What would you do if your child told you he/she was a homosexual?

[Poly]

This is for Christians only. Votes and posts by non-Christians will be deleted.

Vote for your option of what should be done if your child came to you and told you he/she was a homosexual and please give explanation for your vote.

[Dread Helm]

My dad always said he would disown and cut off from the family, anybody that became a Homosexual, until they repent. The reasoning behind that being that if our family accepted that person, then they would feel that their behavior is accepted. Social Stigmas are powerful things. The other two things we'll get disowned for are becoming a lawyer, and spitting tobacco juice on the carpet.

EDIT: Nevermind, I see the poll now.

[Turbo]

BTW: Votes?You must have caught the thread before she was done putting together the poll portion.

[Sold Out]

Someone actually asked me this question the other day. I told them that I would distance myself from my child, in order that they may feel ashamed. (II Thes 3:14) Godly sorrow brings repentance (II Cor 7:10). In order to save my child from an early death, I would do what God's Word says to do when dealing with someone who is living in sin. If I saw a car coming towards my child, I would throw myself in harms way, risking my own life, to save him. This would be no different. I would risk my relationship with him/her to bring them back to God. I love God more than I love my children.

[Poly]

My dad always said he would disown and cut off from the family, anybody that became a Homosexual. The reasoning behind that being that if our family accepted that person, then they would feel that their behavior is accepted. Social Stigmas are powerful things.

It must be very comforting to have a dad that cares about you that much. :up:

[Poly]

Someone actually asked me this question the other day. I told them that I would distance myself from my child, in order that they may feel ashamed. (II Thes 3:14) Godly sorrow brings repentance (II Cor 7:10). In order to save my child from an early death, I would do what God's Word says to do when dealing with someone who is living in sin. If I saw a car coming towards my child, I would throw myself in harms way, risking my own life, to save him. This would be no different. I would risk my relationship with him/her to bring them back to God. I love God more than I love my children.

This is a such an encouraging post. I think the reason that parents refuse to do the right thing is pure selfishness. We don't want to risk having our relationship ruined because it's too uncomfortable and it just hurts. We put our comfort and our feelings over what's best for the child.

[Crow]

I chose #3, with an exception. If a child came to me saying that he struggled with these feelings and did not want to lead the homosexual lifestyle, I would help him find any assistance available, secular or pastoral, to overcome this.

[Poly]

I chose #3, with an exception. If a child came to me saying that he struggled with these feelings and did not want to lead the homosexual lifestyle, I would help him find any assistance available, secular or pastoral, to overcome this.

Absolutely.

[Granite]

Sorry, my bad.

[Poly]

Caledvwhich, stop voting. This is the second time I've had to delete your vote.

[BillyBob]

'Other"


I'd puke. :vomit:

[Poly]

'Other"


I'd puke. :vomit:

Yeah, I probably would too.
But then what would you do?

[BillyBob]

Drink......a lot!

[Poly]

Drink......a lot!

:doh:

[Rimi]

:doh:

Come on, now, you already knew BB's answer. ;)

[Nineveh]

I think Sold Out already laid out the reasoning.

And on a more "selfish" note, it would break my heart to be witness to my baby self destructing.

[Turbo]

'Other"


I'd puke. :vomit:
Yeah, I probably would too.
But then what would you do?
Drink......a lot!
So you'd pretty much just go about your normal daily routine, but in reverse order?

[On Fire]

The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming.

[Rimi]

Does a vote count from someone without chillrun? Never had the wonderful thing happen. But I was able to reject soundly a friend I'd known for 15 years. I'd offered to open a business with her and get her and her kids moved out to Indy, even offering to put her up at our place. She hemmed and hawed and I knew something really bad was about to happen: she said she'd only come if I'd put her lover up, a woman. She laid down the ultimatum: accept me and my girlfriend or go away. And away I went, assuring her that this was NOT what God wanted for her and for her to think real hard about her kids, etc. Honked her off big time. Hardest thing I've ever had to do because we were close, like sisters, and she was my only friend really. I considered her more family than my own, since they're not very loving at all. But I trust Jesus Christ, my Rock and Comfort.

[MrsDearDelmar]

I have a friend who is dealing with this now. She has two daughters, one has claimed she is gay, the other is curious. She also just found her girls were molested by their dad when they were younger.
That is a heartwrenching thing to have to deal with, but I would sit my kids down if they came to me like that, and tell them they needed to repent and that they would not be welcome in my house.
I wouldn't condone being gay, just like I won't condone my kids living with a boyfriend or girlfriend.
I have to admit my heart would struggle with that one, but I would have to do what's right. I would still love them, but pray night and day that they would do the right thing.

[BillyBob]

So you'd pretty much just go about your normal daily routine, but in reverse order?


:chuckle:

[BillyBob]

In all seriousness, I have no idea how I'd react if one of my kids hit me with that bomb. I also don't know how I'd react if one of them committed a serious crime. I imagine I'd still love 'em.......... while I'm kickin' the crap out of 'em.....

I hope I never have to find out.

[MrsDearDelmar]

In all seriousness, I have no idea how I'd react if one of my kids hit me with that bomb. I also don't know how I'd react if one of them committed a serious crime. I imagine I'd still love 'em.......... while I'm kickin' the crap out of 'em.....

I hope I never have to find out.

Me too!

