Aren't Aware of Transgenders? Try Public School

[Nineveh]

A transgender advocacy group announced it is teaming up with two homosexual advocacy groups to raise awareness about violence against transgender people -- and to move the issue into America's public schools.

The 6th annual Transgender Day of Remembrance will be held on November 20th, 2004, "to honor those who might otherwise have been missed by the media, as well as to draw attention to this continuing problem," said the event's organizer announced.

Gwendolyn Ann Smith, founder of the Transgender Day of Remembrance, said the event continues to grow; and this year, the Gay, Lesbian, Straight Educators Network (GLSEN) and the Gay-Straight Alliance Network are joining the Transgender Day of Remembrance as sponsors.

"I am very excited to work with GLSEN and the GSA Network, as they will help this event make it into middle and high schools," Smith said in a press release.

"With more and more young victims showing up, if we can reach people at a younger age and explain that this violence is unacceptable, the better our chances at reducing this violence," Smith added.

Smith said violence against transgender people is a long-term problem: "Even if you are not hearing much about it in the media, there are still anti-transgender murders happening, and they are continuing to happen at a little more than one every month."

GLSEN sponsors a "Day of Silence" in April, when students from middle school to college observe a vow of silence to protest discrimination and harassment against homosexuals.cite (http://www.cnsnews.com///Culture/archive/200410/CUL20041028c.html)

[cattyfan]

I don't support violence against anyone...but I don't approve of this issue in the schools, either. If they have to do something, why not make it a day against ALL violence?

[brother Willi]

Originally posted by cattyfan

I don't support violence against anyone...but I don't approve of this issue in the schools, either. If they have to do something, why not make it a day against ALL violence?
would that include transgender Muslims?

[cattyfan]

It wouldn't include anything specific, hence the use of "ALL." It would be against violence in the schools...preventing violence against someone for religion, for being over-weight, for being a math geek, for being a particular religion..."All"

get it?

[brother Willi]

Originally posted by cattyfan

It wouldn't include anything specific, hence the use of "ALL." It would be against violence in the schools...preventing violence against someone for religion, for being over-weight, for being a math geek, for being a particular religion..."All"

get it?

Well, if I may please, lets open up this thught and narrow it down. Instead of one day at school, how about one day between all people everywhere? How about one day for Osama BinLaden to explain himself? How about one day for brother Willi?

[brother Willi]

bark

[Free-Agent Smith]

I'm not going to advocate violence either but let's try a bit of reality for a moment.....

A guy gets half the "treatment" he needs to become a man. So we call him a transgender because his surgery isn't complete but he still continues his life as if he was a woman. Let's say for the sake of arguement, that his "look" is very convincing. Since he is also changing his sex to resemble a female, I will assume he isn't a Christian. So anyway, this transgender meets "Bob". Bob is a straight heterosexual guy that has never deviated from his normal behavior. Bob isn't a Christian either though. Bob decides he wants to start a sexual relationship and this means that really soon the transgender is going to have to explain discrepansies in "nature". Bob may not be very understanding about being mislead like that and might get a bit aggressive.



Now some people won't understand why Bob got so mad but Bob thought he was getting a 100% natural woman only to have his dream shattered by some man with boobs.
I can't speak for everyone but I'd probably react like Bob.

[Nineveh]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I'm not going to advocate violence either but let's try a bit of reality for a moment.....

A guy gets half the "treatment" he needs to become a man. So we call him a transgender because his surgery isn't complete but he still continues his life as if he was a woman. Let's say for the sake of arguement, that his "look" is very convincing. Since he is also changing his sex to resemble a female, I will assume he isn't a Christian. So anyway, this transgender meets "Bob". Bob is a straight heterosexual guy that has never deviated from his normal behavior. Bob isn't a Christian either though. Bob decides he wants to start a sexual relationship and this means that really soon the transgender is going to have to explain discrepansies in "nature". Bob may not be very understanding about being mislead like that and might get a bit aggressive.



Now some people won't understand why Bob got so mad but Bob thought he was getting a 100% natural woman only to have his dream shattered by some man with boobs.
I can't speak for everyone but I'd probably react like Bob.


:shocked:

Think this will be something they use to explain "awareness about violence against transgender people" in pullik skool?

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by Nineveh

:shocked:

Think this will be something they use to explain "awareness about violence against transgender people" in pullik skool?

