[Untellectual]

Originally Posted by Squeaky

I said
BORN AGAIN TO THE HOLY SPIRIT

1 Pet 5:10-11
10 But may the God of all grace, who called us to His eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after you have suffered a while, perfect, establish, strengthen, and settle you.
11 To Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.
Gal 2:20
20 "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.
John 3:7-8
7 "Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
8 "The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Luke 5:36-39
36 Then He spoke a parable to them: "No one puts a piece from a new garment on an old one; otherwise the new makes a tear, and also the piece that was taken out of the new does not match the old.
37 "And no one puts new wine into old wineskins; or else the new wine will burst the wineskins and be spilled, and the wineskins will be ruined.
38 "But new wine must be put into new wineskins, and both are preserved.
39 "And no one, having drunk old wine, immediately desires new; for he says, 'The old is better.'"
1 Cor 15:1-3
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand,
2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you-- unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
Rom 6:8-10
8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,
9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him.
10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.
2 Cor 10:3-5
3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh.
4 For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds,
5 casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
Heb 5:12-14
12 For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe.
14 But solid food belongs to those who are of full age, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
Heb 5:8-9
8 though He was a Son, yet He learned obedience by the things which He suffered.
9 And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him,
John 16:21-22
21 "A woman, when she is in labor, has sorrow because her hour has come; but as soon as she has given birth to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish, for joy that a human being has been born into the world.
22 "Therefore you now have sorrow; but I will see you again and your heart will rejoice, and your joy no one will take from you.
Matt 8:11-12
11 "And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
12 "But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
James 1:22-25
22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror;
24 for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was.
25 But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does.
II Jn 1:9-11
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
John 15:5-7
5 "I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.
6 "If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.
7 "If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you.
I Jn 2:6
6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
John 8:29
29 "And He who sent Me is with Me. The Father has not left Me alone, for I always do those things that please Him."
John 7:38-39
38 "He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water."
39 But this He spoke concerning the Spirit, whom those believing in Him would receive; for the Holy Spirit was not yet given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.
John 8:28
28 Then Jesus said to them, "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and that I do nothing of Myself; but as My Father taught Me, I speak these things.
John 16:5
5 "But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, 'Where are You going?'
John 16:7
7 "Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
Gal 5:24-25
24 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
2 Cor 10:4-5
4 For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds,
5 casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
John 3:3
3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
John 3:5-7
5 Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 "Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'
Matt 12:34
34 "Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
Matt 12:36-37
36 "But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment.
37 "For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned."
John 3:34
34 "For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure.
John 3:33
33 "He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true.
Heb 12:24-25
24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.
25 See that you do not refuse Him who speaks. For if they did not escape who refused Him who spoke on earth, much more shall we not escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from heaven,
Heb 7:22
22 by so much more Jesus has become a surety of a better covenant.
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
(NKJ)
xxxx Born again means to die first to something. And that something is the carnality. And be born again to something else. And that something else is the Holy Spirit that only quotes new testament verses. Which are the revelations of Jesus Christ. Which I am showing the revelations I received.

John 1:12-13
12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name:
13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
(NKJ)
Eph 2:1
1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,
(NKJ)

Remember, all scripture is inspired of God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness.

Shalom,

Jacob

[jamie]

Originally Posted by godrulz

The spiritual organism is primarily the universal church of God (invisible).

Yes, I am quite aware that the term "universal church of God" is a code word for the Roman church. However, I am a quartodecimen Passover and seventh day Sabbath keeper.

How's that for thinking outside the box?

Jamie

[godrulz]

Originally Posted by jamie

Yes, I am quite aware that the term "universal church of God" is a code word for the Roman church. However, I am a quartodecimen Passover and seventh day Sabbath keeper.

How's that for thinking outside the box?

Jamie

Quarto...wow, a new word for me! Sabbath? Bah.

