Exclusively Christian TheologyThis forum is exclusively for those who consider themselves Christian and consider the Bible to be the inspired word of God.
Slogan/motto:
Joh 3:16...God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:3 ...this is life eternal, that they migh
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 10:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graceandpeace
and, what did Jesus say? If you have seen Him, you have seen the FATHER...they are one and the same.
Yet, you will nit pick it til you unravel His whole purpose, eh?
Didn't he say this?
Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Or this
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
No good to pretend being blind:
Mat 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Or this
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
No good to pretend being blind:
Mat 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
well, when you take it out of context of the rest of the bible..it would appear Jesus was a lesser than the Father, but He was speaking of as means to His lesser role...as in the form of flesh.
Context....is important.
I get kidded on here for saying that, but it is true.
Slogan/motto:
Joh 3:16...God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:3 ...this is life eternal, that they migh
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by graceandpeace
well, when you take it out of context of the rest of the bible..it would appear Jesus was a lesser than the Father, but He was speaking of as means to His lesser role...as in the form of flesh.
Context....is important.
I get kidded on here for saying that, but it is true.
Take a look at few of hundreds fool proof contexts:
Isa 11:1-3, 42:1+6, Eze 34:23-24, Mic 5:2, Mt 6:9, 11:25, Jn 6:23, 6:44-45, 6:65, 14:6, 14:10, 17:3, 20:17, 20:31, Ac 2:22, 2:36, 3:21, 10:36, 17:31, Ro 1:7, 1Cor 1:3, 8:6, 2Co 1:2, 5:18+21, Eph 1:3, 2:18, Ga 1:1, 1:3, Col 1:1-3, 1:12-13, Php 1:2, 1Th 1:1-3, 2Th 1:1-2, 1Ti 1:1-2, 2:5, 2Ti 1:1-2, Ti 1:4, Phm 1:3-4, Heb 1:1-2, Jam 1:1, 1Pe 1:2-3, 2Pe 1:2, 1Jn 1:2-3, 2Jn 1:3, Jud 1:1, Re 1:1.
Slogan/motto:
Joh 3:16...God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:3 ...this is life eternal, that they migh
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 11:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by godrulz
None of jerzy's verses are a problem for a triune view.
Jn. 17:3 has been answered repeatedly, so time to wipe the dust off our feet and move on.
Yes, luz.
You still didn't decide:
- Whether the eternal life is for them to know the Father the only pagan god
Or
- Whether the eternal life is for them to know the Father the only true Satan.
As a matter of fact you should have gone long ago to avoid embarrassment every time you come up with your baloney "views".
Slogan/motto:
Evidence that cannot dispel all doubt is still evidence - perhaps very good and overwhelming evidence
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 11:51 AM
Wow, Lon should have titled this "The anti-trinitarian magnet thread"
And a Muslim posting in the ECF is just plain sad.
Futility: "More than at any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and hopelessness; the other, to total extinction. Let us pray that we will have the wisdom to choose correctly. I speak, by the way, not with any sense of futility, but with a panicky conviction of the absolute meaninglessness of existence."
- Woody Allen
Hope:
Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things.
Philippians 4:6-8
Slogan/motto:
Joh 3:16...God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:3 ...this is life eternal, that they migh
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholsmom
Wow, Lon should have titled this "The anti-trinitarian magnet thread"
And a Muslim posting in the ECF is just plain sad.
Shouldn't he rather title it something like this?
"How to fool the true worshippers of the Father the only true God".
Slogan/motto:
Joh 3:16...God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:3 ...this is life eternal, that they migh
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 01:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by john w
Either you attend to those verses below and tell us what you suggest be done with them or you just may dance to your own tune contravening TOL rules.
Genesis-Revelation-the Lord Jesus Christ is God.
I one upped you again!
Slower: Try to die. Show us you can give up the ghost. Show us any man can do this. Well?
Are you a prophet?
John.
Do yourself a favour.
Check our conversation from the beginning and find out how many of your questions and how many times I have answered and how many of my questions and how many times you didn't answer.
How many times you have asked your questions instead.
This is clearly against the TOL rules and displays your inability to lead a scriptures based discussion but merely offer your baloney in a rude wrapping.
I think it’s time for you to run after your own tail now.
Slogan/motto:
"Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God."-1 Cor. 10:31 KJV
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerzy
John.
Do yourself a favour.