[Mr. Coffee]

The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming. They didn't say that they would act like screaming "God hates fags" protesters. But it's impossible to go "business as usual". The first reaction would be heartbreak.

[Four O'Clock]

They didn't say that they would act like screaming "God hates fags" protesters.

But...many regular posters here WOULD act that way and would seemingly morph into a Fred Phelps clone on a moment's notice.

[Four O'Clock]

This is for Christians only. Votes and posts by non-Christians will be deleted.


Would you care to share with us how you can look into someone's heart and determine this?

[Poly]

Would you care to share with us how you can look into someone's heart and determine this?

Oh I don't know, something about "knowing them by their fruits" or "judge with righteous judgment".
Those votes and posts that have been deleted have been from those claiming they are not Christian.

Now, "would you care to share with us" only that which has to do with the topic of the thread?

[Jeremiah85]

I think that I would have to tell them that what they are doing is a sin against God but I don't think that I could bring myself to disown them or anything like that.

Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I hope that I would be able to love my children the same way while letting them know that what they are doing is absolutely wrong.

[Poly]

I think that I would have to tell them that what they are doing is a sin against God but I don't think that I could bring myself to disown them or anything like that.

Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I hope that I would be able to love my children the same way while letting them know that what they are doing is absolutely wrong.

I don't see that the verses you quoted have any relevance to this issue. They are speaking of nothing in this world being able to keep us from Christ. But God is very clear on how to treat even a Christian who is living in sin.

1 Timothy 5:20
Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear.

Ephesians 5:11
And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.


1 Corinthians 5:11
But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner--not even to eat with such a person.

We have to give God the respect owed to Him in seeking what He wants done in certain situations rather than what we feel should be done. He's not simply wanting to be mean, not caring but it's because He does care that He says to shun them and have nothing to do with them. If we make it comfortable for them to live in their sin, why would they want to change? We have to do that which hurts and absolutely breaks our heart, so that they will be ashamed and broken, ultimately turning back to God and from their destruction.

[Jeremiah85]

Poly, you are correct. I misread the question and thought that you asked what we would do and not what we should do. I am not perfect and alot of my response was colored by the fact that my parents gave me up for adoption when I was very little and I don't think that I have quite forgiven them for not wanting me.

[Christine]

I would definitely try to make it very clear to my child that such a lifestyle is wrong (though they should know this before even engaging in such actions). I'm not sure if I would disown them or not. On one hand, disowning would make it very clear what I think of such a lifestyle and would prevent this child from being a role model to younger children, but disowning a child would also prevent me from being able to regularly talk to my child about this sin, in an effort to persuade him to forsake it.

As others have said, I hope once I'm a parent I never find myself in this situation.

[Poly]

Poly, you are correct. I misread the question and thought that you asked what we would do and not what we should do.

Well that's kind of interesting. I appreciate your honesty.

I know what is right and what should be done and I pray that first of all nothing like this every happens but if I ever find my kids living in sin, that I would have the courage to do what God requires and not give in to my selfishness as a mom and refuse to cut them off.

[Sold Out]

I don't see that the verses you quoted have any relevance to this issue. They are speaking of nothing in this world being able to keep us from Christ. But God is very clear on how to treat even a Christian who is living in sin.

1 Timothy 5:20
Those who are sinning rebuke in the presence of all, that the rest also may fear.

Ephesians 5:11
And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather expose them.


1 Corinthians 5:11
But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortioner--not even to eat with such a person.

We have to give God the respect owed to Him in seeking what He wants done in certain situations rather than what we feel should be done. He's not simply wanting to be mean, not caring but it's because He does care that He says to shun them and have nothing to do with them. If we make it comfortable for them to live in their sin, why would they want to change? We have to do that which hurts and absolutely breaks our heart, so that they will be ashamed and broken, ultimately turning back to God and from their destruction.

AMEN

[Redfin]

For the question as written, I voted for the 2nd option.

Had the question said "practicing homosexual," I would have voted for # 3.

[ebenz47037]

If my daughter were to tell me that she was a lesbian, I would have to tell her that because I love her, I have to inform her of the eternal consequences of her decision. I believe that God does call people to Him, no matter what their circumstances in life are. God will lead a person to change what needs changing. But, if my daughter continued in her choice of lifestyle to the point I've seen so many homosexuals do (saying that the Bible doesn't really condemn homosexuality) and continued to walk outside of the will of God, I would have to cut off all contact with her until she repented.

[Ninjashadow]

I voted #2, but I'd like to add something to that. I would tell them that I still love him or her, but they they will not practice it around our family. What I mean by this is that he or she would not allowed to have their partner around the house at any time, are not allowed to talk about it in my house. Please don't think that it is me trying to ignore it all together. What it would be, however, is me making damn sure they my child knows that I do not approve of it whatsoever. Every chance I got I would be trying to get them to repent and I would pray my heart out for my child.

[Elaine]

I voted #3. Hopefully, I would be able to raise my kids well enough that this wouldn't happen in the first place, but if it did, first, I would do everything in my power to talk them out of it. If that didn't work, then I would have to separate from them until/unless they repented. Dealing with a brother who became a fornicator in 1 Cor. 5, Paul instructed the rest of the church to "put away from among yourselves that wicked person."

[Mr. 5020]

As others have said, I hope once I'm a parent I never find myself in this situation.
I just hope that I am never a parent.

