[Princely]

Keep seeking.

The Lord who sent me says this;

"My chosen ones shall inherit the land ,my servants shall dwell there."

"Zion shall be redeemed by judgement and all her repentant one by justice."

"The Lord fills Zion with justice and right and the riches that save her are wisdom and knowledge, her treasure is the fear of the Lord."

That's the word of the Lord who sent me. I am the good shepherd, I know my sheep and my sheep know me, just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; To these sheep I will give my life.

You are not my sheep. I do not know you.

No one can come to me unless the Lord who sent me draws him.

[beloved57]

Acts 22:14

14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

We see that the Elect, as Paul is an Illustration of, is Chosen to Hear God's or Christ's Voice, and this Spiritually. This coincides with Christ saying that His Sheep shall hear His voice via the Gospel.

Secondly, they are Chosen to Know God's Will, Spiritually and Experientially. Col 1:9

For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

For this cause they receive a Spirit of revelation

Eph 1:17

That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:



Eph 1:9

Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

[beloved57]

Acts 22:14

14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

The word for see here is the greek word eidō and is the same word used for see in Jn 3:3


3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

And the word does mean understand; But Paul saw Him both with the eye of understanding through the New Birth, and He of course saw Him Physically with His own eyes on the road to damascus, which qualified Him to be an Apostle.

However all the Elect of God, whom Christ did die for, have been Chosen to see Jesus with the eye of understanding through New Birth ; for to see Jesus is to see the Kingdom of God, and this seeing is a precursory to believing in Him Jn 6:40

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jesus through His Ministers does open their eyes, the eyes of their understanding Acts 26:28

18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Eph 1:18

The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

[Princely]

It is written;

The Lord is the strength of his people; the saving refuge of his anointed.

For the word of the Lord is upright, and all his works are truthful. He loves justice and right;

The Lord is good; blessed are those who take refuge in him. Revere the Lord, you his holy ones, for nothing is lacking to those who revere Him. The great grow poor and hungry but those who seek the Lord want for no good thing.

The Lord has eyes for the just, and ears for there cry. When the just cry out, the Lord hears them, and rescues them from all distress.

Trust in the Lord, and do good; so you will live in the land, and enjoy security. Take delight in the Lord, and he will give you the desires of your heart. Commit your way to the Lord; trust in him, and he will act. He will make justice dawn for you like the light; bright as the noon day will be your vindication.

The meek shall inherit the land, and delight themselves in abundant peace.

Depart from evil, and do good; so you shall abide forever. For the Lord loves justice; he will not forsake his faithful ones. The righteous shall be kept safe forever, but the children of the wicked shall be cut off. The righteous shall inherit the land, and live in it forever. The just man’s mouth speaks wisdom, and their tongues speak what is right. The law of their God is in their hearts; their steps do not stumble.

That's the Lord who lives in me and I in Him.

I am the resurrection and the Life, anyone who believes in me even though he died will come to life and anyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. The Lord and I are One.

[ttruscott]

Well, I got to post #28 and decided to say that I accept all this about election EXCEPT the meaning of the foundation of the world and foreknowledge as being in a time before our creation.

1. First we were created as ingenuous immocent spirits in the spirit world.

3. Then the earth was created along with the physical universe.

In between these two creations is

2. the time called before the foundation of the world and from the beginning, the time of HIS foreknowledge and election of HIS people.

Peace,
Ted

[beloved57]

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 2 Tim 1:9


9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Those who were chosen in Christ before the foundation [Eph 1:4] are the ones also given to Him by the Father to give unto them eternal life Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

He shouldn't give it [eternal life] to all without exception, but to only as many as given to Him Eph 1:4 !

