping a false 'god' (or several) all day long, 24 / 7.It's you Christians' fear of "the world" that colors your perspective so that you see demons and gods under every rock.I have no fear of men. I have no fear of 'the world.' Neither do I fear any demon, since I have victory over all evil. The perspective of someone who is washed in The Blood of The Lamb and who has on The Armor of God is enlightening and encouraging. We are meant to be an encouragement to others, as well. This Sword (The Word of God) that we carry is more powerfull than anything in this world, or the next. Every knee bows before The Name of Jesus, Who is The Head of all principality and power, and has all of the governement of this world, as well as Heaven, firmly placed upon His Shoulders.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel
If I didn't tell you the truth, The Lord might require your blood by my hand. I don't want that. I prefer that you get saved, but can't make that decision for you.Didn't say that they were, only that you're serving them, and promoting them.[/quote]You certainly claim to know a lot about this atheist you've probably never even met...

I understand that they are false, but apparently you don't.They are what they are, but they are not gods.... unless you have a very unusual defintion of god... :think:

You believe that you are not worshipping at all, and yet you are worshipping a false 'god' (or several) all day long, 24 / 7.Wrong again. The closest thing I have to "worship" is the admiration and love I feel for my wife. I certainly don't care in that manner for anything else...

(edited typos - :doh: - Z)

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
You certainly claim to know a lot about this atheist you've probably never even met...One can only read so much of your drivel, until one has one's 'fill' of it. I have read a mountain of your pitiable posts.They are what they are, but they are not gods.... unless you have a very unusual defintion of god...Anything which you place in a higher place in your heart than The Lord is your 'god.' The falseness of them is obvious, since there is Only One God, but having false 'gods' which are designed to take the place of The Lord in your heart and in your attention, that is the work of the enemy. He causes you to believe that these (false 'gods,' such as your head-knowledge and your vain philosophy) are all that there is, and that there is no God, but he is lying. The Truth is not in him. Wrong again. The closest thing I have to "worship" is the admiration and love I feel for my wife. I certainly don't care in that manner for anything else...You demonstrate otherwise, since you don't worship The Lord Your God. You show that you worship yourself and your own ideas above Him and reject knowledge of The Truth. You either serve The Lord or you serve the devil. The devil will allow you to worship yourself or him, or any other false 'god' that you wish, but he does not want you to come to a knowledge of The Truth, which is foolishness to you, since you are perishing.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel
One can only read so much of your drivel, until one has one's 'fill' of it. I have read a mountain of your pitiable posts.Why bother, if you think it's such drivel? :think:

Anything which you place in a higher place in your heart than The Lord is your 'god.'Not for an atheist. We don't beileve in gods, of any kind. :thumb:

You either serve The Lord or you serve the devil.That's alright I don't believe in either one of them. I "serve" my fellow man, not the phantasmic imaginings of bedouin goat herders...

[Dimo]

Aimiel posted to Zakath:

If I didn't tell you the truth, The Lord might require your blood by my hand. I don't want that. I prefer that you get saved, but can't make that decision for you.

Dimo:

Has the Lord required you to kill other people whom you have not shared your truth with?

Aimiel, I thought once you were on the right path. After reading this statement I have serious doubts.

[Aussie Thinker]

Dimo…

You have serious doubts !!!

I was willing to assume Aimiel as just a regular fundy Christian but when he posted that bit about the blood.. whoah… I thought.. SERIOUS NUTBAG !

This is the sort of guy who believes in Demons.. I guess that only adds weight to the ridiculousness of that idea !

[CryTears]

Originally posted by granite1010

Cry also believes the Jews killed Kennedy and started every war in human history. Go figure.

and granite does not bat an eye at the title of this post
if I would have had said "Jewish ritualistic murder"

OH MY the HOW LE LULA'S on my knee's fanning myself LAWDY!
PASS the blood libel labels on my!

see the difference?
and I Have no reason to take sides except as a Christian I hate to see groups slandered by other groups FOR ISRAEL Wars!

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Flipper

Well, yeah. Exactly.

Ted Turner. Generally not recognized for being Jewish.

Before their 1996 merger, Turner and Time Warner were both global television powers with the TNT/Cartoon Network and Warner channels, drawing upon their respective large libraries of cartoons and motion pictures. Now these channels will be redeployed to better utilize each other's resources, with plans being drawn up to develop several more global cable channels to take advantage of the world's largest film, television and cartoon libraries.