I voted option #2, though, and my opinion is in complete agreement with Ninja's post.

[Christine]

I just hope that I am never a parent.
I hope you aren't serious. There's hardly anything on earth I look forward to more than being a mother.

[Lighthouse]

My kids won;t be fags, because I'm going to raise them right.

[BillyBob]

Shouldn't you get a job first?

[Lighthouse]

:rolleyes:

[SOTK]

My kids won;t be fags, because I'm going to raise them right.

I like what Lighthouse stated. I think it's a non-issue for me, because my kids are Christians and are taught to abhor evil in all it's forms. I have already spent the time to show them in the Bible where homosexuality is an abomination to the Lord and therefore it is an abomination to us.

[Rimi]

One thing a parent would have to do to avoid this dilemma is to make sure their kids are safe from pedophiles. That's the primary reason this whole thing gets started. So, trust no one, as Scriptures teach. Kids are being hurt by family members and friends, not strangers, and when the damage is done, it's done. So, viligance is key.

[SOTK]

I agree. Our kids need to be protected definitely. It's amazing how many pedophiles live in our communities. Most people have no idea just how many there are.

[Frank Ernest]

Luke 15:11-32 - Prodigal son (or daughter).

[Rimi]

I agree. Our kids need to be protected definitely. It's amazing how many pedophiles live in our communities. Most people have no idea just how many there are.


Agreed. I speak from experience, as I was molested by a (not immediate) family member. The devestation I've had to live thru and climb out of could fill volumes . . . I would kill if someone touched my kid. And I am serious. The greatest tool of the pedophile is the family's/kid's silence, because no one wants anyone to know that their family's a wreck. The pedophile counts on that. Don't give him the advantage.

WARNING: for anyone looking down their snout at me right now, and I HAVE gotten that reaction, bite me. I didn't do anything wrong, I was a child. Can't handle it? Stay low.

And no, I really don't see that chip on my shoulder, hoss.

[Rimi]

Luke 15:11-32 - Prodigal son (or daughter).


Would you apply that to a pedophile? Sorry, not buying it.

[Mr. 5020]

I hope you aren't serious. There's hardly anything on earth I look forward to more than being a mother.
Not everybody has the same ambitions, I suppose. :)

[On Fire]

I voted #2, but I'd like to add something to that. I would tell them that I still love him or her, but they they will not practice it around our family. What I mean by this is that he or she would not allowed to have their partner around the house at any time, are not allowed to talk about it in my house. Please don't think that it is me trying to ignore it all together. What it would be, however, is me making damn sure they my child knows that I do not approve of it whatsoever. Every chance I got I would be trying to get them to repent and I would pray my heart out for my child.
:BRAVO:

[Delmar]

My dad always said he would disown and cut off from the family, anybody that became a Homosexual, until they repent. The reasoning behind that being that if our family accepted that person, then they would feel that their behavior is accepted. Social Stigmas are powerful things. The other two things we'll get disowned for are becoming a lawyer, and spitting tobacco juice on the carpet.

EDIT: Nevermind, I see the poll now.
It is so important for kids to know this from an early age before sexual activity is even on their radar screen! Notice, every one, that Dred Helm's dad said "untill they repent"! This is rightous judgment!

[Delmar]

The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming. Love your kids to death if you want. I prefer to love mine into heaven!

[Delmar]

WARNING: for anyone looking down their snout at me right now...I would hope no one here would react that way! So sorry to hear about what happened to you!

[logos_x]

I'd rebuke them, stating I would have no more to do with them unless they repented.

The reason is I love them, and don't want them to do anything that brings the kinds of consequences and risks that perversion does.

[MrsDearDelmar]

The greatest tool of the pedophile is the family's/kid's silence, because no one wants anyone to know that their family's a wreck. The pedophile counts on that. Don't give him the advantage.

I agree with Rimi.

WARNING: for anyone looking down their snout at me right now, and I HAVE gotten that reaction, bite me. I didn't do anything wrong, I was a child. Can't handle it? Stay low.

And no, I really don't see that chip on my shoulder, hoss.

Nobody should blame the children in things like this, they are the innocent ones. I'm sorry this happened to you also.
I agree with others in that Delmar and I have talked to our children about this and they are christians and know this behavior is an abomination to God and wouldn't go there, I still would not wish this on any parent to have to deal with!

[BillyBob]

I hope you aren't serious. There's hardly anything on earth I look forward to more than being a mother.

Not everybody should have children, some people are awful at parenting.

[julie21]

I voted the same as Ninja...God made me a mother, and gave me a mother's love for my children, along with the motherly imperfections that show me I am not perfect,just as none but God are. One of my many imperfections, is to love my children...and not merely on the condition that they are 'perfect' in all regards, in the eyes of me or the Lord.
I would do as Ninja said, and pray with every fibre of my being that they would turn from their sin, but I could no more have nothing to do with them than grow wings. I would tell them that the Lord sees it as what it is, but I do not see that my cutting them off from a relationship with me would change them. Hopefully, reminding them of the truth that the Lord's will that they not be homosexual would. Delivered in a loving manner, not hostile and aggressive, would be my personal way, which I know is not the way of some others on this board.

[Sold Out]

Love your kids to death if you want. I prefer to love mine into heaven!

:BRAVO: LOVE IT!!!