Who knows. Probably.
If they quit trying to change what God gave them there wouldn't be any problems. I can't help it that there so many insecure people out there.
But expect bad things to happen when you alter gender. There are some guys out there who don't want to understand the gender-changing process.

[philosophizer]

Originally posted by brother Willi

bark

Wrong tree.

[Nineveh]

I found this (http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=277) article about "anti-transgender" murders.

This baffles me:

What has made transgendered people such popular targets? "It's partly because we're coming out into the daylight," says Toni Collins, who works with Earline Budd at Transgender Health Empowerment.

Jack Levin, the criminologist, agrees. "There are more transgendered people who are coming out, willing to expose themselves to the possibility of victimization," he says.

.....

In the case of transgendered victims, the violence often has a pattern. "So many of these crimes are discovery crimes: 'We thought you were X, but you were actually Y, so we killed you,'" says Lisa Mottet of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force's Transgender Civil Rights Project.

In the notorious cases of Gwen Araujo, the 17-year-old beaten and strangled last year in California, and Brandon Teena, whose brutal murder inspired the movie Boys Don't Cry, the "discovery" was made by friends. More often, it's a sex partner.

No, I do not advocate violence against folks.

It seems these people are keeping secrets until the last second. There are two things that can be done right off the bat that would cull this murder trend against transgenders:

1. Be honest.
2. Don't sleep around with strangers.

Either way, is it really the pullik skool kids that are perps? Why are they "training" kids in this matter when they should be teaching transgenders to be honest and quit acting like sluts? These folks are putting themselves at risk for violence by their own actions in society.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by Nineveh

It seems these people are keeping secrets until the last second. There are two things that can be done right off the bat that would cull this murder trend against transgenders:

1. Be honest.
2. Don't sleep around with strangers.

Either way, is it really the pullik skool kids that are perps? Why are they "training" kids in this matter when they should be teaching transgenders to be honest and quit acting like sluts? These folks are putting themselves at risk for violence by their own actions in society.

1. If they believed in honesty then they wouldn't have had surgery.
2. This would crimp their lifestyle.
3. They want all the girls and boys to know that they are out there and waiting.


Waiting for their prey to let out of school.

[cattyfan]

why have the surgery, then announce it to people?

Also, both cases which are in the spotlight are teenagers...another example of people too young to be making decisions which affect the rest of their lives (which in these cases were very short.) Where were these kids' parents or guardians? Teachers? School counselors? Nobody bothered to explain to these kids the possible consequences for their actions could include rejection.

You can't force people to accept the unnatural, and that's what "tolerance" in the liberal world is all about. I support advocating non-violence, but I know they will also try to cram acceptance down the throats of the students as well.

Several people on this forum have argued in favor of homosexuality by using the "it exists in the animal world" arguement. Well, they need to take a closer look: animals tend to kill those creatures in their own species which behave in abnormal or different manners. Humans are a higher species, certainly, and we shouldn't kill those who are different...but we shouldn't have to accept them, either. Perhaps if those teens had been told, "Sure. Go ahead and preten you're something that you are not, but don't be surprised when people react negatively and reject you" instead of, "It's o.k. to be a pervert...if they reject you, they're the ones with the problem," they might not be dead.

Those kids needed to be counseled by a psychiatrist, not tolerated.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Actually they just need parents who really want to be parents and that aslo truly want to be concerned about the lives of their children.

[NavyDude]

I saw an episode of Law & Order that was based on this same concept. A guy who grew up favoring girlish games and dress decided to have a sex-change, and was only half-way through it. (S?)he met a man (S?)he wanted to marry, but a friend of said individual caught sight of Him(Her?) at a urinal and attacked her for being a transgender (said individual was drunk at the time). Anyway, the Sheman kills the drunk friend in self-defense, but ends up going to jail, and gets gang-raped in the yard at Rikers.

[cattyfan]

I saw an episode of Law & Order that was based on this same concept. A guy who grew up favoring girlish games and dress decided to have a sex-change, and was only half-way through it. (S?)he met a man (S?)he wanted to marry, but a friend of said individual caught sight of Him(Her?) at a urinal and attacked her for being a transgender (said individual was drunk at the time). Anyway, the Sheman kills the drunk friend in self-defense, but ends up going to jail, and gets gang-raped in the yard at Rikers.