Time Warner selected holdings
Majority interest in WB, a U.S. television network launched in 1995 to provide a distribution platform for Time Warner films and programs. It is carried on the Tribune Company's 16 U.S. television stations, which reach 25 percent of U.S. TV households;
Significant interests in non-U.S. broadcasting joint ventures;
The largest cable system in the United States, controlling 22 of the largest 100 markets;
Several U.S. and global cable television channels, including CNN, Headline News, CNNfn, TBS, TNT, Turner Classic Movies, The Cartoon Network and CNN-SI (a cross-production with Sports Illustrated);
Partial ownership of the cable channel Comedy Central and a controlling stake in Court TV;
HBO and Cinemax pay cable channels;
Minority stake in PrimeStar, U.S. satellite television service;
Warner Brothers and New Line Cinema film studios;
More than 1,000 movie screens outside of the United States;
A library of over 6,000 films, 25,000 television programs, books, music and thousands of cartoons;
Twenty-four magazines, including Time, People and Sports Illustrated;
Fifty percent of DC Comics, publisher of Superman, Batman and 60 other titles;
The second largest book-publishing business in the world, including Time-Life Books (42 percent of sales outside of the United States) and the Book-of-the-Month Club;
Warner Music Group, one of the largest global music businesses with nearly 60 percent of revenues from outside the United States;
Six Flags theme park chain; The Atlanta Hawks and Atlanta Braves professional sports teams; Retail stores, including over 150 Warner Bros. stores and Turner Retail Group; Minority interests in toy companies Atari and Hasbro.

[CryTears]

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/cnn/1103/24music.html

[CryTears]

TAKES OFF. Voice-over-Internet protocol finally made a splash in 2003, after the technology had baked for the last eight years or so. It's still in the early-adopter phase, but with December announcements by AT&T, Qwest Communications, and

Time Warner Cable (part of CNN's parent company Time Warner Inc.) that they're looking to roll out the technology,


VOIP will really hit its stride in 2004. The monoliths moving into the market should lift all boats, including smaller, pioneering firms such as 8x8 and Vonage. Though consumers will migrate to the services at a steady clip, corporations will lead the way, stampeding as they upgrade their older telecommunications infrastructures to the cost-saving VOIP.

[CryTears]

http://www.nydailynews.com/business/story/146928p-129737c.html

[CryTears]

as of 2004 how does democracy and freedom of the press work if the media is owned by a handful of individuals?

Under the proposed deal, unveiled officially yesterday, Vivendi would merge the Universal Pictures movie studio, its television-production group, three cable networks and the Universal theme parks with NBC. GE would own 80% of the new U.S. media giant and Vivendi roughly 20%.

Vivendi's board picked GE as its exclusive negotiating partner at a meeting yesterday, a week after selecting GE and an investor group led by Seagram heir Edgar Bronfman Jr. for further negotiations. Mr. Bronfman's group, which included Cablevision Systems Corp. and some private-equity firms, had emerged as GE's main rival in the auction after other bidders, such as Liberty Media Corp. and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Inc., dropped out.

Mr. Bronfman's group offered a much more cash-rich deal valued around $13 billion, including roughly $9 billion in cash and assumption of debt. But the company to emerge from this deal would have had a lot more debt than NBC Universal, and as Vivendi would have kept a significant stake in the company, the higher debt level was an issue, said a person familiar with the situation. Vivendi is betting that the deal with NBC would yield a bigger value over time from possible synergies among the combined assets.

[CryTears]

© 2004 Cable News Network LP, LLLP.
A Time Warner Company. All Rights Reserved.
Terms under which this service is provided to you.
Read

from the cnn.com site.

[CryTears]

then hang out in israel give each other awards (http://www.thejewishweek.com/news/newscontent.php3?artid=6249)

[CryTears]

Larry Zeigler aka larry king
but I do think he is usually fair.

[CryTears]

aaron brown "we loosely follow torah" a reformed Jew. (http://www.kstatecollegian.com/stories/111202/new_jewish.shtml)

[Zakath]

How did a thread on Islamic ritualism turn into a "Jews on Parade" thread???

Crybaby strikes again! :(

I'm waiting to see why the Jews are responsible for the deaths during the Hajj. That would actually be germaine to the topic. :think:

[CryTears]

cnn wolf blitzer jewish maybe a dual citizen of israel, too lazy to look, and does it really matter?
home is where the heart is.


Annotated Bibliography of Wolf Blitzer

Alpha Epsilon Pi National Headquarters
(http://www.aepihq.org/otherinfo/famous.html)
AEPi is a national jewish fraternity. The web site has a thourough
listing of notable alumni. It also lists the year they graduated
and which school they attended

[Zakath]

You might ask yourself, does anybody else really care?

Israel is a secular state, not a religious theocracy or even a theonomy. It's merely another country that has capitalized on the U.S. evangelical Christian community's gullibility as a fund raising tool.

[CryTears]

judith woodward (http://www.jfedbflo.com/CampaignKickoffDinner.htm)

do ya think cnn might be a bit bias yet?

[CryTears]

andrea mitchell and her husband
guess who her husband is?

[Zakath]

Mr. Mitchell? ;)

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Zakath

Mr. Mitchell? ;)

nope! good guess tho starts with a G. has to do with money.

did I already say Ted Koppel is Jewish?

