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But I don't think Jesus really approves of weapons designed with sole purpose of killing people, so hand guns and all other anti personnel weapons are a no no for me.
Yeah. Jesus would rather you just bash their heads in with a hammer.
Slogan/motto:
Don't look back; something may be gaining on you.
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 08:48 PM
WARNING: STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS APPROACHING...
You might as well ask if Christ is against screwdrivers. It's a chunk of metal...A machine...It is not a free moral agent...It has no moral value.
I gotta tell you. Things like this just kill me. Is Christ against guns?...Is HE against bows & arrows...What about Silly Putty?...What about knives? If I hear one more time about "Hurrdurr handgunz r dezined to kill peoplez only so dey bad" I'm seriously going to retch.
ALL guns are designed to kill...period. Not people...not animals...but both and neither...IT'S A THING!
The stupidity just kills me...and that's what it is...stupidity.
The firearm is the current state of the art of weaponry. What started with rocks...sharp rocks....sharp rocks with handles....poor quality metal beaten into sharp shapes...small sharp shapes which can be hurled, either by sling or by energy stored in a streched bow...small sharp shapes which can be hurled by the energy stored in gunpowder.
Did we have big knives?...Yup swords.
Did we have small knives....Yup daggers.
Do you really think a gun is any different? I'm going to stab you to death....with bullets.
The technology has advanced. When weapons advance in technology they become smaller, more powerful and strike from a greater distance. That is ALL there is to it.
Many many years from now when we are all surrounded by our own little energy bubbles which protect us individually from any and all physical impurities and assaults some people will be wringing their hands over those palm sized Ion Pulse Generators because "OMG dey iz dezined to kill peoplez!!!!1!!"
Big gun...small gun...I took a handgun into the brush with me every single time I went hunting...along with my rifle in case I had to go into really thick stuff after an animal I had wounded. When I get home the handgun is by my bedside.
Yanno why?
BECAUSE IT FITS ON THE TABLE!!!
Due to it's small size it is, as well, more manageable and easier to retain than a long gun in close quarters. If the quarters get closer than a knife is the superior weapon as the distance advantage that technology gives you vanishes. Move things away some and a long gun becomes increasingly necessary as a handgun (due to it's limited sight radius and ammunition power) loses the edge that it had previously. Now the rifle had the edge....the handgun is limited...the knife useless.
I think CHRIST is more concerned with our hearts than our inanimate objects. It's our hearts which move the objects toward their eventual uses.
If people want to fuss about outlawing objects for whatever reason then go ahead but do you think we can refrain from assigning a moral value to a chunk of metal?...Really?
Destroy another fetus now, we don't like children anyhow, I've seen the future baby......... It is Murder.
~Leonard Cohen
To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.
~Ted Nugent
Slogan/motto:
Don't look back; something may be gaining on you.
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 08:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by This Charming Manc
But I don't think Jesus really approves of weapons designed with sole purpose of killing people, so hand guns and all other anti personnel weapons are a no no for me.
Alright...then we are agreed that anti-material weapons are cool.
I'll pick up my Barrett .50BMG tomorrow!
Well yeah, it can be used against people...but that's not what it was designed for.
Destroy another fetus now, we don't like children anyhow, I've seen the future baby......... It is Murder.
~Leonard Cohen
To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.
~Ted Nugent
Slogan/motto:
Don't look back; something may be gaining on you.
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 08:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by steko
TomO's packin' a 'rod'.
He has for a looong time.
Destroy another fetus now, we don't like children anyhow, I've seen the future baby......... It is Murder.
~Leonard Cohen
To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.
~Ted Nugent
You might as well ask if Christ is against screwdrivers. It's a chunk of metal...A machine...It is not a free moral agent...It has no moral value.
I gotta tell you. Things like this just kill me. Is Christ against guns?...Is HE against bows & arrows...What about Silly Putty?...What about knives? If I hear one more time about "Hurrdurr handgunz r dezined to kill peoplez only so dey bad" I'm seriously going to retch.
ALL guns are designed to kill...period. Not people...not animals...but both and neither...IT'S A THING!
The stupidity just kills me...and that's what it is...stupidity.
The firearm is the current state of the art of weaponry. What started with rocks...sharp rocks....sharp rocks with handles....poor quality metal beaten into sharp shapes...small sharp shapes which can be hurled, either by sling or by energy stored in a streched bow...small sharp shapes which can be hurled by the energy stored in gunpowder.
Did we have big knives?...Yup swords.
Did we have small knives....Yup daggers.
Do you really think a gun is any different? I'm going to stab you to death....with bullets.
The technology has advanced. When weapons advance in technology they become smaller, more powerful and strike from a greater distance. That is ALL there is to it.
Many many years from now when we are all surrounded by our own little energy bubbles which protect us individually from any and all physical impurities and assaults some people will be wringing their hands over those palm sized Ion Pulse Generators because "OMG dey iz dezined to kill peoplez!!!!1!!"