[ShadowMaid]

I hope you aren't serious. There's hardly anything on earth I look forward to more than being a mother.

Not much more that could bring as much joy. :)

As for my child being a homo, I hope that will never happen, but if it does, I think the most loving thing to do is let them go after talking with them, and they don't see the need to repent (or just won't admit it).

[On Fire]

Love your kids to death if you want. I prefer to love mine into heaven!
If God and I can't bring my child around through love and truth, there's something seriously wrong.

[Dread Helm]

Looks like there are 10 hateful people that voted.

[On Fire]

These six things doth the LORD hate:
yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
A proud look, a lying tongue,
and hands that shed innocent blood,
An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations,
feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies,
and he that soweth discord among brethren.

[Poly]

These six things doth the LORD hate:
yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
A proud look, a lying tongue,
and hands that shed innocent blood,
An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations,
feet that be swift in running to mischief,
A false witness that speaketh lies,
and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Sowing discord among the brethren and expressing your convictions of what God says are 2 different things. This passage is speaking of those who simply want to purposely cause brothers not to get along by whatever means.

[On Fire]

I prefer this definition:

This is the specific and planned activity of an evil person designed to keep mankind apart from God. It can also be applied to Christians whose activities within the corporate Church or local church accomplish the same goal. It is usually demonstrated through rigid legalism—the advocacy of a host of “dos and don’ts” which more often than not have no basis in Scripture; although, are usually assumed through the faux-contrivance of various scriptures.

from http://www.bibleone.net/print_sbs85.html

[Poly]

I prefer this definition:

This is the specific and planned activity of an evil person designed to keep mankind apart from God. It can also be applied to Christians whose activities within the corporate Church or local church accomplish the same goal.

Where are the evil people or Christians on this thread who are trying to keep mankind apart from God? I happen to see just the opposite. Whether it's those who feel homosexual children should be cut off or ones who disagree, both are explaining what they feel is the best way to keep mankind from being apart from God.

It is usually demonstrated through rigid legalism—the advocacy of a host of “dos and don’ts” which more often than not have no basis in Scripture; although, are usually assumed through the faux-contrivance of various scriptures.

from http://www.bibleone.net/print_sbs85.html (http://www.bibleone.net/print_sbs85.html)
Being legalistic with "dos and don'ts" isnt the issue here. It seems most everybody here is in agreement that they would tell their kids "don't" live as a homosexual. It is their acceptance of them inspite of their lifestyle and whether or not they should be rejected that is in question. Christians have different ideas of how to handle situations. They discuss these ideas, hopefully showing scripturally how they came to them.

And as far as "faux-contrivance" goes, you need to be careful and distinguish between people who deceitfully and intentionally twist scripture to fit their argument and those who honestly and strongly believe that they are basing their beliefs on solid scripture. Nobody is being dishonest or devious so to imply that anybody is sowing discord here is simply false.

[CapnFungi]

I would tell my child that homosexuality is wrong, and that God does not approve of such behavior. I would probably cease all attempts to contact him but would not reject him if he needed me for something. The Bible doesn't say to hate anyone. I would pray everyday that God enter his heart and show him the errors of his ways.

[Christine]

Not everybody should have children, some people are awful at parenting.
I think Mr. 5020 would be a good parent. :)

[On Fire]

Lots of folks here like to post a single bible verse, out of context, as support for one opinion or another.

[Poly]

Lots of folks here like to post a single bible verse, out of context, as support for one opinion or another.

So? This is not a basis for accusing others of sowing discord.

[On Fire]

Looks like there are 10 hateful people that voted.

:shut:

[Lighthouse]

BillyBob would probably take his kid to a strip club, to straighten him out.

[BillyBob]

I think Mr. 5020 would be a good parent. :)

My comment was not about Mr.5020, but how do you know he'd be a good parent? He already has decided that he doesn't want children [nothing wrong with that], that's a good sign he probably shouldn't have any...

[Delmar]

Lots of folks here like to post a single bible verse, out of context, as support for one opinion or another.Any time you quote a single verse it is, of course, out of context but ther are plenty of times when that single verse can sum up the entire point of the context.

[BillyBob]

BillyBob would probably take his kid to a strip club, to straighten him out.

Not before he is 14! :nono:

[julie21]

Looks like there are 10 hateful people that voted.
Of course that is how you would judge them to be. I would not expect anything other than that from you.
From another point of view, there are some who would state that there are 18 hateful people that voted.But maybe they are too Christ-like to come out and pass judgement?
I think it's a good idea of Poly's to ask people who vote to state in a post as well, their reason/ reasons for voting as they did.
That way, it saves people like you who obviously do not respect or like anonymity in Polls, from doing what you did in the BeanieBoy 'faggot' thread, and making a post where you 'outed' who voted for what. Saves your fingers some effort that way. :)

[Turbo]

Of course that is how you would judge them to be. I would not expect anything other than that from you.
From another point of view, there are some who would state that there are 18 hateful people that voted.But maybe they are too Christ-like to come out and pass judgement?
julie, did you see On Fire's post that Dread was responding to?

(It sure looks like you're passing judgment on Dread, by the way.)

