No. Some around here aren't even completely convinced that THEY exist...and, to be fair, neither are some of us.
Of course not, though a number of us will probably ask uncomfortable questions like, "how can you live with yourself believing as you do?" Do you have any idea how many organisms you are personally responsible for ending in any given, selfish day of your life?
And a couple around here might suggest you're a mass murderer, by you own admission.
But first they'll more than likely just say hi and how are you, things like that...
Hmm, thats an interesting thought. I suppose i am a mass murderer. I like to think of it as keeping the balance. Yin and yang stylie..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ktoyou
Hi,
I would rather have someone who thinks along pantheist lines and writes poorly, than a newbie with a big swollen head
So welcome.
Me writing i suppose is how i speak when im fooling about...innit...like. Im whats called a working class brummy.In otherwords , a person born in the city of Birmingham.
I had a friend once who was a reformed Druid, they are allowed to pray to bushes.
Im no druid. I still go to church. Churches are obviously fine places to pay respect to God. I would be happy to worship in a mosque as well.
But The church of England is what my anglo saxon brain is happiest with.
I do believe in Christ, although i dont think he was any more the son of god than you or me. But deffo, he had more insight than the average dude of his time.
Will i be told to naff off if i say that i believe that we are all god,
I agree we are all God... but there is a lot more to say about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
but are no more significant than plants or other animals.
I agree with this only in the sense that all that is, is One in God.
However, we occupy a significantly higher state of consciousness than plants or animals.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
That we all belong to the same organism which is nature (GOD).
Nature is indeed essentially God, (the Mother aspect of God) but God is more than nature. All creation whatsoever - including all conceivable forms - can be represented symbolically as the Divine Feminine.
God is also above and beyond nature and the world of forms, (this can be described symbolically as the Divine Masculine... the Father aspect of Divinity), and therefore we are also, in essence, above and beyond nature. That is how we are able to be self-aware and investigate nature as we do.
God is pure Being.
In creation God is Being more.
Love
John
"Mind creates the abyss, the heart crosses it" Nisargadatta Maharaj
I agree we are all God... but there is a lot more to say about that.
I agree with this only in the sense that all that is, is One in God.
However, we occupy a significantly higher state of consciousness than plants or animals.
Yes i agree that we do have a different state of conciusness. But higher?.. Ive no idea. I believe that if i pray, my prayers are answered.
But the fact is we dont know what contectionother animals or plants have with god. A wild animal will kill and be killed and as a result become part of a healthy circle of life. Maybe that makes them more in tune with god.
Nature is indeed essentially God, (the Mother aspect of God) but God is more than nature. All creation whatsoever - including all conceivable forms - can be represented symbolically as the Divine Feminine.
God is also above and beyond nature and the world of forms, (this can be described symbolically as the Divine Masculine... the Father aspect of Divinity), and therefore we are also, in essence, above and beyond nature. That is how we are able to be self-aware and investigate nature as we do.
I have no idea of masculine or femine. For me , god is simply god.
I dont see how any one can know that we are above and beyond nature. Self awareness is just an aspect of the human animals that we are.
God is pure Being.
In creation God is Being more.
Love
John
I still struggle with the god thing. I def have a faith and i believe in god. I just really have no idea about the reality of god. I just have theories. These theories just seem like logic. Although logic may have nothing to do with it.
You say, "I have no idea of masculine or feminine. For me , god is simply god."
Sure... the reason I brought the symbols of Divine masculine & feminine into this was to help emphasize the fact that I don't personally hold the mental image we tend to have in the West of "God" as an external and separate, (and exclusively masculine), being like a glorified Zeus.
You go on to say,
"I dont see how any one can know that we are above and beyond nature. Self awareness is just an aspect of the human animals that we are."
Well, each one of us realises, "I am - I exist". We can wonder how nature "works" and investigate it in scientific, philosophical, religious and other ways. We have a need to be creative in all sorts of ways. We as a spieces do not simply adapt to our environment but actively seek to change our environment to make our lives easier or happier.
All of this indicates a quantum leap beyond animals.
Please don't misunderstand me - we have an animal dimension to our existence; and indeed we have a purely biological and mineralogical, (or inorganic), dimension to our existence. These lower dimensions of our being are truly wonderful and continue to yield entire worlds of wonder to our inquiries. But to the extent that we are aware that we can see ourselves as observers and investigators of nature we are above and beyond nature.
It could be argued in response... "If that is so then does the fact that we seek to observe and investigate God in Theology, Philosophy and Religion mean that we are above and beyond God?!"
And that would be a very important question. The answer is that we are above and beyond the "god" that can be captured by mental images and logical concepts... that "god" is nothing but an illusion. The Real God is that in Whom we, "...live and move and have our being", as St Paul says in the Bible.