[CryTears]

when lonely ted turner tried to be fair

CNN UNDER PRESSURE
The CNN cave-in came after more than a week of renewed Israeli pressure and threats over its alleged 'pro-Palestinian' bias.

The latest accusations were sparked by comments made by CNN founder Ted Turner saying that by targeting and killing innocent civilians, both Israelis and Palestinians were using "terrorism."

These statements were followed by threats from Israel's main cable TV distributor "Yes" to pull the plug on CNN, as well as on the BBC, also accused of bias. Israel's Communications minister Reuven Rivlin, was quoted in Ha'aretz saying that he would "not object" to such a blatant measure of blackmail and censorship against the international media.

. Alon Pinkas, Israel's Consul-General in New York, who sometimes appears on US television six or seven times per day, said in an interview in Ha'aretz that:

"CNN has different stations. There were certain coverage problems with CNN International, which is what people in Israel see. The American CNN, in contrast, is balanced, and so is CNN Headline News, which is more informative. I ran into Walter Isaacson, the president of CNN, at a social event, and he told me that they are aware of the criticism and are trying to keep things balanced, and he asked for my opinion. I monitor the programs of Aaron Brown, Paula Zahn, Larry King and `Crossfire.' No one can tell me that there is a pro-Palestinian bias on those programs."

Balanced? HA!
they still complain when they are 99% of the guests and owners and anchors.

but then sometimes you can part a sea for people and they still complain. :)

[Gerald]

cry, two words: Go Away!

If all you're going to do is screech about the Evil Satanic Jews Who Secretly Run The World™, take it somewhere else.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Dimo

Aimiel posted to Zakath:

If I didn't tell you the truth, The Lord might require your blood by my hand. I don't want that. I prefer that you get saved, but can't make that decision for you.

Dimo:

Has the Lord required you to kill other people whom you have not shared your truth with?

Aimiel, I thought once you were on the right path. After reading this statement I have serious doubts. Dimo,

Maybe you should read your Bible more often:

Ezekiel 3:18
When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker
I was willing to assume Aimiel as just a regular fundy Christian but when he posted that bit about the blood.. whoah… I thought.. SERIOUS NUTBAG !Yes, the preaching of the cross is foolishness to them that are perishing. This is the sort of guy who believes in Demons.. I guess that only adds weight to the ridiculousness of that idea ! We will all answer for every idle word that we have ever spoken, and every person that Christians don't witness to, though they had chance to do so, The Lord will require the blood of that guilty person by the hand of the one that did not warn them of their fate.

Ezekiel 3:18
When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

[Aussie Thinker]

Amiel,

You are a CHRISTIAN.. not a Jew !

Why is it you pluck ridiculous Old Testament quotes to support your bloodthirsty evangelism. Stick with what Jesus would have said.

Christ himself was a good bloke and a pacifist. He renounced much of the old bloodthirsty OT.. if he were alive today he would be disgusted at your reversion to ancient bronze age barbarism

Asylums are full of people who “God” required “blood from their hands”..

You are a truly scary one !

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker
You are a CHRISTIAN.. not a Jew !I am a Jew, by adoption. Jesus' blood has caused me to be adopted by my Father, God, as His Own Son.Why is it you pluck ridiculous Old Testament quotes to support your bloodthirsty evangelism. Stick with what Jesus would have said.Where do you see me thirsting for blood? Your lack of understanding is showing.Christ himself was a good bloke and a pacifist.He is also The Lion of the tribe of Judah. He will destroy all of His Enemies, when He comes to earth the second time.He renounced much of the old bloodthirsty OT.. On the contrary, Jesus said, "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."if he were alive today he would be disgusted at your reversion to ancient bronze age barbarismHe is alive, and He lives in me. What do you think I have displayed which you have decided is 'barbaric?' Asylums are full of people who “God” required “blood from their hands”..God will require the lost (those that Christians had chances to witness to, and didn't) by the hands of those who ignored their plight. That is all that The Word implies. You have an over-active imagination.

[Dimo]

Aimiel posted:

Dimo,

Maybe you should read your Bible more often:

Ezekiel 3:18
When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

Dimo:

I have read the Bible from cover to cover at least 100 times. I am well aware of all the verses that can be twisted to justify anyone's opinions and actions when those verses are not taken in context with the whole Bible.

Aimiel, do you intend to kill all the wicked people in this world?

Oh the irony. And on a thread about fundamentalist muslims and how they believe they have the right to do all these crazy things based on their interpretation of the Quran.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

I am a Jew, by adoption. To be a Jew, one must follow the Law or one is apostate, in rebellion to YHWH and potentially subject to death. Which of the Mosaic laws do you follow, as a good Jew?