I saw the episode, too. The incident was actually at a party and they were in the host's bathroom. the characters supposedly had known each other for months and when they started fooling around, that's when the guy discovered the secret (of the othert guy.) Oh, and the transgender person was engaged too someone else at the time. When he found out he was engaged to a transgender, he threw up in the interrogation room.

The episode was clearly written to say how awful it is for people not to be accepted, and we're supposed to be sorry for the transgender's horrible experience. But the whole thing could have been avoided.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Catty, how would you suggest that that whole thing be avoided? I'm sure it will be obvious but hey why not ask anyway. :)

[firechyld]

Am I the only one who thinks that any program that exists to stop violence in schools is a good thing... regardless of who it's aimed at?

Come on, people, these are kids we're talking about. I don't really give a damn what their personal beliefs or values are... they don't deserve to have their personal safety put at risk. Whether or not they are transgendered shouldn't even come into it.

A certain group of kids are at a higher risk of violence at school than others. Something needs to be done to stop people thinking that they have a right to beat the <expletive> out of these kids. End of story.

[Free-Agent Smith]

I really get tired of people telling me that I have to be accepting of transgenders, homos, lesbians and people who have had complete sex changes.
I get tired of people using these things to try to make me think that those things are natural when they aren't. My faith in God and my understanding of God's Word says that I don't have to accept anything from anyone's beliefs that don't coincide with God's.

This is the point in time when everyone should think about what happened to Sodom and Gomorrah.

[One Eyed Jack]

I'd be willing to bet there are a lot more transgendered folks killing themselves than there are being murdered. Twenty years ago, suicide was the leading cause of death among the transgendered. I seriously doubt that's changed much.

[Free-Agent Smith]

And I would be inclined to believe that too.

[Four O'Clock]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I'm not going to advocate violence either but let's try a bit of reality for a moment.....

A guy gets half the "treatment" he needs to become a man. So we call him a transgender because his surgery isn't complete but he still continues his life as if he was a woman. Let's say for the sake of arguement, that his "look" is very convincing. Since he is also changing his sex to resemble a female, I will assume he isn't a Christian. So anyway, this transgender meets "Bob". Bob is a straight heterosexual guy that has never deviated from his normal behavior. Bob isn't a Christian either though. Bob decides he wants to start a sexual relationship and this means that really soon the transgender is going to have to explain discrepansies in "nature". Bob may not be very understanding about being mislead like that and might get a bit aggressive.



Now some people won't understand why Bob got so mad but Bob thought he was getting a 100% natural woman only to have his dream shattered by some man with boobs.
I can't speak for everyone but I'd probably react like Bob.

What if this Bob was BillyBob? :D

[firechyld]

I really get tired of people telling me that I have to be accepting of transgenders, homos, lesbians and people who have had complete sex changes.
I get tired of people using these things to try to make me think that those things are natural when they aren't. My faith in God and my understanding of God's Word says that I don't have to accept anything from anyone's beliefs that don't coincide with God's.

This is the point in time when everyone should think about what happened to Sodom and Gomorrah.


I can respect that you don't accept the lifestyle choice, and I'm willing to bet most transgendered individuals would agree with me.

But you do NOT have the right to physically assault or intimidate someone because they happen to believe that that lifestyle choice is the right one for them. And that's what people are trying to prevent.

No-one is forcing you or anyone else to stand up and praise transgenderism. They'll just pointing out that if you have an issue with it, you don't have the right to express that with your fists.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by firechyld

I can respect that you don't accept the lifestyle choice, and I'm willing to bet most transgendered individuals would agree with me.

But you do NOT have the right to physically assault or intimidate someone because they happen to believe that that lifestyle choice is the right one for them. And that's what people are trying to prevent.

No-one is forcing you or anyone else to stand up and praise transgenderism. They'll just pointing out that if you have an issue with it, you don't have the right to express that with your fists.


I remember you mentioned in a thread about having bi-sexual tendencies so I really don't expect you to understand my heterosexual point of view. Let me use myself in a hypothetical example:
If I were dating someone and decided to marry them. Then found out on my honeymoon that my wife was only half the woman I thought she was and more than twice the man I didn't want her to be. I would knock her flat out on the floor for leading me believe in lies just so she/he could try to live life as the opposite gender. Why would I do this? Because I am a heterosexual male that is disgusted by things like that.

[firechyld]

That's nice of you. It's also illegal. As it should be.