By universal church (catholic), I do not mean Roman Catholic at all, but the invisible church made up of true believers in a variety of local churches/denominations. It contrasts with visible, local expressions of the Body of Christ in geographical areas.

What other oddities do you believe? I have a few of my own, fellow maverick.

[jamie]

Originally Posted by godrulz

Quarto...wow, a new word for me!

Many years ago there was a dispute about observing Passover on the 14th of Nisan or observing Easter. Easter won for most, but for a few there is Passover observed with the NT symbols Jesus instituted.

As for the Sabbath, Jesus said he is Lord of the Sabbath, but again, for most, Sunday won out. The Roman church even has a genuine Egyptian obelisk in St. Peters square. Cool, but very telling.

Jamie

[chrysostom]

Originally Posted by jamie

The Roman church even has a genuine Egyptian obelisk in St. Peters square. Cool, but very telling.

Jamie

what does that tell you?

[jamie]

Originally Posted by chrysostom

what does that tell you?

It marks the site of the new Heliopolis. What does that tell you?

Jamie

[Squeaky]

Originally Posted by Untellectual

Remember, all scripture is inspired of God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness.

Shalom,

Jacob

I said
Wouldnt it be nice if people just claimed what they can prove without all these useless opinions. A true born again Christian must prove what it says with scripture. And if all these wanttobe's had to live by that rule it would shut alot of them up. lol

[Untellectual]

Originally Posted by Squeaky

I said
Wouldnt it be nice if people just claimed what they can prove without all these useless opinions. A true born again Christian must prove what it says with scripture. And if all these wanttobe's had to live by that rule it would shut alot of them up. lol

All scripture here in the NT scripture refers to the OT scripture, and maybe even NT scripture.

Shalom,

Jacob

[Squeaky]

Originally Posted by Untellectual

All scripture here in the NT scripture refers to the OT scripture, and maybe even NT scripture.

Shalom,

Jacob

I said
Do you mean like these

The old testament is obsolete.
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
(NKJ)

Or these which say if you dont abide(live) in the new testament you dont have the right God.
II Jn 1:9-11
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
(NKJ)


Or these stand fast in the new testament or you will fall from grace.
Gal 5:1-4

1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing.
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
(NKJ)

[Untellectual]

Originally Posted by Squeaky

I said
Do you mean like these

The old testament is obsolete.
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
(NKJ)

Or these which say if you dont abide(live) in the new testament you dont have the right God.
II Jn 1:9-11
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
(NKJ)


Or these stand fast in the new testament or you will fall from grace.
Gal 5:1-4

1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing.
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
(NKJ)

The Old Testament is commonly the name for what came as scripture before Christ. I call it scripture. The Old Testament might be the first five books, since they are from Moses. But, instead, the Old Testament is the covenant God gave the people of Israel through the prophet Moses. This comes after Genesis. However, Genesis was written during the time of Moses or afterward, if you examine the text and that God revealed His name to Moses in Exodus. So, when Paul refered to scripture, he meant what is commonly refered to as the Old Testament, from Genesis to Malachi. But, if I call it the Tanach, then I can leave the term old covenant for the covenant in Moses itself. Then, we have the new covenant in Jesus. So, when Paul said the scripture is profitable, He meant the Tanach. Then, what is the Tanach profitable for?

Remember Paul told Timothy, the scriptures will make one wise unto salvation.

Shalom,

Jacob

[Squeaky]

Originally Posted by Untellectual

The Old Testament is commonly the name for what came as scripture before Christ. I call it scripture. The Old Testament might be the first five books, since they are from Moses. But, instead, the Old Testament is the covenant God gave the people of Israel through the prophet Moses. This comes after Genesis. However, Genesis was written during the time of Moses or afterward, if you examine the text and that God revealed His name to Moses in Exodus. So, when Paul refered to scripture, he meant what is commonly refered to as the Old Testament, from Genesis to Malachi. But, if I call it the Tanach, then I can leave the term old covenant for the covenant in Moses itself. Then, we have the new covenant in Jesus. So, when Paul said the scripture is profitable, He meant the Tanach. Then, what is the Tanach profitable for?