[Dimo]

Aimiel posted:

He is also The Lion of the tribe of Judah. He will destroy all of His Enemies, when He comes to earth the second time.

Dimo:

With this I agree. Just make sure that you have not made yourself his enemy by not following the example of his first coming.

[Dimo]

Aimiel posted:

God will require the lost (those that Christians had chances to witness to, and didn't) by the hands of those who ignored their plight. That is all that The Word implies. You have an over-active imagination.

Dimo:

What exactly is witnessing? In Jesus's time most people were illiterate and therefore could not read scripture. And in many cases were not allowed to because they were not Jews. In modern times many people are literate and have access to the Bible. It seems that evangelism has become obsolete. At least in most cases where we see "fundamentalists" trying to force their interpretation of the Bible down the throats of literate and open minded people from western european cultures.

Aimiel perhaps you should take your "evangelism" to Asia or Africa, where it is needed.

[Aussie Thinker]

Dimo,

For your own God's sake don't inflict Amiel on those poor supertitious souls in Africa... they already kill children who have "demons" in them.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker

Dimo,

For your own God's sake inflict Amiel on those poor supertitious souls in Africa... they already kill children who have "demons" in them. Aussie,
Is that post perhaps missing a word? :think:

[Aussie Thinker]

Zak...

LOL.. that was theologian slip.. I have edited to add in the DONT...

[Zakath]

:thumb:

For a moment there I thought I needed new glasses... :cool:

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Zakath

How did a thread on Islamic ritualism turn into a "Jews on Parade" thread???

Crybaby strikes again! :(

I'm waiting to see why the Jews are responsible for the deaths during the Hajj. That would actually be germaine to the topic. :think:

what is the Hajj?

[BillyBob]

Originally posted by crytahvn

what is the Hajj?


That is what you are! Oh, I thought you said 'Hagg'.

Never mind.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Gerald

cry, two words: Go Away!

If all you're going to do is screech about the Evil Satanic Jews Who Secretly Run The World™, take it somewhere else. :cry: :cry:
I am pointing out the divide and conquer mentality the media has, have I posted a lie? I said they own CNN and that they would be biased, then accused of being a liar, so I was showing why I think that.
Is truth evil?
If Islam owned our media would you not think if they had their side to tell, we would be seeing a different slant?
On the otherside of it, as an American I resent the airways being owned by only a few.
If it were French or Spanish, or Irish, or anyone else, the complaint would remain, or even one sect of our society, all Christians, etc. in fact is that not the very complaint that was used in the past? "white"people had all the movies on and blacks complained? When black people complained, funny they were not labeled racists and haters.

[CryTears]

Zaketh
Is amiel talking about me?

[CryTears]

Originally posted by BillyBob

That is what you are! Oh, I thought you said 'Hagg'.

Never mind. :cry: :cry:

[BillyBob]

Oh, I'm sorry. I meant 'Jew Hating Hagg'.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by BillyBob

Oh, I'm sorry. I meant 'Jew Hating Hagg'. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

oh wait
it is beezelbub talking. trying to keep me from saving Jews.

[BillyBob]

Are you saving Jews?

What are you saving them from?

[CryTears]

Originally posted by BillyBob

Are you saving Jews?

What are you saving them from?

satan, you, and hell.
oh same thing:)

[BillyBob]

Is your mission to save Jews? :noway:

[Zakath]

Originally posted by crytahvn
Zaketh
Is amiel talking about me? I read through his posts here and honestly couldn't tell that he was, but perhaps if you asked him to clarify... :think:

[Aussie Thinker]

Crytahvn

Who or what is Beezelbub ?.. hehehe

Wasn’t he in a movie ? Starring Michael Keaton ?

LOL…Like my spelling is great anyway…

I think you meant Beelzebub.. he another fictional Bible hero.. or something !

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Zakath

I read through his posts here and honestly couldn't tell that he was, but perhaps if you asked him to clarify... :think:

thanks for looking.
I would but he doesnt talk to me.
But I was wondering if he was talking about me.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Aussie Thinker

Crytahvn

Who or what is Beezelbub ?.. hehehe

Wasn’t he in a movie ? Starring Michael Keaton ?

LOL…Like my spelling is great anyway…

I think you meant Beelzebub.. he another fictional Bible hero.. or something !

yeah that is who I meant, I think billybob is aka for beezlebub.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by BillyBob

Is your mission to save Jews? :noway:

yep and Christians, what a job I have! at least I have a job!
payment is heaven :) for eternity,
where will you be for eternity?

Now I know how Pandora felt when she opened the box of bugs.
I am thinking of changing my name to Pandora.
I also know how Eve felt when she bit the apple.
Pandora Eve
Eve Pandora
which one sounds better?