Yeah, your partner should not have kept that information from you. They've done the wrong thing there. But you aren't fixing that by committing a violent act. Didn't your parents ever tell you that two wrongs don't make a right?

Besides, these aren't the situations that this thread is supposed to be talking about. We're discussing the schooling system. The violence committed there isn't horrified and shocked men on their wedding nights. It's kids thinking that they have the right to beat up other kids because they're different. That is not something to encourage.

[firechyld]

And incidentally, I'd feel just as violated as you would if my partner had spent that much of a relationship lying to me about something like that. It would probably come from a different source, but I'd still understand your reaction.

[aikido7]

Let's first study transgendered animals in biology class. I know it's not creationism, but still....

http://www.wholeearthmag.com/ArticleBin/338.html

And I would be inclined to believe that too

Hmmm. Make it look like--ahem!--an accident

[One Eyed Jack]

Originally posted by aikido7

Hmmm. Make it look like--ahem!--an accident

I know you'd prefer to hang this at the feet of all the evil heterosexuals in the world, but the fact of the matter is that some people just can't hack it, and they kill themselves. And let's face it -- anybody who would go through such drastic surgical procedures to make themselves look like something they're not obviously has a bit of a problem dealing with reality.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by firechyld
It's kids thinking that they have the right to beat up other kids because they're different. That is not something to encourage.

There is no reason for a teen-ager to be a "transgender".

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by Bigoted Christian

I really get tired of people telling me that I have to stop beating the crap out of transgenders, homos, lesbians and people who have had complete sex changes.
I get tired of people using these things to try to make me think that all people deserve to be treated like human beings. My faith in God and my understanding of God's Word says that I don't have to accept anything from anyone's beliefs that don't coincide with what I think are God's. Anyway, I hate homosexuals so I'm sure he does too.


Here's that belief system just a teensy bit further along.

[Nineveh]

Non judgemental pagan... lol

So are you saying, like sybel, it's ok to lie to get what you want?

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by wickwoman

Here's that belief system just a teensy bit further along. I bet that is what keeps you good enough isn't? Not only do you mock but you also feel the need to be rude also. No, it doesn't bother me. Actually I get a laugh out you doing because you will still think you are a wonderful person. :)

[firechyld]

There is no reason for a teen-ager to be a "transgender".

That's irrelevant. Your beliefs on the acceptability of transgenderism don't change the facts that violence in schools, for any reason, needs to be discouraged.

[NavyDude]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I really get tired of people telling me that I have to be accepting of transgenders, homos, lesbians and people who have had complete sex changes.
I get tired of people using these things to try to make me think that those things are natural when they aren't. My faith in God and my understanding of God's Word says that I don't have to accept anything from anyone's beliefs that don't coincide with God's.

This is the point in time when everyone should think about what happened to Sodom and Gomorrah.

Smitty—

I don't think they're wanting you to 'accept them as natural' as much as they're wanting you to not beat the crap out of them... :chuckle:

[NavyDude]

Originally posted by firechyld

That's nice of you. It's also illegal. As it should be.

Yeah, your partner should not have kept that information from you. They've done the wrong thing there. But you aren't fixing that by committing a violent act. Didn't your parents ever tell you that two wrongs don't make a right?

Besides, these aren't the situations that this thread is supposed to be talking about. We're discussing the schooling system. The violence committed there isn't horrified and shocked men on their wedding nights. It's kids thinking that they have the right to beat up other kids because they're different. That is not something to encourage.

*cough*

If I may....

We live in a Democracy. A system designed "For the people, by the people." A less pretty translation of that is the phrase mob rule. In this system, it is accepted that the majority (who call themselves normal) will look upon anyone who is different (not necessarily conflicting—just not the same as everyone else) with suspicion and distaste. That's human nature, more than it is any societal function of ours. You see it in schools as soon as kids go into them—unless you happen to know a child prodigy, most likely every child you've ever met has a desire to 'fit in' with the crowd, because he subconsciously understands that it is dangerous to be different.

Christianity happens to teach against biggotry (while at the same time, condemning certain acts—ie, one should accept them as wrong and not do them, but at the same time one should never hate the person doing them for doing them) in most forms, but, like any religion that involves people, guidelines get pushed back and people revert quickly to their natural instincts when unsupervised.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by NavyDude

Smitty—

I don't think they're wanting you to 'accept them as natural' as much as they're wanting you to not beat the crap out of them... :chuckle: If they leave me alone, I won't beat the crap out of them. If they aren't causing problems with children, I won't beat the crap out of them.