[Mr. 5020]

I think Mr. 5020 would be a good parent. :)
Thank you. :o

My comment was not about Mr.5020, but how do you know he'd be a good parent?
:think:

He already has decided that he doesn't want children [nothing wrong with that], that's a good sign he probably shouldn't have any...
If I did have children, I would love them with all of my heart. Also, as I stated earlier, I chose option #2. I am helping raise my nephew right now, and I love it. But I also love being able to give him back. ;)

[julie21]

julie, did you see On Fire's post that Dread was responding to?

(It sure looks like you're passing judgment on Dread, by the way.)
Would that be this one?.....OF: #60 : If God and I can't bring my child around through love and truth, there's something seriously wrong.
OR
Was he posting in re to this one?...OF #18: The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming.
...because DH did not make it evident he was actually responding to a particular post of anyone's Turbo. There was no 'quote' posted whatsovever..therefore, one could most naturally come to the conclusion, given no reference points by DH within his post #61, that DH was making a personal judgement call on those 11 Pollers that posted contrary to his beliefs.

Originally Posted by julie21

Of course that is how you would judge them to be. I would not expect anything other than that from you.
From another point of view, there are some who would state that there are 18 hateful people that voted.But maybe they are too Christ-like to come out and pass judgement?

Observations and comment on a person's past behaviour, and their carrying it through to another area , as an 'expected' outcome of their belief or whatever , is merely that...observation and comment on that observation. Not judgement.
This also applies to my post to DH's, where I stated that his 'outing' of those who polled in opposition to what he polled...I noted what he did and commented that I didn't see it was necessary...though he evidently did.

[Mr. 5020]

Julie da rebel!!!

:chuckle:

[Lighthouse]

Of course that is how you would judge them to be. I would not expect anything other than that from you.
And you're judging him.

From another point of view, there are some who would state that there are 18 hateful people that voted.But maybe they are too Christ-like to come out and pass judgement?
Christ judged. And most people who think Christians shouldn't judge will point out that He did judge those within the religion.

And, again, you're judging.

I think it's a good idea of Poly's to ask people who vote to state in a post as well, their reason/ reasons for voting as they did.
That way, it saves people like you who obviously do not respect or like anonymity in Polls, from doing what you did in the BeanieBoy 'faggot' thread, and making a post where you 'outed' who voted for what. Saves your fingers some effort that way. :)
Seeing as how the voting was public, and anyone could have checked who voted for which option, your point is moot. However, it is still judgmental.

You're claiming not to be judgmental, yet you're being exactly that. You're a hypocrite.

[Lighthouse]

Observations and comment on a person's past behaviour, and their carrying it through to another area , as an 'expected' outcome of their belief or whatever , is merely that...observation and comment on that observation. Not judgement.
This also applies to my post to DH's, where I stated that his 'outing' of those who polled in opposition to what he polled...I noted what he did and commented that I didn't see it was necessary...though he evidently did.
What a load of crap. Your attempt to justify your judgmental behavior is laughable. And no one is buying it, least of all God.

[Frank Ernest]

Would you apply that to a pedophile? Sorry, not buying it.
The question at hand was not about pedophilia. Did you think it was?

[Rimi]

The question at hand was not about pedophilia. Did you think it was?

No, I was pointing out how that verse gets abused. It's applied all too often and improperly so. You wouldn't use that verse on a pedophile, a murderer, a rapist. But you'd use it in a homo situation. Sorry that wasn't clear.

[Frank Ernest]

No, I was pointing out how that verse gets abused. It's applied all too often and improperly so. You wouldn't use that verse on a pedophile, a murderer, a rapist. But you'd use it in a homo situation. Sorry that wasn't clear.
The homosexual has separated himself from God. The prodigal son separated and cut himself himself off from his father. The homosexual and the prodigal son head for town, party down, etc. until the money runs out and he is forced, by necessity, to demean and disgrace himself working with unclean animals. Defeated by his own sin, the prodigal son goes home.

During all this the father made no attempt to contact his son nor maintain a relationship with him. It was up to the son to see the error of his ways and come back to righteousness.

More clear?

[Rimi]

Ah, yes, that would be the proper way to view it. All clear. Usually, Christians like it to mean everyone gets back with God, totally disregarding that the prodigal son doesn't ask to be placed back as a son but as a hired hand, yadayada, the humility part. But I see your point and agree with your take on it. Good one. Well said.

[Frank Ernest]

Thanks! :D

[Rimi]

Thank you! And thank you for graciously setting me right. I was wrong and I apologize.

[julie21]

What a load of crap. Your attempt to justify your judgmental behavior is laughable. And no one is buying it, least of all God.

Oh! Gee! Lighthouse...you have now utterly done it...yep! Off my Christmas card list! :cry:
Why would I give one little fig what you think...I have seen what you have done lately and that's decided me once and for all that what you have to say or think on anything = diddly squat. :) So go right ahead little man...do your worst to lambast me as you have others...and it is SO good to know that you know exactly what God thinks and buys into....beware of what you profess to know! Could very well return at the end of your days to bite you on the behind! :chuckle:

Lighthouse: Seeing as how the voting was public, and anyone could have checked who voted for which option, your point is moot.
Just a quick point here with this...How exactly does someone get to see the result that is Public and for all to see?
I am not completely savvy with computers and how to do some stuff on this board - and there are people who can testify to this statement if you do not believe me. But for the life of me, I cannot even find how to get the names of who Polled what on this Poll, let alone the other one I mentioned.
So the point I posted was not moot, as you claim, little one. :)

[Mr. 5020]

Only on some polls can you see who voted, and which option they voted for. This is not one of them. If it is one of them, you can click on the number of votes for a particular option (example: if you wanted to know who voted the 3 votes for other in this poll, if it was public, you would click on the '3').

