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Treat others the way you want to be treated.
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September 12th, 2009, 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusha
Would you really, GG? This is a serious question. I have been debating abortion for the last five years and MOST pro-abortion advocates will state flat out that even if that were the case, they would still be against banning abortion.
Yes, I would. The procedure would have to be just as efficient and cost as much as an abortion itself though. Tall order, but yes. With that in place, I could no longer justify abortion. The fetus would no longer be acting parasitically to the woman, and its termination could therefore no longer be justified.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusha
The reason for this is that they flat out feel a child would complicate their life. When the option of adoption is brought up, they claim that they could never give up a child they gave birth to because it would be abandonment and that child *might get abused*.
Yeah, that's bullcrap. Legally it would be the equivalent to being a sperm or egg donor. No complication necessary. They just don't get paid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusha
For those types that use this excuse, I shake my head at the idea that some women would believe abandoning a child to adoption is worse than killing that child.
To me, it's all about the complications of the pregnancy itself. Not the child. The child can be given up without termination. The pregnancy cannot. I mean that's logical, right? We just have a difference of opinion on whether or not the pregnancy is worth going through against the woman's will, right?
Slogan/motto:
Of course you realize this means war! ~ Bugs Bunny
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September 12th, 2009, 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Goblin
To me, it's all about the complications of the pregnancy itself. Not the child. The child can be given up without termination. The pregnancy cannot. I mean that's logical, right? We just have a difference of opinion on whether or not the pregnancy is worth going through against the woman's will, right?
I can agree with that. Pregnancy is not without complication ... to downplay the seriousness is ludicrous. However, I also see the unborn as a developing child that his/her mother should want to nurture and protect.
Slogan/motto:
Evidence that cannot dispel all doubt is still evidence - perhaps very good and overwhelming evidence
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September 12th, 2009, 09:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Granite
Chatmaggot: there is no indication as of yet that this man was killed because of his activism. If he was (and that's likely; the shooter may have simply not cared for him) this doesn't constitute "persecution," it constitutes rotten luck.
The second article you linked, Granite, said that the shooter said he shot Poullion (not sure of the spelling on that) because of the way he protested - according to the police who arrested him.
Futility: "More than at any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and hopelessness; the other, to total extinction. Let us pray that we will have the wisdom to choose correctly. I speak, by the way, not with any sense of futility, but with a panicky conviction of the absolute meaninglessness of existence."
- Woody Allen
Hope:
Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things.
Philippians 4:6-8
Slogan/motto:
Treat others the way you want to be treated.
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September 12th, 2009, 10:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholsmom
The second article you linked, Granite, said that the shooter said he shot Poullion (not sure of the spelling on that) because of the way he protested - according to the police who arrested him.
The article's been edited since it was originally posted. Originally it said that the shooting had to do with money.
Slogan/motto:
Punishing logical inconsistencies since October 2006
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September 12th, 2009, 10:56 PM
Whether or not the shooting had anything to do with money/activism/ anything else the end result is the same - the guy is dead. Now we can point fingers and play the blame game all day long, but when all is said and done all that matters is taking measures to ensure that one of us doesn't end up in the obituaries the next time a gun-weilding fool attacks (read: get a weapon of your own and kill him before he kills you).
"When you realize what a joke everything is being the comedian is the only thing that makes any sense" - Edward Blake
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything." - Nietzsche
The one between the human race and it's habit of destroying itself.
It is tragic what happened to this soldier for the Lord. Whether men know it or not, we are in a spiritual war every day:
"Paul likened the Christian to a soldier.* That implies we are at war--a picture used elsewhere in Scripture.*
a) Ephesians 6:11-12--"Put on the full armor of God, that you may be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil.* For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. "
b) 2 Corinthians 10:3-5--"Though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh, for the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh, but divinely powerful for the destruction of fortresses.* We are destroying speculations and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ. "
Second Timothy 2:3 says we are to be "good" (Gk. , kalos)* soldiers.* We are not to be soldiers simply in terms of function and duty--we are to be excellent, noble, and heroic soldiers.* Those are the kind of soldiers who earn medals of valor and honor.*
The Real War
It's often hard for us as Christians in the United States of America to remember we are at war.* We live in a society that, while philosophically hostile to Christianity, has not been hostile legally or politically.* That's unlike other countries in the world where the battlelines are more clearly drawn.* There Christians have often been required to make extreme sacrifices in every area of life.* Here heroism for Christ's cause is not thrust upon us, so we can forget we are warriors.* Though our warfare may not seem evident, the battle is all around us.*
• Against Demons
I will never forget a battle with a demon-possessed girl one night at church.* She was in one of the rooms of the church kicking, screaming, and throwing furniture around.* When I walked into the room, she said, "Don't let him in!" But the voice that said that wasn't her own.* My first response was, "Fine, I'm leaving!" But I realized that if the demons didn't like me, it was because I was on God's side.* I went in and the girl attacked me, kicking me in the shins so violently I began to bleed.* In the power of God several of us spent hours there until she confessed her sin and God, in His grace, purified her.* As I left that night I realized for the first time the extent of our warfare against demons.*
• The War against Unbelief
A number of years ago a UCLA philosophy professor who was Jewish expressed a desire to know Christ.* I presented the gospel to him and met with him early in the morning for six months.* After that time he told me he didn't want to meet with me anymore.* He went on to attend a liberal seminary, and became an Episcopalian rector.* I don't know his present spiritual state--but he's not where I intended him to be.* Our warfare is for the hearts, minds, and souls of people.* It's often most evident in our discipling relationships because that's where unbelief becomes most evident.*
• Against Sin
In the past I have sought out wayward husbands from places they should not have been.* Our church has experienced lawsuits, threats, and accusations.* Those kinds of experiences affirm that as Christians we are at war against sin.*
First Thessalonians 4:11 says "to make it your ambition to lead a quiet life and attend to your own business. " There are quiet times in the Christian life, but they seem to be more the exception than the rule.* They give us time to catch our breath before the next wave of battle hits, for the battle continues to rage..." full text: *Advice to a Young Disciple: The Elements of a Strong Spiritual Life--Part 2 by John MacArthur http://www.biblebb.com/files/MAC/sg55-6.htm
Please don't give me this ludicrous and intellectually dishonest comparison of abortion with slavery. This really disgusts pro-choicers like me. What a stupid and pathetically inapt comparison !