So these would be given to Him as a reward for His suffering, which was the Joy set before Him Heb 12:2, they were given also to come to Him in Faith as for His Reward Jn 6:37

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Those who do come to Christ in Faith had been given of the Father, and so it was given to them [who come] to believe on His Name, not for their sakes, but for Christ's behalf Phil 1:29

29 For unto you[That Believe] it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Notice, it is given in behalf of Christ ! Thats because believers are given to Christ as The Father's Reward to Him for His Cross Work. Ps 2:8

8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

All Saints are Christ's Inheritance Eph 1:18, neither does it matter if they are the Son's Inheritance or the Fathers because Jesus did say Jn 17:10

And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

Now those given to Christ by the Father before time, is the foundational cause for which they come to Him in time, so that it comes to past as Per 2 Tim 2:19

19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his[His Inheritance]. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

BTW this excludes these from ever being the Lords, those He knows Matt 7:23

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Now this departing from iniquity as per 2 Tim 2:19 for those who are Christ's and He knows that are His, this departing from iniquity is effected by His Redeeming Death for them as Per Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

For it is of the Righteousness of God that the Son of His Love has in possession those he purchased with His own Blood ! And so Faith is alloted to them all 2 Pet 1:1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Thats why it is said of Paul it is given to believe on Christ on Christ's Behalf Phil 1:29 !

[beloved57]

Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

Those given to Christ, that do come to Him or do believe in Him, as it is evidenced by His Chosen disciples that were presently before Him when He was saying these words of Jn 17, now if any of those given Him by His Father, be lost, then He has failed His Fathers will for Him, for it is written Jn 6:37-38

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will/desire/pleasure of him that sent me.

39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.


Now vs 39 is in regards to all the Father hath chosen in Him Eph 1:4

And vs 40

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

again emphasizes those Chosen, with the added comment of what is the result or effect of God's choice of them, they see [spiritually] the Son and Believe in Him. They must see Him because, as the father gave them to Him, He also Gave Him to them as a Covenant to them, which results in this Isa 42:6-7

I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Yes, once their blind eyes are opened from their natural state of blindness, they see the Son, and Believe in Him as their Salvation, but if just one for whom was given to Him by the Father, should perish and be lost, Christ did fail His Father's will, desire, and pleasure; and those false teachers that teach that Christ died for any who shall be lost, they do preach Christ as a failure of His Father's will, which is Blasphemy at it's Highest. Simply Put, if we believe any for whom Christ died shall perish in their sins, we do blaspheme !

[beloved57]

1 Cor 1:30

30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

Of Him the Father are any in Christ Jesus [ by which in Him is No Condemnation Rom 8:1], it is because of the Father's choice of some of us, that we are in Christ, and this choice was before the foundation of the World Eph 1:3-4

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

This Choice of the Father is also called Sanctification by the Father according to Jude 1:1

Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

Whereby, by His Eternal Purpose of Election, He set us apart for His Son Jesus Christ. This Truth is also seen in Christ's Parable here Matt 22:1-5

And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,

2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,

3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.

5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:

But vs 14 lets us know that all were not chosen Matt 22:14

14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

And those few are those here Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

[godzilla]

And you just so happen to be one of His elect?

[beloved57]

Originally Posted by godzilla

And you just so happen to be one of His elect?

Deal with the scripture, this is not about me !

[beloved57]

Eph 1:7

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Whose the we here Paul is referring to ? Its those Chosen in Christ before the foundation Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

That the Redemption God gives is only for the Elect People is seen from the OT Scriptures which gives a Covenant Command Ps 130:7-8

7 Let Israel hope in the Lord: for with the Lord there is mercy, and with him is plenteous redemption.

8 And he shall redeem Israel from all his iniquities.

Israel is another name for God's Elect. Notice vs7, Its only the Elect that are called to Hope in God, and to find Mercy in Redemption, and only the Elect [Israel] that is promised to be redeemed from all His iniquties.

Its Israel or the Elect here also Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Remember who Paul is writing to here in Titus ! Titus 1:1-2

Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Notice that the promise in Ps 130:8 for Israel is this:

8 And he shall redeem Israel from all his iniquities.

And notice what Christ came to do in His Death for His Elect in Titus 2:14

that he might redeem us from all iniquity !

You see its the same thing, to redeem from all iniquity a certain People, the Elect of God or the Israel of God. This also means that Israel and the Church are the same !

[beloved57]

1 Jn 2:1

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

It is no secret that God's Elect are great sinners, simply because they as all men are, born sinners, and are by nature enemies to God and what is all Holy and Righteous, But, Christ who died and rose in their behalf will always defend them before God's Law and Justice from all deserving accusations !

