TheologyOnline, religion, politics, forum
Go Back   Theology Online | Christian Forums & More > The Coliseum > The Grandstands
Reload this Page POST GAME SHOW - Battle Royale III
The Grandstands The grandstands are where we in the "peanut gallery" can discuss the battle.

View Poll Results: Who Won Battle Royale III?
Jerry Shugart 28 60.87%
Dee Dee Warren 18 39.13%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  (#181) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 10:02 AM

Dee Dee,

Do you still remain under the illusion that the kingdom has already been put into place?If so,perhaps you will enlighten us as to when the Apostle´s ate and drank at the Lord´s table,and when the Apostles sat on their thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

And why would you want to move all this discussion to another place?This is obviously the appropriate place to hold this discussion,Dee Dee.

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#182) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 10:08 AM

Jerry I would still like your answer to my proposal. And as to the why... first of all, I told you that I am taking somewhat of a break, so I will not be able to start right away... and this thread is not about a continued Debate between you and I, it is about the one that was for 10 Rounds that is now over. Anything further I do with you was not part of the bargain and would be over and above what we both agreed to do. Additionally, though I am glad to continue to take you on head to head, it would not be anything "official" and it is my understanding that such "unofficial" battles go to the Back Alley. That is what that area was created for.

So, I would still like an answer to my proposal.



   
Reply With Quote
  (#183) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 10:31 AM

Dee Dee,

Do what you want to do.I am going to contiue to demonstrate that your brag that you thrashed me was only that--a brag.

Words are cheap!

I will continue to prove that your position is unscriptual and it is up to you whether or not you wish to defend your position.That is completely up to you.

No one forced you into this debate and no one is forcing you to defend your unscriptual ideas.I surely would not blame you if you decided that it is prudent not to attempt to defend the indefensible.

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#184) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 10:35 AM

Jerry that is not an answer. Of course no one forced either of us into the Debate... I am glad we did it, and it was great fun. If you remember, I asked you personally to be my opponent. So please the melodramatics are not warranted.... I would like to continue with you but I had some requests that I provided you the link to. I am happy to continue to debate you, all I am asking is if those terms are acceptable to you and if you have any of your own. Are they or are they not?? I am willing to continue to debate you indefinitely with those proposals in place and am willing to hear whatever ground rules you would like as well.

Please answer the question.



   
Reply With Quote
  (#185) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 10:38 AM

To be honest, to use some of your terminology here, I think that you realize that I am on limited time right now so you are trying to come across as all big and tough and agressive because you know that I will not answer you right now. That is a very cheap and transparent tactic. I am offering you my indefinite attention for an extended debate.... you should jump at that chance but apparently you just want to try and take pot shots while your opponent is distracted with other business. I would not do that to you, but again, that is your business I suppose. Are you willing to continue a semi-structured debate indefinitely??



   
Reply With Quote
  (#186) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 10:57 AM

Dee Dee,

Well,if anyone is an expert on "cheap tactics",it is you.And please notice that I was agressive BEFORE you said that you were taking a rest.It is obvious that you became disinterested in answering my points after you realized that you could not provide an answer.

Now let us get down to business and cease from stalling around and avoiding the issues.If you think that you thrashed me,then these points I have raised should be no problem for you at all.

If the kingdom is now in place,as you maintain,then WHEN did the Apostles sit at the table of the Lord and when did they judge the twelve tribes of Israel?

If you choose not to answer,that is fine.I will simply continue to punch holes in your false teaching.From now on I will not respond to any points unless they are in reference to the questions raised in the debate.

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#187) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 11:05 AM

Jerry it is a simple question.... I am willing to engage in further debate with you, but I do insist on those ground rules I already posted along with any that you may have. And your points are laughably no problem at all, but due to the experience I already have with you, I insist upon those ground rules. Can you agree or not?? Or are you just posturing?? I think it is the latter, but who knows, maybe you seriously want to continue. I rather doubt it..... you prefer to capitalize on a situation when you know your opponent will not respond. cheap, cheap, cheap



   
Reply With Quote
  (#188) Old
Revelation717 Revelation717 is offline
Journeyman
 Revelation717's Avatar

 


Reputation:
Revelation717 is an unknown quantity at this point
September 19th, 2002, 11:14 AM

Well Jerry,

I see you keep right on posting but wil not offer the quotes I asked you for. Pretty sad, I gave you that opportunity to see how you mouth is full of lies but for some reason you wont or cannot do the same for me.