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Dimo
Aimiel, do you intend to kill all the wicked people in this world?No, but when Jesus returns to this planet, the blood of His enemies will be as high as the horses' bridles, in the valley of Meggido.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

No, but when Jesus returns to this planet, the blood of His enemies will be as high as the horses' bridles, in the valley of Meggido. Looking forward to revenge, are you? :think:

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Dimo
What exactly is witnessing?Testifying to someone of God's Love for them, in the form of Jesus, Who died for their sins. Leading them to the cross, if they are ready to receive Him.In Jesus's time most people were illiterate and therefore could not read scripture.I believe that is a large part of the reason that Paul instructed them to deliver The Gospel to the Jews first, and then to the gentiles.And in many cases were not allowed to because they were not Jews.In Jesus' time, the Romans were in charge of most of the civilized world, and didn't have any laws against reading or teaching someone to read.In modern times many people are literate and have access to the Bible.There are too many that are shielded by 'civilization' from The Gospel, and never hear the message of the cross.It seems that evangelism has become obsolete.Not until every soul has heard God's Good News will the message be complete. Even then, we will keep preaching it, until all those who will receive Christ should be grafted into The Body.At least in most cases where we see "fundamentalists" trying to force their interpretation of the Bible down the throats of literate and open minded people from western european cultures.That doesn't sound very 'open-minded.'Aimiel perhaps you should take your "evangelism" to Asia or Africa, where it is needed. I believe that America needs evangelism, maybe even more so than many other places in the world.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by crytahvn
I would but he doesnt talk to me.What on earth makes you think that?But I was wondering if he was talking about me. Not that I'm aware of.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
Looking forward to revenge, are you?Although vengance belongs to The Lord, as He said that it does, the act of slaying the enemies arrayed against Him and against His People (converted Jews, preaching The Gospel) on that day, IMHO, will not be revenge-minded. The Lord will spend seven years opening the windows of Heaven, revealing The Mystery of God to all the world, due to the darkness that tries to cover the earth, to prevent men from being saved. He will have to pour out His Judgement over those seven years, because of His Patience with sin coming to an end. To be kept from having to live on this earth during those seven years is a very sweet reward to look forward to, but, to answer your question, no, I don't seek anyone's death, or delight in the death, injury, illness or torment of one single soul. I would that all men might be saved. I know that all will not believe, but hope and pray that all might. Someone being killed or injured is never funny to me, and I hate even portrayals by Hollywood which try to get people to laugh at the injury of someone, which IMHO causes people's conscience to be seared with a hot iron. I also don't want anyone to go to hell, and wish to deliver myself from the judgement that their salvation might have hinged upon my unspoken testimony. He that wins souls is wise. I'm trying to be as wise as possible.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Aimiel

What on earth makes you think that?Not that I'm aware of.

calling dr zaketh calling dr zaketh come right away
i will agree to take your poison now
need a med adjustment





:noid:

It was all in my head!

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

Although vengance belongs to The Lord, as He said that it does, the act of slaying the enemies arrayed against Him and against His People (converted Jews, preaching The Gospel) on that day, IMHO, will not be revenge-minded. So the butchery will be cold and calculated? That's small comfort. :rolleyes:

Sorry, I do not believe in your story.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by crytahvn

calling dr zaketh calling dr zaketh come right awayThat's Zakath. :rolleyes:

...need a med adjustment Why am I not surprised? :chuckle:

[Gerald]

Originally posted by Aimiel
I know that all will not believe, but hope and pray that all might.

<snip>

I'm trying to be as wise as possible.
Continuing to cling to a vain hope is hardly a sign of wisdom...

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Zakath

That's Zakath. :rolleyes:

Why am I not surprised? :chuckle:

Now I should have known that spelling! Afterall I devoted a thread to it!

now about those pills:noid:

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
Sorry, I do not believe in your story. Apology accepted. I only wish God might forgive such a foolish oversight so easily.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

Apology accepted. I only wish God might forgive such a foolish oversight so easily. It makes no difference since he's only imaginary anyway. :D

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
It makes no difference since he's only imaginary anyway.One of us might be right. If you're right, I will have wasted much of my time in this life, no great loss. If I'm right, though, you'll have a very long time to regret being so casual toward God, and dismissing Him so easily; in fact, eternity. There is a much greater cost in the balance: your soul.

[Gerald]

Originally posted by Aimiel

One of us might be right. If you're right, I will have wasted much of my time in this life, no great loss. If I'm right, though, you'll have a very long time to regret being so casual toward God, and dismissing Him so easily; in fact, eternity. There is a much greater cost in the balance: your soul. Ah. Pascal's Wager. Again.

Now, if you can provide evidence supporting the notion that souls actually exist...

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel
One of us might be right. If you're right, I will have wasted much of my time in this life, no great loss. If I'm right, though, you'll have a very long time to regret being so casual toward God, and dismissing Him so easily; in fact, eternity. There is a much greater cost in the balance: your soul.