[Poly]

The homosexual has separated himself from God. The prodigal son separated and cut himself himself off from his father. The homosexual and the prodigal son head for town, party down, etc. until the money runs out and he is forced, by necessity, to demean and disgrace himself working with unclean animals. Defeated by his own sin, the prodigal son goes home.

During all this the father made no attempt to contact his son nor maintain a relationship with him. It was up to the son to see the error of his ways and come back to righteousness.

More clear?

Great point, Frank, concerning the parable saying nothing about the father keeping contact with him, while he was living in sin. As long as Dad was in the picture, it would be hard for the son to come to the absolute end of himself.

[julie21]

Only on some polls can you see who voted, and which option they voted for. This is not one of them. If it is one of them, you can click on the number of votes for a particular option (example: if you wanted to know who voted the 3 votes for other in this poll, if it was public, you would click on the '3').
You are doing an excellent job of clarifying things tonight! Thanks again. :)

[Mr. 5020]

You are doing an excellent job of clarifying things tonight! Thanks again. :)
:D

[Mr. 5020]

Here is an example of a poll with public results. (http://www.theologyonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19273)

[julie21]

View Poll Results: Is calling Beanieboy a faggot a Christ-like thing to do?
No
adajos, Agape4Robin, Aimiel, allsmiles, avatar382, beanieboy, beefalobilly, Berean Todd, brockerst, Caille, Caledvwlch, Carver, cattyfan, Chileice, Dave Miller, freelight, God_Is_Truth, granite1010, Holly, Jabez, jeremiah, Jujubee, julie21, karstkid, ktjo, logos_x, Lovejoy, lulu, monochrome, Mr. Coffee, On Fire, Redfin, seagull, Sold Out, SUTG, temple 2000, The Edge, Thia, wickwoman, Ya'nar#1 40 62.50%
Yes
aikido7, BillyBob, Christine, Clete, Crow, deardelmar, docrob57, Dread Helm, Emo, Frank Ernest, Freak, Free-Agent Smith, Lighthouse, Lucky, Mr. 5020, Ninjashadow, Poly, ShadowMaid, Shimei, SOTK, the Sibbie, Turbo, Wamba the Fool, wholearmor 24 37.50%
Voters: 64.
I see...like this one! I did it and it worked....the public can really see the results of the poll clearly. Hey!
Thanks again. :)

[Lovejoy]

I remember reading things as a child about disfellowship (I was a weird kid) in the JWs. I later found that it was the about the same as shunning (as in the Amish). People seperated from family because of a dispute over a point of theology. Admittedly, it was better than being torched for a dispute over the nature of the Trinity, as the Catholic church or Calvin would have done. Still, it was heartbreaking to read about, and left me very cold towards groups that would practice that.

However (and there is a however) now I just don't know. Frankly, I doubt that God ever stops reaching out to people in this life, but there is a point in which our choices about life can result in eternal seperation from Him. How can the love of a parent be more pure than the love of God? It can't. So if the love of a parent results in the toleration of things that God hates, it is an impure love. David and Jacob accepted things about their sons that were evil, and that begat much more evil. And it cost them those sons forever. If they had been willing to say "I love you, but you must leave until you can repent! And when you do, I will be here" then things would have been different.

I have to say, I don't know what I would do. Would I reject my children over premarital sex, or drugs, or atheism? I guess I would have to see it, see there heart, do everything I can to bring them back, and then make a painful, prayerful choice.

[Lighthouse]

Oh! Gee! Lighthouse...you have now utterly done it...yep! Off my Christmas card list! :cry:
So?

Why would I give one little fig what you think...I have seen what you have done lately and that's decided me once and for all that what you have to say or think on anything = diddly squat. :) So go right ahead little man...do your worst to lambast me as you have others...and it is SO good to know that you know exactly what God thinks and buys into....beware of what you profess to know! Could very well return at the end of your days to bite you on the behind! :chuckle:
Is it a sad lonely place to be, set in your ways?

Just a quick point here with this...How exactly does someone get to see the result that is Public and for all to see?
I am not completely savvy with computers and how to do some stuff on this board - and there are people who can testify to this statement if you do not believe me. But for the life of me, I cannot even find how to get the names of who Polled what on this Poll, let alone the other one I mentioned.
So the point I posted was not moot, as you claim, little one. :)
It was moot. Dread Helm didn't publicize it, On Fire made it public when he strated the thread. You owe DH an apology.

[julie21]

So?
Just showing how much it doesn't mean to me that you refer to my post as crap .You don't understand the subtle nuances of sarcasm, do you? No need for an answer, so don't strain the little grey matter too much.
Is it a sad lonely place to be, set in your ways?
I won't comment on this at all because I could end up being called on judging you wrongly if I wrote what I could about certain sad people.
It was moot. Dread Helm didn't publicize it, On Fire made it public when he strated the thread. You owe DH an apology.
No way mate...don't you get the idea that if a person didn't have prior knowledge of how to do something, or even that it was possible for private looks at the data on the Poll, then it isn't fair to say an apology is needed .
And the point is that OF made it available to the public, if they wanted to look for themselves.
DH then went in and publicized it by way of posting those names for all to see.
Therein lies the point I was making.
Too hard a concept for you to understand, or doesn't fit your little agenda?