Besides, I will always do my best to let the law take care of them first.

[aikido7]

My wife is a Registered Nurse. Now she is specialized, but years ago she worked in a small hospital as an LPN in a small town hospital.

At least twice a year, a baby was born with secondary sex organs. Some could not be identified as either male OR female.

In that case, the doctor made his best judgement and "fixed" the baby up according to "normal physical standards" as best as could be done. It is not as uncommon as I used to think it was.

I am an oncology nurse working in a hospital with end-stage cancer patients. One of our patients was a 48-year-old man, who was married and in all superficial respects resembled a man--but was female from the waist down. I never found out if he was surgically altered or not. To be honest, I never wanted to.

He was a nice guy, but was obviously pyschologically miserable. From what, specifically, I do not know. I had a hard time dealing with him because of my own feelings.

[Free-Agent Smith]

I've never taken punches at anyone that was considered to be a natural hermaphrodite. Then again they aren't as common as people might think either so that kind of lowers my chances of ever meeting one.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I've never taken punches at anyone that was considered to be a natural hermaphrodite. Then again they aren't as common as people might think either so that kind of lowers my chances of ever meeting one.

How common might people think they are? :think:

Besides, you may have met one or more throughout the years and never known, unless you consistently hang out in places where general social activity includes dropping one's trousers. Somehow I don't picture you frequenting those types of establishments. :chuckle:

[Crow]

Originally posted by Zakath

How common might people think they are? :think:

Besides, you may have met one or more throughout the years and never known, unless you consistently hang out in places where general social activity includes dropping one's trousers. Somehow I don't picture you frequenting those types of establishments. :chuckle:

Here--anyone who wants to can extimate the intersex population of their town.

http://gidinfo.home.comcast.net/estimator.htm

BTW--I disagree that hypospadias represents true intersex. These are males with a normal xy chromosomal makeup who for some reason, possibly maternal estrogens, have a genital abnormality. Usually there is no question what sex these boys are, and in most cases it is easily corrected through surgery.

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by Zakath


Besides, you may have met one or more throughout the years and never known, unless you consistently hang out in places where general social activity includes dropping one's trousers. Somehow I don't picture you frequenting those types of establishments. :chuckle:

I'm sure I might have met one in passing somewhere. I used to hang out in places where gender didn't matter nor did sexual preference. They are called pansexual or fetish clubs. I stayed away from the sexual confused people and they stayed away from me. You might have liked them . The RCC was quite popular with them.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I'm sure I might have met one in passing somewhere. I used to hang out in places where gender didn't matter nor did sexual preference. They are called pansexual or fetish clubs. I stayed away from the sexual confused people and they stayed away from me.Thank you for sharing. This sheds some light on your reactive views on some of these sexual dysfunction topics.

You might have liked them . The RCC was quite popular with them. I never hung about such places. But I try to relate to people as people, not as sexual preferences, political party membership, or some of the other hot topics around here.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Crow

Here--anyone who wants to can extimate the intersex population of their town.

http://gidinfo.home.comcast.net/estimator.htmNow that's slicker-n-catfish slime!

Where do you find this stuff, Crow???? :chuckle:

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Crow

Here--anyone who wants to can extimate the intersex population of their town.

http://gidinfo.home.comcast.net/estimator.htmNow that's slicker-n-catfish slime!

Where do you find this stuff, Crow???? :chuckle:

BTW--I disagree that hypospadias represents true intersex. These are males with a normal xy chromosomal makeup who for some reason, possibly maternal estrogens, have a genital abnormality. Usually there is no question what sex these boys are, and in most cases it is easily corrected through surgery. [/QUOTE]

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by Zakath

Thank you for sharing. This sheds some light on your reactive views on some of these sexual dysfunction topics.
I guess that's neither good nor bad.

I never hung about such places. But I try to relate to people as people, not as sexual preferences, political party membership, or some of the other hot topics around here.
I hope you realise that some of them don't want to relate to you as a person though. But my point in mentioning the church affiliation was the fact that many of them were Catholic.

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I guess that's neither good nor bad. Correct, Watson.

It was merely an observation by a trained professional. ;)

I hope you realise that some of them don't want to relate to you as a person though.If you say so, from your vast experience with such populations...

But my point in mentioning the church affiliation was the fact that many of them were Catholic. Not surprising, so are about 1 in four of the U.S. population (according to the 2001 ARIS results from the City University of NY).