You ask some questions and I'd be happy to respond.

You keep saying God has not cast off ETHNIC Israel and provide some quotes concerning God's people to support this:

But you still need to answer the questions I asked, which when understood you can clearly see God has not forsaken His people, never did and they are not limited to ETHNIC Israel.

Doesn't even bother you that you have to keep putting in YOUR own word ETHNIC to make a point? The Bible never says God has not cast away the nation of Israel" but His people.

So who are His people?

From the beginning of the Bible we can see there are only two types of people in this world.

Believers and unbelievers, God's children and the devil's children, children of light and children of darkness.

Jesus told the Jews in John Chapter 8 they were NOT of God and children of the devil.

Did not God (Jesus) right then and there tell them they were not His?

Yes as a matter of fact and Scripture He did.

You kep mentioning the wheat and tares like your on to something but you are so blind you don't even see or cannot see that there is nowhere that it says the tare (unbeliever) somehow becomes wheat. Let alone the fact the parable alludes to nothing of ETHNIC Israel, but keeps in rythm with the theme of the Bible believers and non believers. Period.


"For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God;the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto Himself,above all people who are upon the face of the earth...the Lord brought you out with a mighty hand,and redeemed you out of the house of bondage,from the hand of Pharaoh,king of Egypt"(Deut.6:6,8).

1Pe:2:5: Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
1Pe:2:6: Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
1Pe:2:7: Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
1Pe:2:8: And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
1Pe:2:9: But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
1Pe:2:10: Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God:
which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy

God has not cast off HIs people, the Jew can be grafted BACK in IF he believes but not UNTIL.

BUT ETHNIC Israel has no seperate salvation outside of belief in Jesus. PERIOD>





Oh man, would ya look at this...we got alot of work to do!
   
Reply With Quote
  (#189) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 11:33 AM

In the debate Dee Dee continued to insist that the Apostles lived to see the Lord Jesus coming in HIs kingdom.But how can that be?The Lord Himself told His Apostles that they would share His table in the kingdom and in the kingdom they would judge the twelve tribes of Israel.

That did not happen.So it is obvious that the kingdom has not yet been put into place on the earth.And by the Scriptual passages that describe the kingdom that will be put in place on earth,it is obvious that the kingdom remains in the future:

"Behold,the days come,saith the Lord,that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch,and a King shall execute justice and righteousness in the earth"(Jer.23:5).

"They shall not hurt nor destroy in all My holy mountain,for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord,as the waters cover the sea"(Isa.11:9).

During His kingdom rule the earth will be full of the knowledge of the Lord.It is clear that that is not the case today.And who would dare imagine (except perhaps Dee Dee) that the Lord has executed justice and righteousness in the earth during these troubling times?

No,the teaching that we are now living in the kingdom is an illusion shared by those who have been decived by the false teaching of man.

The following verses surely have not been fulfilled,because the ungodly on earth have not yet received their just dues:

"Ask of Me,and I shall give Thee the nations for Thy inheritance,and the uttermost parts of the earth for Thy possession.

"Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron;thou shalt dash them in pieces likea potter´s vessel"(Ps.2:8,9).

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#190) Old
cirisme
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 12:34 PM

Jerry,
Based on your position about salvation, I genuinely hope you got it right, or you have much to fear.

If, as you say, anyone does not follow God perfectly(which just means agree with you) they are bound to hell.

I believe that hell does not have literal fire, does that send me to hell?

I believe in following God fully, and since He is the expert I'll be fine following what He says and not what you say.



   
Reply With Quote
  (#191) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 12:35 PM

Jerry I know which of the stipulations just frightens you to death... my insistence that you go "quote" and "answer" style. If you are disarmed of your own weapon of dodging the points that you cannot answer, then you lose even more easily. I thought that one would get stuck in your craw.



   
Reply With Quote
  (#192) Old
Dee Dee Warren
Guest

 


Reputation:
September 19th, 2002, 12:37 PM

Hey AJ: Did you see that Optimus has the same avatar as you?? That got me really confused for a minute... I had to do a double-take on the name.