Okay, the Poll was available publicly for anyone who knew they could click on numbers and that would bring up corresponding names of Pollers [which I did not know was possible back then, and only was made aware of how to do it by MR5020 last night], so if it was able to be done freely by anyone who was interested, why did DH choose to do it, then go and POST all of the names?
Community minded spirit? One cannot help but question motive.

[On Fire]

And you're judging him.


Christ judged. And most people who think Christians shouldn't judge will point out that He did judge those within the religion.

And, again, you're judging.


Seeing as how the voting was public, and anyone could have checked who voted for which option, your point is moot. However, it is still judgmental.

You're claiming not to be judgmental, yet you're being exactly that. You're a hypocrite.
You're a jerk and a judgemental idiot.

[heartbrave1983]

There was a problem like this a while back at our church. Our pastor's son was actually the one who came out of the closet. His father (the pastor) exiled him. I thought it was an honorable thing to do, not many pastor's will do that if it involves their own child.

As for me, I wouldn't want anything to do with my child if they told me they were a homosexual.....

[Poly]

There was a problem like this a while back at our church. Our pastor's son was actually the one who came out of the closet. His father (the pastor) exiled him. I thought it was an honorable thing to do, not many pastor's will do that if it involves their own child.

As for me, I wouldn't want anything to do with my child if they told me they were a homosexual.....

:up:

This may be a given but just to make sure...

Would you let them know how distructive it was and encourage them to repent, making sure they know that if they do, you would be there for them?

[heartbrave1983]

:up:

This may be a given but just to make sure...

Would you let them know how distructive it was and encourage them to repent, making sure they know that if they do, you would be there for them?

Oh definetely. I was most speaking for the worst-case scenario.

My pastor's son was incredibly stubborn about repenting and refused to admit he had a serious problem.

[Poly]

Oh definetely. I was most speaking for the worst-case scenario.

My pastor's son was incredibly stubborn about repenting and refused to admit he had a serious problem.

Gotcha! :cool:

[Four O'Clock]

Oh I don't know, something about "knowing them by their fruits" or "judge with righteous judgment".
Those votes and posts that have been deleted have been from those claiming they are not Christian.

Now, "would you care to share with us" only that which has to do with the topic of the thread?

I stand corrected in that apparently many indicate to you that they are not Christian.
I'd think it rather difficult to "know them by their fruits" by simply reading some of their posts (l'll admit some posts are rather blatant anti-Christian but in others it may well be hard to tell) and sadly the "judge with righteous judgment" seems to be by some on board here as a verse picking excuse to spread varying degrees of foul mouthed diatribe. Some in the TOL crowd seem to find those special Bible verses to suit your opinions and interpretations as much as the non and quasi-Christians you attack.

For the record, I voted #2

I won't be bothering you folks much any more as I'm very busy at work and home and trying to remove the log(s) from my own eye.
If you want to throw a kind act my way, please pray for my brother in his continuing alcoholism recovery.

Ever read any of Andrew Murray's work? Every Christian (and non-Christian of course) should...

[Lighthouse]

Just showing how much it doesn't mean to me that you refer to my post as crap .You don't understand the subtle nuances of sarcasm, do you? No need for an answer, so don't strain the little grey matter too much.
Oh! You were being sarcastic? I couldn't tell.:rolleyes:

I won't comment on this at all because I could end up being called on judging you wrongly if I wrote what I could about certain sad people.
Why are you so afraid to speak your mind? Do you think I care what you say about me? Here I'll make it simple for you.

Anyone and everyone, whatever Julie has to say about this post allow her to do so without commenting on it. Let this be between us.

There, does that make it easier?

No way mate...don't you get the idea that if a person didn't have prior knowledge of how to do something, or even that it was possible for private looks at the data on the Poll, then it isn't fair to say an apology is needed .
:dizzy:

What was that supposed to say? Do you mean you do owe DH an apology, or that you don't? And how did you think DH got the information of who voted anyway?

And the point is that OF made it available to the public, if they wanted to look for themselves.
DH then went in and publicized it by way of posting those names for all to see.
Therein lies the point I was making.
Too hard a concept for you to understand, or doesn't fit your little agenda?
And what exactly was wrong with him doing that? Most people were making it abundantly clear what they had voted, anyway.

Okay, the Poll was available publicly for anyone who knew they could click on numbers and that would bring up corresponding names of Pollers [which I did not know was possible back then, and only was made aware of how to do it by MR5020 last night], so if it was able to be done freely by anyone who was interested, why did DH choose to do it, then go and POST all of the names?
Community minded spirit? One cannot help but question motive.
Everyone had already admitted to what they had voted. DH wasn't publicizing anything, it had already been publicized.:doh:

[Lighthouse]

You're a jerk and a judgemental idiot.
Did I say that I was not judgmental? I do not believe I did. I am very judgmental. Now, would you care to back up your judgments on my being a jerk and an idiot? And explain what the hell happened to you?