Slavery is stoppable. Abortion is nOT. Abortion is a private decision for a woman. Slavery is something forced on a whole group of"ALREADY BORN people.
And it's so offensive to pro-coiicers when anti-choicers make it sound as though being pro-choice were as morally reprehensible as
being pro slavery. How ridiculous can you get ?
And when children are forced to be born into poverty, hunger,disease and lack of education and opportunity, this is the REAL slavery, not being aborted.
Being born into abject poverty is infinitely worse than being aborted, which is actually far more humane than just increasing poverty and hopelessness in the world .
All the anti-choice arguments for denying women the right to choose an abortion are false ! Nothing but sophistry !
And making abortion illegal only INCREASES the number of abortions which take place.
Fact: Countries where abortion is illegal have much higher abortion rates than countries where it is legal.
This isn't true of slavery . You sanctimonious, self-righteous anti-choicers make me sick !
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Wow! I get a slogan or life motto??? Is this a great website or what?
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September 13th, 2009, 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Horn
Being born into abject poverty is infinitely worse than being aborted, which is actually far more humane than just increasing poverty and hopelessness in the world .
You are either evil, deluded or retarded. Or all three.
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And making abortion illegal only INCREASES the number of abortions which take place.
OK, definitely retarded.
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Fact: Countries where abortion is illegal have much higher abortion rates than countries where it is legal.
Never mind comparing country against country. Try comparing a single country that has gone from a legal system where abortion is illegal to one where abortion is legal. You know, like the USA. What happened to abortion rates when Roe v Wade became law?
Please don't give me this ludicrous and intellectually dishonest comparison of abortion with slavery. This really disgusts pro-choicers like me. What a stupid and pathetically inapt comparison !
You're right. Abortion is much worse than slavery.
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Slavery is stoppable. Abortion is nOT. Abortion is a private decision for a woman.
A woman cannot stop having an abortion?
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Slavery is something forced on a whole group of"ALREADY BORN people.
And abortion is forced upon not-born people.
Quote:
And it's so offensive to pro-coiicers when anti-choicers make it sound as though being pro-choice were as morally reprehensible as
being pro slavery. How ridiculous can you get ?
You're right. Being pro-choice is a thousand times more reprehensible than being pro-slavery.
Quote:
And when children are forced to be born into poverty, hunger,disease and lack of education and opportunity, this is the REAL slavery, not being aborted.
So your answer to poverty - kill all poor children.
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Being born into abject poverty is infinitely worse than being aborted, which is actually far more humane than just increasing poverty and hopelessness in the world .
Wow. You make it sound so appealing. Are you going to be among the first to volunteer for this great new answer to all life's problems?
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All the anti-choice arguments for denying women the right to choose an abortion are false ! Nothing but sophistry !
I guess your mind is made up.
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And making abortion illegal only INCREASES the number of abortions which take place. Fact: Countries where abortion is illegal have much higher abortion rates than countries where it is legal.
FACT: You made that up.
Quote:
This isn't true of slavery . You sanctimonious, self-righteous anti-choicers make me sick !
I think you need to go breathe into a paper bag or something...
Slogan/motto:
Treat others the way you want to be treated.
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September 13th, 2009, 10:37 AM
*rubs temples*
Horn, you're on the same boat as I am, but you need to improve your arguments if you expect to last here. As it stands, any pro-lifer here can tear you apart, and that really shouldn't be. Cut back on the Ad Hominem and try and include more facts about what you're arguing for.
Right now, you're almost like the Left-wing equivalent of Lighthouse.
"Please don't give me this ludicrous and intellectually dishonest comparison of abortion with slavery. This really disgusts pro-choicers like me. What a stupid and pathetically inapt comparison!"
As William Wilberforce fought to free the slaves, Christians will introduce a bill every year fighting for personhood for the unborn until every baby is protected as he or she should be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Horn
"[A]nti-choice...You sanctimonious, self-righteous anti-choicers make me sick."
We are for the baby's "choice" to live. Liberals love to create friendly-sounding words--pin the "anti" on the conservative's position. Your friendly-sounding words do not cover the fact that you are child-killer in your heart. If we are anti-choice, you are anti-live (Pr 8:36). You will face the Lord Jesus Christ one day. Your damnable view will send you to hell if you do not repent.
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