Big gun...small gun...I took a handgun into the brush with me every single time I went hunting...along with my rifle in case I had to go into really thick stuff after an animal I had wounded. When I get home the handgun is by my bedside.
Yanno why?
BECAUSE IT FITS ON THE TABLE!!!
Due to it's small size it is, as well, more manageable and easier to retain than a long gun in close quarters. If the quarters get closer than a knife is the superior weapon as the distance advantage that technology gives you vanishes. Move things away some and a long gun becomes increasingly necessary as a handgun (due to it's limited sight radius and ammunition power) loses the edge that it had previously. Now the rifle had the edge....the handgun is limited...the knife useless.
I think CHRIST is more concerned with our hearts than our inanimate objects. It's our hearts which move the objects toward their eventual uses.
If people want to fuss about outlawing objects for whatever reason then go ahead but do you think we can refrain from assigning a moral value to a chunk of metal?...Really?
Slogan/motto:
Luke 9:23 Then He said to them all, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me."
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 09:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomO
If people want to fuss about outlawing objects for whatever reason then go ahead but do you think we can refrain from assigning a moral value to a chunk of metal?...Really?
Guns have an intended purpose like you said: to kill. Asking, "Is Christ against guns?" is apparently asking whether God is against the intent behind guns and why. Reading the topic as whether we ought to outlaw an arbitrary object without a mind towards the intention behind that object (the "final cause" in Aristotelian language) is misreading it imo.
And really the idea that it is "Just an object, neutral in its own right" doesn't even necessarily ring true. Throw a few of these "neutral objects" among the toys at daycare and see what happens. The idea led to the gun, and the gun leads back to the idea.
"If a sheerly linguistic version of the gospel could be concocted, it would merely so be no longer the gospel. In the Lutheran Reformation’s understanding, which we believe in this matter to be correct, the sacraments make the inalienable externality of the gospel message and therefore are necessary to the authenticity of that message." (Christian Dogmatics [1984], II:302-303 as cited in Pontifications)
Slogan/motto:
"All life is illusion, and limitation is a mental construct that can be altered anytime."
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 09:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomO
WARNING: STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS APPROACHING...
You might as well ask if Christ is against screwdrivers. It's a chunk of metal...A machine...It is not a free moral agent...It has no moral value.
I gotta tell you. Things like this just kill me. Is Christ against guns?...Is HE against bows & arrows...What about Silly Putty?...What about knives? If I hear one more time about "Hurrdurr handgunz r dezined to kill peoplez only so dey bad" I'm seriously going to retch.
ALL guns are designed to kill...period. Not people...not animals...but both and neither...IT'S A THING!
The stupidity just kills me...and that's what it is...stupidity.
The firearm is the current state of the art of weaponry. What started with rocks...sharp rocks....sharp rocks with handles....poor quality metal beaten into sharp shapes...small sharp shapes which can be hurled, either by sling or by energy stored in a streched bow...small sharp shapes which can be hurled by the energy stored in gunpowder.
Did we have big knives?...Yup swords.
Did we have small knives....Yup daggers.
Do you really think a gun is any different? I'm going to stab you to death....with bullets.
The technology has advanced. When weapons advance in technology they become smaller, more powerful and strike from a greater distance. That is ALL there is to it.
Many many years from now when we are all surrounded by our own little energy bubbles which protect us individually from any and all physical impurities and assaults some people will be wringing their hands over those palm sized Ion Pulse Generators because "OMG dey iz dezined to kill peoplez!!!!1!!"
Big gun...small gun...I took a handgun into the brush with me every single time I went hunting...along with my rifle in case I had to go into really thick stuff after an animal I had wounded. When I get home the handgun is by my bedside.
Yanno why?
BECAUSE IT FITS ON THE TABLE!!!
Due to it's small size it is, as well, more manageable and easier to retain than a long gun in close quarters. If the quarters get closer than a knife is the superior weapon as the distance advantage that technology gives you vanishes. Move things away some and a long gun becomes increasingly necessary as a handgun (due to it's limited sight radius and ammunition power) loses the edge that it had previously. Now the rifle had the edge....the handgun is limited...the knife useless.
I think CHRIST is more concerned with our hearts than our inanimate objects. It's our hearts which move the objects toward their eventual uses.
If people want to fuss about outlawing objects for whatever reason then go ahead but do you think we can refrain from assigning a moral value to a chunk of metal?...Really?
Yeeha TomO, give'em hell!
Do not go gentile into that good night. D.Thomas
Out, Out, Brief Candle! Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player, That struts and frets his hour upon the stage, And then is heard no more, It is a tale told by an idiot, Full of sound and fury, Signifying nothing. W.S.
Well. I noticed that Revelation and Jesus were mentioned earlier and all I could think was that swords are sure to get in. I mean, one comes out of Jesus' mouth for cryin' out loud (Revelation 19:15). I'm golden.
Eucharist [thanksgiving] is the state of the perfect man. Eucharist is the life of paradise. Eucharist is the only full and real response of man to God's creation, redemption, and gift of heaven. - Alexander Schemann
Course, steko has to try to ruin my fun by posting that passage from Isaiah...