Remember Paul told Timothy, the scriptures will make one wise unto salvation.

Shalom,

Jacob

I said
Well you can call this or that what ever you want to. But if you know and follow the Holy Spirit He will define with a revelation what is the old testament.

ABOUT THE OLD TESTAMENT
FROM THE NEW TESTAMENT
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
2 Cor 3:14-15
14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.
15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.
Gal 2:21
21 "I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain."
John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
1 Cor 10:1-12
1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea,
2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
3 all ate the same spiritual food,
4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
6 Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted.
7 And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, "The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play."
8 Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell;
9 nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents;
10 nor complain, as some of them also complained, and were destroyed by the destroyer.
11 Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, on whom the ends of the ages have come.
12 Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall.
Rom 13:8
8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.
John 6:63
63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
John 4:23-24
23 "But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him.
24 "God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."
John 17:17
17 "Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.
John 3:34
34 "For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure.
John 3:33
33 "He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true.
John 3:35-36
35 "The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand.
36 "He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."
Rom 8:1-2
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3-8
3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.
8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
Gal 2:19-21
19 "For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God.
20 "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.
21 "I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain."
Gal 3:24-25
24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
Gal 5:1-5
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing.
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Gal 4:21
21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law?
Rom 7:4-6
4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another-- to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God.
5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.
6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
Rom 13:10
10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
1 Pet 2:19-21
19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully.
20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God.
21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
II Jn 1:9-11
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
John 1:17
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)
xxx Jesus wants everyone who is going to be a christian to understand that the new covenant(testament) is just that new. That you cant go back and keep any part of the old testament that Jesus hasnt brought over to the new testament. Jesus new what to bring over man doesnt. But the old testament has to be obsolete to you in order for you to get the fullness of the new testament. 11John 1-9 is very specific if you dont abide(live) in the new testament you dont have the real God. There IS a veil over the old testament that remains to THIS day.
If Jesus were in the old testament this verse could only be meant for God and the angels.
John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.


Col 2:13-14
13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,
14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
(NKJ)


Luke 16:16
16 "The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it.
(NKJ)

Matt 11:12-13
12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 "For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
(NKJ)

[Gurucam]

Originally Posted by godrulz

Removing oneself from any local churches is presumptious and leaves one vulnerable to heresy and the enemy. To say that no churches have the truth, but one person does, is the making of cults. If it was me, I would question why I was the only one believing something, and that everyone else in the last 2000 years was wrong.

Let me know, Jamie, when you start your own sect, so I can expose it.

Yet false prophets who came in Jesus name must be operating from within the very great majority of local and other churches.

Indeed how else would false prophets who came in Jesus' name be able to misguide many, unless they are widely believed and held to be the real thing?

'Removing oneself from any local churches is presumptious and leaves one vulnerable to heresy and the enemy' is a common platitude.

I am not suggesting that you do this, for most people do settle in church that is right for them. And indeed Jesus knew this when he prophesied that many will be called to Christianity but the very great majority who are called there, will be mislead there and not be saved or chosen.

Indeed it is the likes of these very local and foreign churches that has been materializing Jesus' prophesy: many are called to Christianity but few are chosen. Also since these many who are not chosen err, because they do not know Truth, it is clear the the very great majority of local churches including most others are seriously misguiding their flocks.

Indeed they err because they did not get Truth in those very local churches, among others.

No knowledge is often better than false and misleading knowledge which many of these local churches must be inevitably spewing onto their charges. Jesus did confirm, unequivocally, that many will be called to Christianity but few will be chosen. And people err when they do not know Truth and that many false prophets will come in His name and misguide these many.

Any how you cut it only a few, the chosen few will have and know Truth. These few cannot be among the billions in traditional Christianity who more or less have the same basic beliefs about Christianity which must of necessity be wrong.