I gave up arguing Pascal's false dichotomy years ago. It's been done excellently many other times... :D

In an nutshell, who says that your religion's right and every other religion on the planet in 5,000 years of recorded history is wrong? :)

For the atheist has to choose not from a single dichotomy, but from among thousands of competing claims...

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Gerald

Ah. Pascal's Wager. Again.

Now, if you can provide evidence supporting the notion that souls actually exist...

I already told you I was there. I cannot prove where I was, but I was.
Do you not think it is an act of fate that we should meet here on this big wide world of internet?:)
God is trying to send you messages you just won't listen.
I am your gift from God, yet you reject me.:cry: :cry:

[Gerald]

Originally posted by crytahvn
I already told you I was there. I cannot prove where I was, but I was.Already told me you were where?
Do you not think it is an act of fate that we should meet here on this big wide world of internet?:)Small problem: the probability for events that have already happened is 1.00.
God is trying to send you messages...This has yet to be conclusively demonstrated.
...you just won't listen.I have no compelling reason to.
I am your gift from God...Now you're being presumptuous.
...yet you reject me.:cry: :cry:Awwww, you're breaking my heart...oh, wait, I don't have one.
:cool:

[BillyBob]

:chuckle:

[Zakath]

Originally posted by crytahvn
God is trying to send you messages you just won't listen.
I am your gift from God, yet you reject me.:cry: :cry: You're all the better he can do?
:darwinsm:

What kind of two-bit deity do you represent, anyway?

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath
I gave up arguing Pascal's false dichotomy years ago. It's been done excellently many other times... In an nutshell, who says that your religion's right and every other religion on the planet in 5,000 years of recorded history is wrongReligions are man-made, and are a dime-a-dozen, or less. The Lord spells out how to come into a realtionship with Him, in His Word, The Bible. One of the greatest proofs that The Bible is The Word of God, is its accuracy of recorded history. It is the most accurate record of ancient history on the planet, and has been corrobberated as such, many times; the most recently of which is the finding of the Dead Sea scrolls.

[Aimiel]

Originally posted by Zakath

You're all the better he can do?

What kind of two-bit deity do you represent, anyway? One that choses the foolish things of this world to confound the 'wise.' One that makes use of cracked pots and even crackpots.

[okinrus]

Pascal's wager can be defended quite well due to the nature of infinity. Unless if their was an infinite number of religions, which there cannot be due to the finite nature of the human mind, Pascal's wager is valid, though it is impractical at finding which religion to choose from. The extent of the theology is that belief in the existence of God is necessary or beneficial to avoid hell. Either hell exists or it doesn't, and if hell exist then it's beneficial to believe in the existence of God. However, despite the original formulation by Pascal, there's no assumption here beyond this. The formulation breaks down with respect to logic due to the anomaly that belief in the existence of God could be an impediment to achieving heaven, not because of the many religions! Our intuitive notion of God would suggest that this is unlikely, though the demons know that God exists and weap.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Aimiel

One that choses the foolish things of this world to confound the 'wise.' One that makes use of cracked pots and even crackpots. I'm glad you said that, not me. :)

[Zakath]

Originally posted by okinrus

Pascal's wager can be defended quite well due to the nature of infinity. Unless if their was an infinite number of religions, which there cannot be due to the finite nature of the human mind, Pascal's wager is valid, though it is impractical at finding which religion to choose from. The extent of the theology is that belief in the existence of God is necessary or beneficial to avoid hell. Either hell exists or it doesn't, and if hell exist then it's beneficial to believe in the existence of God. However, despite the original formulation by Pascal, there's no assumption here beyond this. The formulation breaks down with respect to logic due to the anomaly that belief in the existence of God could be an impediment to achieving heaven, not because of the many religions! Our intuitive notion of God would suggest that this is unlikely, though the demons know that God exists and weap.

Pascal's wager is invalid as a false dichotomy since it assumes there are only two choices: the religoin supported by the speaker using the "wager" or doom. This ignores the observable fact that there are a number of alternatives to the speaker's religion. I've heard it used by Hindus and Muslims as well as Christians; each one assuming their religion was the only one inconsideration.

[Zakath]

double post - sorry

[CryTears]

personally I like bright colors over pascal's and I use a crockpot all the time but does that make me bad?

[Zakath]

Originally posted by crytahvn

personally I like bright colors over pascal's and I use a crockpot all the time but does that make me bad? As long as you don't make a dichotomy out of it, no problem. :thumb:

[CryTears]

:D

[Gerald]

One who would pun would pick a pocket...

[okinrus]

Pascal's wager is invalid as a false dichotomy since it assumes there are only two choices: the religoin supported by the speaker using the "wager" or doom. This ignores the observable fact that there are a number of alternatives to the speaker's religion. I've heard it used by Hindus and Muslims as well as Christians; each one assuming their religion was the only one inconsideration.