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

If they leave me alone, I won't beat the crap out of them. If they aren't causing problems with children, I won't beat the crap out of them.

Besides, I will always do my best to let the law take care of them first.

Isn't he cute? Like a big fuzzy soft teddy bear. :jump:

[wickwoman]

FAS:

There's (A) rude and then there's (B) bigots. And, then there's
(C) people who are rude to bigots. You are A and B. I am C.

I am also rude to all KKK members, all racists, all members of "God Hates Fags," people who kick cats and dogs, and people who display rebel flags on their home, car or person.

But, other than that, I am sooooooo sweet.

And, my theology isn't about me personally being good enough (BTW does Ninevah always tell you what to say or just sometimes?), it's about EVERYONE being good enough. Even bigots.

[servent101]

WickwomanThere's (A) rude and then there's (B) bigots. And, then there's
(C) people who are rude to bigots. You are A and B. I am C.

I am also rude to all KKK members, all racists, all members of "God Hates Fags," people who kick cats and dogs, and people who display rebel flags on their home, car or person.

But, other than that, I am sooooooo sweet.

And, my theology isn't about me personally being good enough (BTW does Ninevah always tell you what to say or just sometimes?), it's about EVERYONE being good enough. Even bigots.

I would say that at our level - we have to let a little steam out - but we can set our sights on trying to be polite and peaceful to anyone ane everyone - though this will take some time and work - it is still a good example that a lot of saints set for us - including Bahaullah - have you read anything of Him?

With Christ's Love

servent101

[Nineveh]

Originally posted by servent101
Bahaullah

Isn't that....

: searches web :

Bahai.

Thought so, explains a lot. You need to get out of that cult.

[One Eyed Jack]

Originally posted by Nineveh

Isn't that....

: searches web :

Bahai.

Thought so, explains a lot. You need to get out of that cult.

Well, at least we can figure out which "christ" servent101 keeps talking about...

http://www.bahaifaith.net/christ.htm

[Free-Agent Smith]

Originally posted by wickwoman

FAS:

There's (A) rude and then there's (B) bigots. And, then there's
(C) people who are rude to bigots. You are A and B. I am C. Yes, I'm rude. So what?

I am also rude to all KKK members, all racists, all members of "God Hates Fags," people who kick cats and dogs, and people who display rebel flags on their home, car or person. Does this make you feel better?

But, other than that, I am sooooooo sweet.I really hope you aren't using that to describe me.

And, my theology isn't about me personally being good enough (BTW does Ninevah always tell you what to say or just sometimes?), it's about EVERYONE being good enough. Even bigots. I don't think I've many discussions about what I should post with Nineveh or anyone else around here. Good enough? How about strength of faith?

[Cool-Icy]

hmmm....thats interesting,

I work with homeless people all the time, and we do have a transgendered person.

He/She(formally He) has other transgendered friends, which I've met, and they're nice people.


Never the less, I think Agent Smith has some point yet at the same time, his pointing the blame at the wrong person.

Awareness is a great start to stop violence.

However, my personal invesigation looks more towards to society and it's postmoderistic views, that every-one is correct...

And the increase in cosmetics and facial surgery.



There are ways of getting around that thought, but because there is this option of choosing the physical change rather than an actual solution...the problem is more posed at media and society.

[Nineveh]

The actual solution to people not getting harmed/murdered over lying to potential sex partners is a "media/society" problem? How so?

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Nineveh

The actual solution to people not getting harmed/murdered over lying to potential sex partners is a "media/society" problem? How so? Why doesn't the solution involve stopping the lying? :doh:

[Nineveh]

Well, Z, that is a question you might wanna ask ww or Cool-Icy. I'm a firm believer honesty is a better foundation for a relationship than a lie built into a life only to be dashed at the worst possible moment.

[Christine]

Did anyone see last nights episode of "CSI?" It was all about transgenders. :vomit: At the end of the episode, one of the dectectives told a transgender (man turned woman), that "maybe back when man was slime, we were meant to change genders. After all, there's a type of male crab that can change gender at will. Mayb having just one gender is a mutation." :nono:

[Adam_Kratt]

Originally posted by Free-Agent Smith

I'm not going to advocate violence either but let's try a bit of reality for a moment.....

