[Colossians]

surnaturel

one can be baptized in the Spirit yet not saved/eternally sealed. Would you agree?
No.

Regeneration is when the 3rd Person baptises one into the 2nd Person, and the Baptism in the Holy Spirit is when the 2nd Person baptises one who is regenerate into the 3rd Person.

Regeneration is primarily an internal matter (it occurs by faith), whereas the Baptism in the Spirit is more overt and often occurs via the laying on of hands. Both baptisms are spiritually-experiential, only the Baptism into Christ (regeneration) is more that which emphasises positional truth, and the Baptism in the Spirit that which emphasises experiential truth and thus power. That being said, those who are baptised in the Spirit are no 'better' than those who are not: all in Christ, whether Baptised in the Spirit or not, are brothers and sisters in Christ.

So when John's gospel says "the Spirit was not yet given", this was not in reference to the Holy Spirit's work of regeneration, but His, shall we say, 'solo' work of power. So the disciples (and Mary and Joseph and David and Esther and Moses etc) all had the Holy Spirit unto regeneration. Pentecost then brought in the power.

Now....the important point is that just because one has come to Christ since Pentecost, this does not mean he has received the Baptism of power (the Baptism in the Holy Spirit). It simply means he is in the same position as those I have mentioned who were before Pentecost: he is regenerate and therefore baptised by the Spirit into Christ. Whether he is subsequently baptised by Christ into the Spirit unto power, is God's concern.

So most believers today are in the same position as the OT believers and the disciples prior to Pentecost: they are regenerate by the work of the Holy Spirit (they are baptised by the 3rd Person into the 2nd Person), but the Holy Spirit has not yet come upon them unto power (they are not yet baptised by the 2nd Person into the 3rd Person).

Anecdotally then, prior to Pentecost the 12 were "disciples" (followers); after Pentecost they were "apostles" (embassadors). For the Holy Spirit into whom they were baptised at Pentecost, is the exhaustive proxi of Christ.

[Colossians]

B57,

The Sealing of the Holy Spirit is a figure of speech that indicates that the Elect are secured in the Truth of the Gospel against being successfully seduced from it
No. The seal he is referring to occurs, if it occurs, after one believes, and is experiential, not positional.

This is the verse:

"In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise"

So he is speaking of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit, as I have described above at post #61.

Paul is speaking to the Ephesians of a distinct post-salvific experience of the Holy Spirit. He is speaking of the promise of the Spirit which had not been given prior to Pentecost.

[Lazy afternoon]

Originally Posted by Colossians

B57,

The Sealing of the Holy Spirit is a figure of speech that indicates that the Elect are secured in the Truth of the Gospel against being successfully seduced from it
No. The seal he is referring to occurs, if it occurs, after one believes, and is experiential, not positional.

This is the verse:

"In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise"

So he is speaking of the Baptism in the Holy Spirit, as I have described above at post #61.

Paul is speaking to the Ephesians of a distinct post-salvific experience of the Holy Spirit. He is speaking of the promise of the Spirit which had not been given prior to Pentecost.

Jesus spoke of Himself and His Father coming to abide in the believer as one event.

The receiving of the Holy Spirit to indwell the believer is that event.

The Samarians were as OT believers were for a while after their baptism. They did not receive the Holy Spirit at all at their believing and baptism.

There was one event of the shekinah glory initial filling of the temple , not two.

Most believers today are not filled with the Holy Spirit. Look at their conversation.

LA