Pascal's audience were mainly Catholics who became atheists, so it was rather natural for him to assume the Catholic faith. But if it is restated to be -- there are only two choices: to believe in either the existence of God or gods, or to not believe in the existence of God -- Pascal's wager is still somewhat valid. In fact, the difficulty does not lie in the number of religions, though the ones that do not believe in an eternal resting place of either hell or heaven is another difficulty.

We also have to place everything in perspective. Pascal's wager is not a mathematical reason to believe in God, but rather, it gleams light on why someone should search for God. Although one could dismiss Pascal's wager due to the intuitive assumptions it makes, that's besides the point. In addition, some religions can be rejected right due to spurious claims or having no historical basis.

First, I will give cost analysis if God or gods do not exist. Assume that God or gods do not exist. Then, ultimately belief in God(s) has an equivalent result to those who have disbelief. Although atheists may claim a finite benefit to be able to do what they like, this has gone the wayside in latter years. Clearly, most atheists are no more or less ethical than the populace at large, and Christians(and most other religions) nonetheless would believe that there are advantages to believing in this world. Namely, trust, love, and hope far outweigh non-belief. Consequently, let's just conclude this is a draw.

Now, on the other hand, assume that God exists and that one religion out of the possible finite collection of religions, some self-created, is correct. The difficulty here is that for many religions, worshiping many gods is comparitively worse than worshiping no gods. Nevertheless, most pagan traditions are not exclusive. If someone worships a god outside of the gods in existence, the gods don't damn that person. But monotheistic are. An atheist has a better chance than someone who worships Satan. But many monotheist religions such as Muslims would include Christians and Jews with those not destined to damnation, despite what fanaticals of their religion may say. Thus, let's just assume, like Pascal, that everyone who holds the incorrect theologies are damned or in some equal state. In this case, then, believing in the existence of God(s) is much better than not believing due to the finite collection of religions. The final cost analysis would give something like p * (1/n) * benefit where n is the finite number of religions and p is a finite probabilty of God(s) existing.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by okinrus

Pascal's audience were mainly Catholics who became atheists, so it was rather natural for him to assume the Catholic faith. But if it is restated to be -- there are only two choices: to believe in either the existence of God or gods, or to not believe in the existence of God -- Pascal's wager is still somewhat valid. In fact, the difficulty does not lie in the number of religions, though the ones that do not believe in an eternal resting place of either hell or heaven is another difficulty. The problem is not that the logic of Pascal's statement is flawed, it is the underlying presupposition that is flawed. You've illustrated my point well.

We also have to place everything in perspective. Pascal's wager is not a mathematical reason to believe in God, but rather, it gleams light on why someone should search for God. Although one could dismiss Pascal's wager due to the intuitive assumptions it makes, that's besides the point. In addition, some religions can be rejected right due to spurious claims or having no historical basis.It is the very intuitive assumptions that invalidate it as a false dichotomy. Only when all the other choices but the two he proposes have been eliminated does it cease being logically flawed. That's the problem that most apologists refuse do deal with...

First, I will give cost analysis if God or gods do not exist. Assume that God or gods do not exist. Then, ultimately belief in God(s) has an equivalent result to those who have disbelief. Not necessarily. Some persons derive psychological and social benefits from religious belief and association that are not available, generally, to atheists. Those benefits should be factored into the equation. On the other hand, atheists are not generally given to supporting religious activities with thier time, labor, and other resources. Freeing those resources for other uses may benefit both the atheist and their community. Those factors should also be included.

Although atheists may claim a finite benefit to be able to do what they like, this has gone the wayside in latter years. How so? Most atheists of my acquaintance would not "do what they like" in opposition to society (i.e. engage in antisocial behavior like murder, rape, kidnapping, extortion, etc.).

Clearly, most atheists are no more or less ethical than the populace at large...A point argued against frequently by fundamentalists of a variety of religions.

... and Christians(and most other religions) nonetheless would believe that there are advantages to believing in this world. Namely, trust, love, and hope far outweigh non-belief. For some individuals, this may be true. For me, and many atheists, it's not true. We too, experience hope, trust, and love. It is merely that, for atheists like me, the objects of those emotions are not deities or other supernatural manifestations.

Consequently, let's just conclude this is a draw.What, the moral argument? If it's a draw, then there is no advantage on either side and you've effectively elminated one of the claimed benefits to society of religion... :think:

Now, on the other hand, assume that God exists and that one religion out of the possible finite collection of religions, some self-created, is correct. The difficulty here is that for many religions, worshiping many gods is comparitively worse than worshiping no gods. I'm not sure where you get that idea. There are only three mono-theistic religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam - and Jews and Muslims have their doubts about Christian claims of monotheism). Jews, Christians, and Muslims make up slightly less than half the world's estimated population. The rest of the world's religions are mainly polytheistic or dualist.