This is vividly set forth with the case of Joshua the High Priest of the Lord Zech 3:1-4

And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

2 And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

Joshua the High Priest was wearing filthy garments, analogous of all God's People by nature, and no doubt satan the accuser of the brethren had brought accusation against him Rev 12:9-10

9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Now there is no doubt Joshua as well as all the Elect of God can be accused of something amiss in their lives here in this flesh Rom 7:18-19

18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.

However notice the response from the Lord, for the Lord did not deny the filthiness of His Servant, but said:

The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even [b]the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee

Yes, God pointed out that Joshua was part of that special Chosen People, the Jerusalem of God, even those Chosen in Christ Eph 1:4, in essence the Lord was echoing Paul's words here Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

And then the Lord gives us to see, that He has clothed His Chosen People with His Own special woven Garments for them to wear

The Lord said

4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

Notice, God has taken away his iniquity, which speaks of the completed Work of Christ for the sins of His People, and then He clothes us with His Garments of Salvation, which is Christ's Righteousness Imputed to us ! Isa 61:10

I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels.

You see that ? Thats Free Grace , that is The Election of grace. The Lord Jesus Christ defends as a Defensive Attorney, an Advocate in the Court of law, all the Chosen of God, the Election of Grace, no matter how sinful it they can be seen to be, simply because they are the Chosen, as such, converted or not, believers or not, they are Reconciled to God [In His Law and Justice] and Clothed in the Imputed Righteousness of Christ !

[beloved57]

Jn 10:16

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

That Election gives one a special interest in Christ before they believe in Him, because even before they do so, Christ claims them as His Own " Other Sheep I have"

This word have is the greek word echo and means:

to have, i.e. to hold

to have i.e. own, possess

to be closely joined to a person or a thing

And its rendered in the present tense, Other Sheep I am having or owning !

And this True of them before hearing His Voice which is a prerequisite before believing, even before they listen to Him or Hearken; But the key here is that before such, He still is having them by Election ! Eph 1:4 In fact, If Christ had no interest in His Sheep by Election, for His Father gave them Him Jn 10:29a " My Father, which gave them me" there would have been no basis for Him to die for them and redeem them !

[beloved57]

Limited Atonement and Election !


The fact that God called and separated Israel from the rest of the Nations of Mankind, and even in that Nation called in Abraham Gen 12:1-3, there was only a remnant of the True Chosen to Salvation Matt 22:14

For many are called, but few are chosen.

Rom 9:27

Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

BTW, this scripture confirms that God never purposed to save all Israel the ethnic Nation !

So God's Salvation is restricted to God's Purpose of Election, His Israel Spiritual Isa 45:17

But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

Rom 9:11

For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

For God has only promised to save Israel, that is why the Apostle to the Gentiles said Acts 13:23

Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus:

Isa 45:15

Verily thou art a God that hidest thyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

And even as God's saving Purpose went beyond the physical boundaries of the called nation israel, and into the other Nations of the World, it was still only to gather in Israel or the Elect among the Nations, so we see language like this Rom 11:26

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

And once all Israel is gathered and saved, that is God saving His World, the Total Collection of the Israel of God !

And we never understand the True God aright until we are made to bow and embrace the Gospel Truth of God's Gracious Sovereign unconditional Election, and that it is not purposed that God gives Saving Grace equally to all men without exception, for with some He did Purpose Rom 9:11, and the rest He did not Rom 11:7, according to His Own Will, and if this True fact is not settled in the heart, and you even find yourself in opposition to it, you serve an idol of your own imagination and not the God of Israel, who is the God of the Whole Earth ! Isa 54:5

For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.

[beloved57]

Unconditonal discrminatory Election does not make God a respector of persons, for if that was the case, it could not be rightfully called The Election of Grace Rom 11:5

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

And to top that off, His Election of Grace has not been restricted to just one particular ethnicity, but it accounts for The redeemed that is out of every nation, tongue, kindred and people Rev 5:9

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

And these all constitute the Israel of God

Notice vs 10

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Now who was this said to before ? Ex 19:6

And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

Now Rev 5:10 has been renedered thusly:

ESV and you have made them a kingdom and priests to our God, and they shall reign on the earth.”