Eucharist [thanksgiving] is the state of the perfect man. Eucharist is the life of paradise. Eucharist is the only full and real response of man to God's creation, redemption, and gift of heaven. - Alexander Schemann
Slogan/motto:
Luke 9:23 Then He said to them all, “If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me."
Reputation:
July 10th, 2012, 09:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tambora
Yeah. Jesus would rather you just bash their heads in with a hammer.
Just kidding. (or am I?)
I think a fairly good and analogous argument could be made against guns by merely changing the thread title to, "Do you believe Christ is against nuclear warheads?"
From a statistical vantage point, modern weaponry increases variance and exacerbates the problems related to the fallenness of humanity.
"If a sheerly linguistic version of the gospel could be concocted, it would merely so be no longer the gospel. In the Lutheran Reformation’s understanding, which we believe in this matter to be correct, the sacraments make the inalienable externality of the gospel message and therefore are necessary to the authenticity of that message." (Christian Dogmatics [1984], II:302-303 as cited in Pontifications)
I think a fairly good and analogous argument could be made against guns by merely changing the thread title to, "Do you believe Christ is against nuclear warheads?"
From a statistical vantage point, modern weaponry increases variance and exacerbates the problems related to the fallenness of humanity.
Your opinion is noted.
My opinion is that it is time for the sleeping giant to wake up again.
Mt 26:52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place:
for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
Beareth the Sword. . . .
Ro 13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
-------------------
Christians are supposed to Obey the Police and be humble and obedient.
And no mention of futuristic weapons that I know of. Maybe I'm wrong? WMD's? Underwear bombs? Guns? Heat-seeking missiles? Nuclear submarines?
"There was so much handwriting on the wall that even the wall fell down"
"In the long run of history, the censor and the inquisitor have always lost. The only sure weapon against bad ideas is better ideas. The source of better ideas is wisdom. The surest path to wisdom is a liberal education." – Alfred Whitney, Essays on Education
Don't you know
That it ain't a crime
If all the squares
And the junkmen
Think you're out of line
Slogan/motto:
Don't look back; something may be gaining on you.
Reputation:
July 11th, 2012, 04:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zippy2006
Guns have an intended purpose like you said: to kill. Asking, "Is Christ against guns?" is apparently asking whether God is against the intent behind guns and why.
Sooo...GOD is against killing...period?
HE must be a tad confused then because HE sure ordered alot of it if that's the case.
Quote:
Reading the topic as whether we ought to outlaw an arbitrary object without a mind towards the intention behind that object (the "final cause" in Aristotelian language) is misreading it imo.
Hear, hear...Perhaps you will support my campaign to have GPS devices outlawed. Their original intent was to make missiles more accurate...ta kill...yanno?
ITT The Wifes Garmin is a tool uf da debil.
Get rid of that space program too...it began with the V2 rocket.
Quote:
And really the idea that it is "Just an object, neutral in its own right" doesn't even necessarily ring true. Throw a few of these "neutral objects" among the toys at daycare and see what happens.
Incredible.
I would rather have a pile of verifiably unloaded firearms in the middle of a daycare than one single lawnmower fully fueled and ready to go with a pushbutton start.
OMG!...We have to outlaw these evil mowers! THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!1!
Quote:
The idea led to the gun, and the gun leads back to the idea.
So go ahead and beat your sword into a plowshare before the appointed time...Mamoru Takuma will kill you and you loved ones just as easily with a plowshare.
Destroy another fetus now, we don't like children anyhow, I've seen the future baby......... It is Murder.
~Leonard Cohen
To my mind it is wholly irresponsible to go into the world incapable of preventing violence, injury, crime, and death. How feeble is the mindset to accept defenselessness. How unnatural. How cheap. How cowardly. How pathetic.
~Ted Nugent
You might as well ask if Christ is against screwdrivers. It's a chunk of metal...A machine...It is not a free moral agent...It has no moral value.
I gotta tell you. Things like this just kill me. Is Christ against guns?...Is HE against bows & arrows...What about Silly Putty?...What about knives? If I hear one more time about "Hurrdurr handgunz r dezined to kill peoplez only so dey bad" I'm seriously going to retch.
Did we have big knives?...Yup swords.
Big gun...small gun...I took a handgun into the brush with me every single time I went hunting...along with my rifle in case I had to go into really thick stuff after an animal I had wounded. When I get home the handgun is by my bedside.
Due to it's small size it is, as well, more manageable and easier to retain than a long gun in close quarters. If the quarters get closer than a knife is the superior weapon as the distance advantage that technology gives you vanishes. Move things away some and a long gun becomes increasingly necessary as a handgun (due to it's limited sight radius and ammunition power) loses the edge that it had previously. Now the rifle had the edge....the handgun is limited...the knife useless.
I think CHRIST is more concerned with our hearts than our inanimate objects. It's our hearts which move the objects toward their eventual uses.
Alright...then we are agreed that anti-material weapons are cool.
He has for a looong time.
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