Maz, I realise my vocabulary and conceptualisation here may seem very fancy and abstract but that's honsetly not down to me trying to appear impressive in some way. The fact is that the questions and ideas you have put forward - if taken seriously, (and I DO take them seriously) - push the barriers of language. The issues are that profound.
"Mind creates the abyss, the heart crosses it" Nisargadatta Maharaj
You say, "I have no idea of masculine or feminine. For me , god is simply god."
Sure... the reason I brought the symbols of Divine masculine & feminine into this was to help emphasize the fact that I don't personally hold the mental image we tend to have in the West of "God" as an external and separate, (and exclusively masculine), being like a glorified Zeus.
You go on to say,
"I dont see how any one can know that we are above and beyond nature. Self awareness is just an aspect of the human animals that we are."
Well, each one of us realises, "I am - I exist". We can wonder how nature "works" and investigate it in scientific, philosophical, religious and other ways. We have a need to be creative in all sorts of ways. We as a spieces do not simply adapt to our environment but actively seek to change our environment to make our lives easier or happier.
All of this indicates a quantum leap beyond animals.
Please don't misunderstand me - we have an animal dimension to our existence; and indeed we have a purely biological and mineralogical, (or inorganic), dimension to our existence. These lower dimensions of our being are truly wonderful and continue to yield entire worlds of wonder to our inquiries. But to the extent that we are aware that we can see ourselves as observers and investigators of nature we are above and beyond nature.
It could be argued in response... "If that is so then does the fact that we seek to observe and investigate God in Theology, Philosophy and Religion mean that we are above and beyond God?!"
And that would be a very important question. The answer is that we are above and beyond the "god" that can be captured by mental images and logical concepts... that "god" is nothing but an illusion. The Real God is that in Whom we, "...live and move and have our being", as St Paul says in the Bible.
Maz, I realise my vocabulary and conceptualisation here may seem very fancy and abstract but that's honsetly not down to me trying to appear impressive in some way. The fact is that the questions and ideas you have put forward - if taken seriously, (and I DO take them seriously) - push the barriers of language. The issues are that profound.
Dont worry about the words John. I dont take you as bombast.
Im an uneducated working class fellow. I speak in the manner im acustomed. A bombast wouldnt usually take the subject any where productive.
In terms of intelligence, of course we are way beyond any other creature on our planet, that we know of (although i see no reason why many other forms intelligent species exist beyond our abillities to percieve them). But this doesnt put us any closer to god , any more important to god or have a better understanding of god.
Comprehention or understanding of god my well be beyond our comprehention or understanding. This is where other animals may be a step or two ahead of us ( i may be talking cobblers there).
In terms of intelligence, of course we are way beyond any other creature on our planet, that we know of (although i see no reason why many other forms intelligent species exist beyond our abillities to percieve them).
Agreed!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
But this doesnt put us any closer to god ,
Agreed
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
any more important to god
Agreed
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
or have a better understanding of god.
We surely have a higher consciousness of God though?
Would you not say so?
Raising consciousness, expanding awareness, is all part and parcel of what it means to be truly "alive", I would personally say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazakiparks
Comprehention or understanding of god my well be beyond our comprehention or understanding.
But again, that view conceives "god" as being something "out there".... which God is, BUT God is not just "out there" - God is us, "in there", also.
This is why God can never be an object. God is always more than any conception of God. That does not mean there is not a wealth of useful information about God in nature, science, theology, the arts etc etc BUT it does mean that the in-form-ation is simply that which can produce "forms". God is expressed in forms, (even in mental images of "God"), but is also beyond all form since God is the source of all form.
Edit:
"The sun is God" is a correct, though limited, statement - because God is All that Is and the sun is part of all that is.
"God is the sun" would be a technically idolatorous statement - because God is always more than any object of thought.
Interestingly, the bible declares that God is Love and God is Light and these are not idolatrous statements.
"Mind creates the abyss, the heart crosses it" Nisargadatta Maharaj
We surely have a higher consciousness of God though?
Would you not say so?
Raising consciousness, expanding awareness, is all part and parcel of what it means to be truly "alive", I would personally say.
But again, that view conceives "god" as being something "out there".... which God is, BUT God is not just "out there" - God is us, "in there", also.
This is why God can never be an object. God is always more than any conception of God. That does not mean there is not a wealth of useful information about God in nature, science, theology, the arts etc etc BUT it does mean that the in-form-ation is simply that which can produce "forms". God is expressed in forms, (even in mental images of "God"), but is also beyond all form since God is the source of all form.
Edit:
"The sun is God" is a correct, though limited, statement - because God is All that Is and the sun is part of all that is.
"God is the sun" would be a technically idolatorous statement - because God is always more than any object of thought.
Interestingly, the bible declares that God is Love and God is Light and these are not idolatrous statements.
Hi john. Im going to come back to this thread. Ive got some Rampage Jackson to watch on UFC 96......Yin and Yang.
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