[freelight]

I voted #1 (apparently the only one to do so) for this reason essentially - because of my 'unconditional love' for my child. It would not matter....in the sense that if he helt he was gay or was having same-sex attraction/affections - I would still love him/her. This is called 'pure unconditional love' (PUL) for those of you who seem to have only 'conditional' love for your own children of all people.

I was going to vote 'Other' but this would not be definitive for anyone who views the polls. My next choice would possibly be #2....but I am still working on the approval issue - of course being gay is more difficult in our society although its becoming more acceptable in modern culture.

An important thing to consider here is the psychology of homosexuality and what makes some souls predisposed or oriented in this direction. Many who wield a bible and spew the usual anti-gay, 'repent or go to hell' rote.....may be ingnorant of the dynamics that make persons gay or attracted to the same sex. Much more is involved than just what outsiders see as 'sin', 'perversion', etc. If some were more educated into the psychology of same-sex attractions...they might be more compassionate and actually serve as channels of healing instead of standing behind a sign or placard yelling at homos to repent or go to hell. This latter kind of behavior often is appalling and tends to drive persons further away from 'christianity'. Remember how you present your religion, your God, your Jesus will make an impression on others, for better or for worse.....or may not matter at all. Since God is watching at all times...be careful in your manners.

So......I am still working on #2 in that I am still researching this area of homosexuality for myself. There are many christians who accept gays as 'christians' and I am sure that may upset many of the right-wing fundies here....as the attitude towards their own gay children shown by choice #3 represent spite, revulsion and at best....'conditional' love. I only say this because a parent could be more compassionate in trying to understand all the dynamics in their childs life, development, evolution, etc...to better love and understand them. With this love and openness of communication....your children ought be able in this LIGHT to make their own decisions and be led by God as they allow themselves to be. God is the Sole Judge and knower of all hearts. All souls are his.

Notice that most on this thread have not had a son or daughter confess same-sex attractions to them and it is not known how many here have ever known and loved a person (family member or not) that was gay. Alot are aspersions cast from a distance inspired by an antagonistic, disgusting, view of homosexuality, some spawned from their own imaginations, biases, ignorance, etc. Sure,....one can cite scripture, use every resource, reference to show how wrong or evil homosexuality is, etc, etc. Some seem to dwell more on this issue than other issues within the field of sin/evil - its almost a peculiar delight to demonize this particular 'orientation' as if it were the most diabolical sin, etc. But remember its easy to spew out judgment without understanding the psychology and value of the persons on trial. Thats why I voted the way I did...as I am still working thru these issues.

I am sure reactions from the main lot of homo-haters on TOL will be typical here. But God is Love...and all will be held accountable for how they treat others . Whether God wants a person to change their sexual orientation or not...this is easier said than done as there are many factors involved in the psychology of same-sex attractions. I have heard some gay persons go thru the whole repentance thing, had hands laid on them, demons cast out of them, even shock treatments...but still feel they are gay. So....like any other imperfect condition....sometimes transformation may take time as one adopts new ways of being, thinking, doing, etc. Lastly......If you want to help those with gay inclinations and/or living a totally 'out' lifestyle...then let your light/love shine. That is all you can do.


paul

[Jackson]

Come on, now, you already knew BB's answer. ;)
:chuckle:

[Jackson]

I think I would have to agree with BB about really not knowing what to do. But, I would still love my children no matter what. I also would not condone their behavior. I would also treat them with respect. I wonder if any one feels that this would be any different then your teenage daughter coming to you and telling you she has had several sex partners (no mine has not). Would I still love her or would I cast her out into the arms of yet another lover? I would guess that because there is no rating system for sin meaning all sin leads to death I would treat them just like they had commited any other sin. I would try and help them see what God says about it and go from there all the while praying untill my knees wore out.

[Ps82]

Other,
I'd let my child know that I do not approve ... I would not disown him ... but would not allow the practice in our home. Christmas would be without the partner, but my child could come home whenever he wished. It would be a sad time... but I'd try to keep the door open for guidance, repentance, and forgiveness. MUCH PRAYER.

Jackson, you made a great point ... sin is sin.

[Turbo]

Other,
I'd let my child know that I do not approve ... I would not disown him ... but would not allow the practice in our home. Christmas would be without the partner, but my child could come home whenever he wished. It would be a sad time... but I'd try to keep the door open for guidance, repentance, and forgiveness. MUCH PRAYER.I take it you wouldn't let his partner visit with your son any time, not just at Christmas, right?

Jackson, you made a great point ... sin is sin.Of course sin is sin. But some sins are greater than others; wouldn't you agree?

[Joe Roberts]

The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming.

Agreed

[Delmar]

Any time you quote a single verse it is, of course, out of context but ther are plenty of times when that single verse can sum up the entire point of the context.

[Delmar]

The hate around here is getting to be overwhelming.

AgreedJoe this is an old thread. I went back a few pages and did not see where you got that quote. perhaps it would make sense for you to start a new thread and link to examples of "the hate around here". Maybe you could set people straight.

[Jackson]

Of course sin is sin. But some sins are greater than others; wouldn't you agree?No I don't agree. Some sins do carry a greater amount of consequences here on earth (ie premarital sex leads to pragnancy) but in Gods eyes I don't think He rates sins, homosexuallity being the worst. All sin is an abomination to God. I think lying on your taxes is just as wrong as any other sin in Gods eyes. 99% obedience is still 100% disobedience. That is why we ALL need a Savior!