Nevertheless, most pagan traditions are not exclusive. If someone worships a god outside of the gods in existence, the gods don't damn that person. But monotheistic are. An atheist has a better chance than someone who worships Satan. Again, you are not citing a source for this belief. Christians generally fall into two groups - the "black and white" believers and those who allow for "gray". The first group believe that everyone is either saved or damned. Period. The second group believe that their diety makes allowances for circumstances and that there is some undetermined group who are not either black or white but somewhere indeterminate, or grey.

But many monotheist religions such as Muslims would include Christians and Jews with those not destined to damnation, despite what fanaticals of their religion may say. Again, that varies depending on how fundamentalist they are. The fundamentalists of each group claim that all members of the other groups are damned.

Thus, let's just assume, like Pascal, that everyone who holds the incorrect theologies are damned or in some equal state. In this case, then, believing in the existence of God(s) is much better than not believing due to the finite collection of religions. The final cost analysis would give something like p * (1/n) * benefit where n is the finite number of religions and p is a finite probabilty of God(s) existing. So let me try my hand at the math...

As a conservative number, there are more than 33,000 candidate religious groups (there are more than 33,000 sects of Christianity alone) worldwide.

The probability of a given deity's existence is either 1 or 0 since s/he either exists or not.

Given the best case scenario where we've somehow conclusively proven the deity exists (p=1) and have not proven a specific religion, the "cost" of picking wrong would be:

1/33,000 * 1 = 0.0000303

Given the worst case scenario, where we've conclusively proven that deity does not exist (p=0) the "cost of pickig wrong would be:

1/33,000 * 0 = 0

So the range of cost would be somewhere between zero and 3 X 10**(-5) or 3/1000ths of a percent.

Either way the "cost" appears very low... :D

[okinrus]

It is the very intuitive assumptions that invalidate it as a false dichotomy. Only when all the other choices but the two he proposes have been eliminated does it cease being logically flawed. That's the problem that most apologists refuse do deal with...

Yes, but hopefully most atheist can reject a few of the more culty religions. Not that I would assume that you don't believe Christianity is a cult.


Christians generally fall into two groups - the "black and white" believers and those who allow for "gray". The first group believe that everyone is either saved or damned. Period. The second group believe that their diety makes allowances for circumstances and that there is some undetermined group who are not either black or white but somewhere indeterminate, or grey.

No, I'm quite certain that there is no grey on this issue, though there are mitigating factors. Judgement based completely on circumstance leads to a void theology where individual human behavior through God cannot change someone's spiritual life and thus judgement.


The probability of a given deity's existence is either 1 or 0 since s/he either exists or not.

Sorry, I forgot to mention that in Pascal's original formulation he said that the probabilty of God existing was not 0. Loosely speaking, the probabilty is not a real probability, but based upon the individual's expectation of the existence of God. Atheist A may think that the probability of himself being wrong is .0001, while atheist B may think that the probability of himself being wrong is .1. There are few strong atheist so this is not a problem. It is, in fact, impossible for the probabilty to be 0 or 1 because we only have finite number of events in our life. Assuming that this finite number of events is against the existence of God, and you have a very near 0 number.

[CryTears]

Originally posted by Gerald

One who would pun would pick a pocket...

“Any man who would make such an execrable pun would not scruple to pick my pocket”

but I think more often than not, your version holds true, just not in my case. :)

[Karaite]

Originally posted by CryTears

satan, you, and hell.
oh same thing:)

In that case, I'm looking foward to hell! BillyBob, you'd better have a good selection of Kosher foods!

[Karaite]

Originally posted by CryTears
I am your gift from God

God isn't that cruel

[CryTears]

Thank-you TOL!:rain: :thumb:

this person is on your ignore list

[CryTears]

Is Zakath an Anti-Christianite?


What's the difference between a fundamentalist Christian and a paranoid schizophrenic?

One person hears voices, is convinced his thoughts and actions are known to some outside power, thinks the world was designed and created for him and that he is central to everything that goes on, is sure he is part of a special divine mission, believes that ordinary everyday events have some special transcendent meaning visible only to him, sometimes speaks in babbling incoherent voices, and believes supernatural forces are at work to influence his actions.

And the other one, of course, is a paranoid schizophrenic.

Or is he saying that seculars and other religions are the paranoid schizophrenics?

[Gerald]

Who are you, and what have you done with the real cry?
:noid:

[CryTears]

whistle for trigger, fingers to lips, whislte won't work, yells "here Trigger!" we are out of here.

[Gerald]

Originally posted by CryTears

whistle for trigger, fingers to lips, whislte won't work, yells "here Trigger!" we are out of here. :: notes that punctuation and spelling have returned to normal ::

Who was that masked...er...goat...?

[CryTears]

:(

because I have to go do goat work,
I am in a hurry

flip that sentence :up:

meet me at the old mine shaft;)