Check our conversation from the beginning and find out how many of your questions and how many times I have answered and how many of my questions and how many times you didn't answer.
How many times you have asked your questions instead.
This is clearly against the TOL rules and displays your inability to lead a scriptures based discussion but merely offer your baloney in a rude wrapping.
I think it’s time for you to run after your own tail now.
So long, John.
_
Nope-you made that up. You punt time after time. I picked you apart.
Still waiting for you to die-release your own spirit. Can you do that?
Slogan/motto:
"Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God."-1 Cor. 10:31 KJV
Reputation:
May 25th, 2011, 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerzy
Didn't he say this?
Joh 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
Or this
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
No good to pretend being blind:
Mat 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.
Is the Holy Spirit God? Is the Father greater than the Holy Spirit?
I didn't read through the entire discussion so I apologize if my questions have been answered somewhere amidst the bickering. I have two questions that I have struggled with as a Trinitarian (I affirm the Triune God):
1). Is YHWH God the Father or the Triune God?
2). 1 Corinthians 8:6"Yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live."
Why the distinction between God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ? If Jesus were (is) God to Paul, how come he did not say so but made the separate title? However, I think this passage affirms the Trinitarian view that Jesus is God because Paul says that both God the Father and Jesus are the source of all creation and through whom all humanity lives. But why the distinction between the two?
THE FACTS Freed to believe by God's grace Atonement for all Conditional election Total depravity Security in Christ
It is not about Him, (Jesus) dethroning God the Father, it is about Him, (Jesus), coming in the form of flesh; of HIS OWN FREEWILL, choosing from the beginning as GOD to humbly be the EXAMPLE of what His OWN law of agape LOVE would prove to us:
Did you really just write (say) this? Are you biblically brain dead?
Jesus never spoke of His own free will! For the last three years of His life, HE SCREAMED... Not my will... BUT YOURS!!!
Mat 26:39 And He went a little beyond them, and fell on His face and prayed, saying, "My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; yet not as I will, but as You will."
Mar 14:36 And He was saying, "Abba! Father! All things are possible for You; remove this cup from Me; yet not what I will, but what You will."
Ouch, scripture #1
Mat 26:42 He went away again a second time and prayed, saying, "My Father, if this cannot pass away unless I drink it, Your will be done."
Bam! Scripture #2...
Joh 15:10 "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
John 14:10 "Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works (miracles). Just as Acts teaches... Act 2:22 "Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--
Paul
From the cowardice that shrinks from new truth,
From the laziness that is content with half-truths,
From the arrogance that thinks it knows all truth,
Oh God of Truth, deliver us.
~ Ancient Prayer
There is one true God by nature YHWH. The Father is called YHWH, the Son is called YHWH, the Holy Spirit is called YHWH. There are not 3 gods, but 3 personal distinctions within the one God. YHWH can refer to God, triune God, or each member who are all equally God.
Since the Word became flesh, the Father and Son are distinct (contra modalism/oneness heresy). Some verses just talk about God, some about the Father, some about the Son, some about the Father and the Son, etc. Paul understood that Jesus is Lord God. Just because He talks about God and the Lord Jesus or God the Father and the Lord Jesus does not mean that Jesus is not God by nature. Jesus, the God-Man, also talked about God, His Father. A triune understanding explains that each is God, yet personally distinct. In the NT, when God is used alone, it often vs exclusively, refers to the Father. The key is that the Deity of Christ is also taught in the NT, so the triune understanding explains all the evidence.
Know God and make Him known! (YWAM)
They said: "Where is the God of Elijah?"
I say: "Where are the Elijahs of God?" (Ravenhill "Why Revival Tarries")
There is one true God by nature YHWH. The Father is called YHWH, the Son is called YHWH, the Holy Spirit is called YHWH. There are not 3 gods, but 3 personal distinctions within the one God. YHWH can refer to God, triune God, or each member who are all equally God.
So YHWH would be the Triune God, not just simply God the Father? I would probably agree with that. YHWH is the Judeo-Christian God (Triune) in the same idea that Allah is God to the Muslims (though YHWH is the One true God).
Which brings up a different issue with me: how come we do not call him YHWH? Isn't it a beautiful thing to be a on a name-by-name basis with God...why don't we translate his name in Scripture and refer to Him by name, Yhwh?
THE FACTS Freed to believe by God's grace Atonement for all Conditional election Total depravity Security in Christ
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