   
Reply With Quote
  (#193) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 12:42 PM

cirisme,

Could I ask you to refrain from putting words in my mouth that I never said?

I said that one must BELIEVE GOD in order to be saved.It is not about FOLLOWING God perfectly,as you say,but instead it is about BELIEVING His word.

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#194) Old
Jerry Shugart Jerry Shugart is offline
TOL Legend
 Jerry Shugart's Avatar

 



Reputation:
Jerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peersJerry Shugart is well respected by his peers
September 19th, 2002, 01:51 PM

When the Lord walked the earth,He said:

"After this manner,therefore,pray ye:Our Father,Who art in heaven,Hallowed be Thy name.Thy Kingdom come.Thy will be done in earth,as it is in heaven"(Mt.6:9,10).

The Lord is saying that when the kingdom is set up on earth,then at that time His will be done on the earth as it is in heaven.Anyone who believes that the horrible things that are happening on the earth now are according to His will are deluding themselves.

As I said previously,when the kingdom of God will be established on earth "the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord,as the waters cover the sea"(Isa.11:9).

And again,anyone who thinks that that condition is present on earth now is deluding themselves because the earth is not now full of the knowledge of the Lord.

In His grace,--Jerry



   
Reply With Quote
  (#195) Old
Revelation717 Revelation717 is offline
Journeyman
 Revelation717's Avatar

 


Reputation:
Revelation717 is an unknown quantity at this point
September 19th, 2002, 04:20 PM

I am a firm believer that God is Soveriegn. To say that anything that goes on in this world goes on without His knowledge or will that good may come out of it, is simply insane, vain, and reprobate.

Quote:
Anyone who believes that the horrible things that are happening on the earth now are according to His will are deluding themselves.

Col:1:16: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

This leaves absolutely NOTHING that has been created without Him. Nothing including nuclear weapons, AK47s, cocaine, prison system, etc... They all have a purpose!

Some things are used to bring judgement and sorrow while others bring joy and peace. Those who know there God shall not be afraid.

Matter of fact Jerry if we are to interprete as you do, then no nuke or AK47 or knife or razor can harm us.

Isa:54:17: No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD, and their righteousness is of me, saith the LORD.

Now would you care to tempt the Lord and show that this is a literal interpretation?


Those that do know their God also know that what may seem horrible is for the good of those that love God and are called according to His purpose.

Ro:8:28: And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Quote:
And by the Scriptual passages that describe the kingdom that will be put in place on earth,it is obvious that the kingdom remains in the future:

"Behold,the days come,saith the Lord,that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch,and a King shall execute justice and righteousness in the earth"(Jer.23:5).
So this is future as well? C'mon man, how deluded. Don't you even know Jesus is the righteous Branch spoken of here? Did God not raise Him up yet? Do you still wait for another? There would have to be another concerning your interpretation because the ETHNIC jew has not been made righteous without faith in Jesus, right?

Teachings of man. :no no: Jerry, Jerry Jerry, you've yet to point one thing out and back it with Scripture.

We all are still waiting for you to tell us how the children of the devil, the unbelieving Jew of John 8, is the chosen people of God?

How they still do Him service?

Why 1 Peter 2:9 says we are the people of God?

How the 70 weeks will unfold and bring the promises of Daniel 9:24 to an unbelieving nation that crucified God while He walked among them? (what more will they need?)

Who is the Bride of Christ if not the believers in Jesus aka the church?

And your quotes that I bore false witness against you?

I see you have craftily dodged all these and more. Fess up and enlighten us, let's settle the score here and now!

I know you will read this, and everyone else does too, so if you do not answer these questions which have been asked you from the beginning and quote my misrepresentation then everyone can know you do pervert the truth and teach fables of men as doctrine of God, your a liar and a heretic not knowing truth but having pleasure in lies as does your father.

What else can be said if you cannot answer, from Scripture that which you have already been shown?





Oh man, would ya look at this...we got alot of work to do!
   
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Skin developed by: vBStyles.com
Copyright ©1997-2014 TheologyOnLine



Logos Bible Study Software Up to 15% OFF FOR THEOLOGYONLINE MEMBERS! Study twice, post once.
Logos Bible Software —take your Bible study to the next level.