The Pope has deep respect for muslims and thinks Islam is virtuous.
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All I would have is dialogue, not discourse and argument. I would let them say what they wanted to say and listen quietly,
Then I would speak, of course I would have to have absolute power over the US not just a president, more like Queen Kat. Then with a smile I would make it clear to them on no uncertain terms, what we did in Japan would look like a fireworks festival compared to what I was prepared to do to them, if they so much as attacked the USA in any way.
I would do what Jesus would do.
Speak the truth and not lie.
It wouldn't mean that I would necessarily blast them and tell them they are going to hell and cause all sorts of craziness (like Jesus might do) but I certainly wouldn't tell the they are virtuous.
There you go again....he didn't say they were virtuous. He said the virtues of Islam. A virtue is a particular moral excellence, such as a moral virtue, or a natural virtue, or a theological virtue, such as faith, hope or charity. One can find virtue in any good person or ideal or belief. Virtue can not only be found in Christians. The Pope is appealing to moderate Muslims. He's not embracing their religion. And he's not going to convert any of them by hitting him over the head with his crozier.
Hope sees the invisible, achieves the impossible.
May 8th, 2009, 05:36 PM
Originally Posted by Knight
Hey TOL Catholics.... what do you think when the Pope says stuff like this?
My overall reaction when this happens is generally something along the lines of:
It reminds of me of all of the American government's attempts to negotiate with the aliens in "Mars Attacks!"
But, Muslims aren't wrong about everything. They do believe in God. They don't think of God as some vague pantheistic collective consciousness or metaphor for the common good. They oppose abortion. The oppose hedonism and debauchery. There is some important common ground, which the pope hopes can be used to promote peace. I don't approve of it when the pope or anyone else creates the impression that Muslims and other non-Christians have our blessing to persist in their error, however.
And as Anna has mentioned always check the story from Reuters, AP, New York Times or any major source against other relevant sources not so determined to pander to the ignorance and xenophobia of non-Catholic readers.
"So as not to exchange one evil for another, this poor land must be saved from the scourge of friend and foe alike." - Friedrich Schiller
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Never be haughty to the humble; never be humble to the haughty.
May 8th, 2009, 05:47 PM
Why is he claiming he respects a community of people he believes is destined for hell due to their religious beliefs?
He's the Pope. He is the spiritual leader of the majority of the world's Christians. And Christians don't think Muslims are destined to hell for their religious beliefs:
Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God.(18*) In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh.(125) On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues.(126); But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Mohamedans, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind. Nor is God far distant from those who in shadows and images seek the unknown God, for it is He who gives to all men life and breath and all things,(127) and as Saviour wills that all men be saved.
From DOGMATIC CONSTITUTION ON THE CHURCH
SOLEMNLY PROMULGATED BY HIS HOLINESS
POPE PAUL VI
ON NOVEMBER 21, 1964
Does his feigned humility and lip service have you hoodwinked?
Sounds like your ignorance of Christian doctrine hoodwinked you.
Personally, I don't think he respects them for being Muslims at all.
If you don't think so, you haven't been paying attention. In his trip to Turkey, he made that abundantly clear.
He's a Christian, and like Paul, he regards reverence for God to be an admirable thing, even if some don't fully understand Him.