Why Catholics, Calvinist, Religionist, are NOT Christians
ReligionDiscuss General Theology, Religions and Denominations, God's Attributes, Predestination and Free Will, Dispensationalism, Eschatology, Philosophy, Origins, Archaeology, Science, World History and other such topics.
Slogan/motto:
Sinners cannot save sinners, nor can sinners save themselves.
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Why Catholics, Calvinist, Religionist, are NOT Christians -
February 6th, 2012, 01:37 PM
I am not posting this to make someone mad, even though it probably will.
The reason that I am posting this is to show the religious the error of their ways.
" There is a way that seems right unto a man; but the end thereof are the ways of death," Proverbs 16:25.
Religion is what man adds to the Gospel. To add anything to the Gospel is to pervert the Gospel. It is not the Gospel plus your Catholic religion. It is not the Gospel plus predestinationism which is another Gospel. When one adds something to the Gospel like religion or works, it is an indication that one doesn't really have faith in Christ. Their religion is like a crutch or a safety net that keeps them from trusting completely in Christ.
Religion is like being in a box
When I was a young boy I would find a big box and get in it. I was very comfortable in the box. One day I thought it would be nice to have a fire in the box, that is when I set the side of my Grandfathers house on fire. He quickly put it out with the garden hose. religion is like being in a box, in the box religion you know exactly where everything is at. There is something about rules and laws, boundries, that can make one feel very secure. The thinking is that if I do my religion I will be saved because I am comfortable with it. This is the devils lie.
In the Gospel there is total and complete freedom from laws, rules, and religion.
Jesus said, "If the Son shall make you free, you shall be free indeed," John 8:36. Free from what? To be free from sin is to be free from religion. How does Jesus make us free? Jesus makes us free from laws, rules, religion, by coming into the world as our representative and advocate. By his sinless life he offers to God the Father a life of perfect obedience to his Holy Law. He does this in our name, and on our behalf. It is this life that justifies us, Romans 3:26.
That was not enough. Sin must be atoned for. Because he was the "Lamb of God" without spot or wrinkle he was able to atone for our sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 4:14.
God sees us as perfect and complete in Jesus Christ.
If Jesus has made you perfect and complete in himself then why do you need religion? Do you need religion because you don't believe that what Christ has done was sufficient to save you? Are you uncertain that the work of Christ will save you so instead you are trusting in predestinationism just in case? Whatever that you are trusting in if it is not faith in Christ, it is sin.
Christ in heaven is our assurance that we are saved.
By faith, we who are saved believe that "Jesus is Lord." To believe that "Jesus is Lord" is to believe that Jesus has overcome and has defeated sin, death, and the devil. And that he now sits at the right hand of God victorious over all things, Colossians 2:15. The law has been fulfilled. Sin has been atoned for. We are perfect and complete "In Christ," Colossians 2:10.
An invitation to forsake your religion and to enter into faith.
The table is set. Everything is ready. Your place has been reserved. Come now, and enter into this new way of living by faith. The robe of righteousness that belongs to Christ can be yours, it is God's great free gift, but you must enter in and accept it and make it yours. "For by grace are you saved through faith, and not that of your religion: it is the gift of God," Ephesians 2:8.
Slogan/motto:
Gaudium de veritate (Latin, "Delight in the truth")
Reputation:
February 6th, 2012, 04:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
Why Catholics, Calvinist, Religionist, are NOT Christians
ANSWER: Because they fail to agree with Pate's personal theological preferences and opinions.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
"The very tradition, teaching, & faith of the Catholic Church from the beginning was preached by the Apostles & preserved by the Fathers. On this the Church was founded..." ~ St. Athanasius (4th cent.)
Slogan/motto:
Gaudium de veritate (Latin, "Delight in the truth")
Reputation:
February 6th, 2012, 09:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
Come out of your religious box and get a fresh breath of freedom.
"freedom" = "whatever allows Pate to hold to his particular theological preferences and opinions."
Also, since your comment in no way engaged with the actual content of my post, my statement stands as posted.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
"The very tradition, teaching, & faith of the Catholic Church from the beginning was preached by the Apostles & preserved by the Fathers. On this the Church was founded..." ~ St. Athanasius (4th cent.)
It is not the Gospel plus predestinationism which is another Gospel.