A guy gets half the "treatment" he needs to become a man. So we call him a transgender because his surgery isn't complete but he still continues his life as if he was a woman. Let's say for the sake of arguement, that his "look" is very convincing. Since he is also changing his sex to resemble a female, I will assume he isn't a Christian. So anyway, this transgender meets "Bob". Bob is a straight heterosexual guy that has never deviated from his normal behavior. Bob isn't a Christian either though. Bob decides he wants to start a sexual relationship and this means that really soon the transgender is going to have to explain discrepansies in "nature". Bob may not be very understanding about being mislead like that and might get a bit aggressive.

I am sure that many transgender individuals believe in Christ and are Christian. For you to assume that a transgender individual or a gay or lesbian can not be in a relationship with Jesus Christ is really rediculous. We all know many people who are divorced and remarried who claim to be Christians when Jesus himself condemns those who remarry after divorce as living in adultry. infact the New Testement clearly states that the only reason for divorce is if your spouse is an unbeliever but even then.. you are required to remain single and celibate

[CRASH]

Aren't Aware of Transgenders? Try Public School
Quote:
A transgender advocacy group announced it is teaming up with two homosexual advocacy groups to raise awareness about violence against transgender people -- and to move the issue into America's public schools.

The 6th annual Transgender Day of Remembrance will be held on November 20th, 2004, "to honor those who might otherwise have been missed by the media, as well as to draw attention to this continuing problem," said the event's organizer announced.

Gwendolyn Ann Smith, founder of the Transgender Day of Remembrance, said the event continues to grow; and this year, the Gay, Lesbian, Straight Educators Network (GLSEN) and the Gay-Straight Alliance Network are joining the Transgender Day of Remembrance as sponsors.

"I am very excited to work with GLSEN and the GSA Network, as they will help this event make it into middle and high schools," Smith said in a press release.

"With more and more young victims showing up, if we can reach people at a younger age and explain that this violence is unacceptable, the better our chances at reducing this violence," Smith added.

Smith said violence against transgender people is a long-term problem: "Even if you are not hearing much about it in the media, there are still anti-transgender murders happening, and they are continuing to happen at a little more than one every month."

GLSEN sponsors a "Day of Silence" in April, when students from middle school to college observe a vow of silence to protest discrimination and harassment against homosexuals.cite (http://www.cnsnews.com///Culture/archive/200410/CUL20041028c.html)


Next thing ya know the guys who like sheep and NAMBLA will be teaching in the public schools! The world is going to Hell with Jet rockets on!

[Jefferson]

...the New Testement clearly states that the only reason for divorce is if your spouse is an unbeliever but even then.. you are required to remain single and celibateI don't know what Bible you're reading because my Bible says...

"And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery" (Matthew 19:9)

and...

"If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her. 13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy. 15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases." (I Corinthians 7:12-15)

[CRASH]

I don't know what Bible you're reading because my Bible says...

"And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery" (Matthew 19:9)

and...

"If any brother has a wife who does not believe, and she is willing to live with him, let him not divorce her. 13 And a woman who has a husband who does not believe, if he is willing to live with her, let her not divorce him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband; otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy. 15 But if the unbeliever departs, let him depart; a brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases." (I Corinthians 7:12-15)

Adam is actually reading the Satanic bible!:sigh:

[Adam_Kratt]

Adam is actually reading the Satanic bible!:sigh:

Excuse I am not reading the Satanic Bible. That is slander and a falsehood. And if you read the verse carefully, and decide to find a version that is not corrupt like the KJV you will see that the wording would allow divorce between a believer and unbeliever if both agreed to the divorce. I am confused how this post got onto this thread it was for a different thread in another forum where we were discussing Remarriage after divorce and how according to the NT it was forbidden and was considered to be ADULTRY and that although a women or a husband might divorce even though it is forbiden that they would have to remain single after their divorce because to remarry after a divorce would make the divorced and the new spouse both commiting adultry... I do not know how it got onto this thread

[Adam_Kratt]

actually if you go to
1 Corinthians7:15
But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so.
it does allow divorce between believers and unbelievers it just says that the unbeliever must initiate the divorce. But then we also see where Christians are forbidden to remarry
1 Corinthians 7:11
But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.
so remarriage after divorce is not an option for a true Christian
Matthew 19:9
I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."
Matthew 5:32
But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery.
1 Corinthians 7:11
But if she does, she must remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband. And a husband must not divorce his wife.