Can you explain to me how Calvinists add predestination to the Gospel? Just because you don't agree with their notion of predestination doesn't mean that they've added it to the Gospel. (Especially considering that predestination in some form is mentioned in the NT.)
Quote:
The thinking is that if I do my religion I will be saved because I am comfortable with it.
Oddly enough, Calvinists don't think they're saved through they're Calvinism.
Have you ever considered that you may be the one in the "box of religion"?
Slogan/motto:
Luke 9:23 Then He said to them all, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me."
"If a sheerly linguistic version of the gospel could be concocted, it would merely so be no longer the gospel. In the Lutheran Reformation’s understanding, which we believe in this matter to be correct, the sacraments make the inalienable externality of the gospel message and therefore are necessary to the authenticity of that message." (Christian Dogmatics [1984], II:302-303 as cited in Pontifications)
Slogan/motto:
Sinners cannot save sinners, nor can sinners save themselves.
Reputation:
February 7th, 2012, 02:17 PM
[quote=sesseltheologe;2953289]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
Can you explain to me how Calvinists add predestination to the Gospel? Just because you don't agree with their notion of predestination doesn't mean that they've added it to the Gospel. (Especially considering that predestination in some form is mentioned in the NT.)
Oddly enough, Calvinists don't think they're saved through they're Calvinism.
Have you ever considered that you may be the one in the "box of religion"?
Whatever you put ahead of the Gospel is another Gospel.
Calvinist believe that they are predestinated to be saved, that is another Gospel.
There is only one way to be saved and that is by faith in Christ. Many Calvinist believe that God makes them or causes them to have faith in Christ. This is really an insult to God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. God must MAKE people to believe on his Son Jesus Christ? Kind of reminds me of a shotgun wedding.
There is no scripture anywhere in the Bible that says God has predestinated anyone to heaven or to hell.
If predestination were a valid doctrine the Bible would be full of it. There is nothing.
Slogan/motto:
Gaudium de veritate (Latin, "Delight in the truth")
Reputation:
February 7th, 2012, 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
There is total freedom in the Gospel.My salvation is not based upon my performance because I am a sinner.My salvation is based upon the performance of Jesus Christ who is my representative.Guess what Cruciform? My representative is in heaven at the right hand of God.Who or what represents you? I don't think that you have one.
As already posted:
"Also, since your comment in no way engaged with the actual content of my post, my statement stands as posted."
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
"The very tradition, teaching, & faith of the Catholic Church from the beginning was preached by the Apostles & preserved by the Fathers. On this the Church was founded..." ~ St. Athanasius (4th cent.)
Slogan/motto:
Gaudium de veritate (Latin, "Delight in the truth")
Reputation:
February 7th, 2012, 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
"There is away that seems right unto a man; but the end thereof are the ways of death," Proverbs 14:12.
This text may just as easily be applied to you. Nice try, though.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
"The very tradition, teaching, & faith of the Catholic Church from the beginning was preached by the Apostles & preserved by the Fathers. On this the Church was founded..." ~ St. Athanasius (4th cent.)
Location: On a sea of glass mixed with fire in front of a throne.
Rep Power: 49676
Christian (Other)
Right Winger
Slogan/motto:
Overcome by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of your testimony; and love not your life unto death.
Reputation:
February 7th, 2012, 03:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Pate
In the Gospel there is total and complete freedom from laws, rules, and religion.
Now try to figure out why your statement is not supported in these verses.
1 Thessalonians 4:1,2,7
1Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.
2For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus.
7For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
Slogan/motto:
Sinners cannot save sinners, nor can sinners save themselves.
Reputation:
February 7th, 2012, 04:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by genuineoriginal
Now try to figure out why your statement is not supported in these verses.
1 Thessalonians 4:1,2,7
1Furthermore then we beseech you, brethren, and exhort you by the Lord Jesus, that as ye have received of us how ye ought to walk and to please God, so ye would abound more and more.
2For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus.
7For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
The scriptures that you listed are mostly law.
The law says that you must do something.
Christians are not under any kind of laws and rules, we are called to live by the Spirit of Christ and not the letter of the law, 2 Corinthians 3:6.
Jesus Christ by his righteous life fulfilled the law for us and removed us from it because it was contrary to us, Colossians 2:14.
February 6th, 2012, 04:56 PM
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