In order for only a few to make it from among all the billions who are called to Christianity, it must be that the most commonly held and most pervading beliefs in all of traditional Christianity must be very wrong and very misleading.

[Untellectual]

Originally Posted by Squeaky

I said
Well you can call this or that what ever you want to. But if you know and follow the Holy Spirit He will define with a revelation what is the old testament.

ABOUT THE OLD TESTAMENT
FROM THE NEW TESTAMENT
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
2 Cor 3:14-15
14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.
15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.
Gal 2:21
21 "I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain."
John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
1 Cor 10:1-12
1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea,
2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
3 all ate the same spiritual food,
4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.
5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
6 Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as they also lusted.
7 And do not become idolaters as were some of them. As it is written, "The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play."
8 Nor let us commit sexual immorality, as some of them did, and in one day twenty-three thousand fell;
9 nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents;
10 nor complain, as some of them also complained, and were destroyed by the destroyer.
11 Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, on whom the ends of the ages have come.
12 Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed lest he fall.
Rom 13:8
8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.
John 6:63
63 "It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
John 4:23-24
23 "But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him.
24 "God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."
John 17:17
17 "Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.
John 3:34
34 "For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure.
John 3:33
33 "He who has received His testimony has certified that God is true.
John 3:35-36
35 "The Father loves the Son, and has given all things into His hand.
36 "He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."
Rom 8:1-2
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3-8
3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.
8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
John 14:26
26 "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
Gal 2:19-21
19 "For I through the law died to the law that I might live to God.
20 "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.
21 "I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain."
Gal 3:24-25
24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
Gal 5:1-5
1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing.
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.
Gal 4:21
21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law?
Rom 7:4-6
4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another-- to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God.
5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.
6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
Rom 13:10
10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
1 Pet 2:19-21
19 For this is commendable, if because of conscience toward God one endures grief, suffering wrongfully.
20 For what credit is it if, when you are beaten for your faults, you take it patiently? But when you do good and suffer, if you take it patiently, this is commendable before God.
21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:
II Jn 1:9-11
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
John 1:17
17 For the law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)
xxx Jesus wants everyone who is going to be a christian to understand that the new covenant(testament) is just that new. That you cant go back and keep any part of the old testament that Jesus hasnt brought over to the new testament. Jesus new what to bring over man doesnt. But the old testament has to be obsolete to you in order for you to get the fullness of the new testament. 11John 1-9 is very specific if you dont abide(live) in the new testament you dont have the real God. There IS a veil over the old testament that remains to THIS day.
If Jesus were in the old testament this verse could only be meant for God and the angels.
John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.


Col 2:13-14
13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,
14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
(NKJ)


Luke 16:16
16 "The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it.
(NKJ)

Matt 11:12-13
12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 "For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
(NKJ)

That's fine. Though the old covenant, or first covenant, is not the first, the new covenant is better than the old covenant. The ways in which it is are in Hebrews and elsewhere. Hebrews quotes Jeremiah, and you have pointed this out, which is good. I'm just saying that if you throw out scripture because it is "old covenant", you are missing what is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness! The old covenant is actually a covenant, the first of two Jeremiah was talking about (the old and new). It is not a body of literature, though you can read about the old and new covenants in the scriptures as well as the NT writings.

Shalom,

Jacob

[Squeaky]

Originally Posted by Untellectual

That's fine. Though the old covenant, or first covenant, is not the first, the new covenant is better than the old covenant. The ways in which it is are in Hebrews and elsewhere. Hebrews quotes Jeremiah, and you have pointed this out, which is good. I'm just saying that if you throw out scripture because it is "old covenant", you are missing what is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness! The old covenant is actually a covenant, the first of two Jeremiah was talking about (the old and new). It is not a body of literature, though you can read about the old and new covenants in the scriptures as well as the NT writings.

Shalom,

Jacob

I said
The definition of the word testament is covenant. Read the revelation I'm not the one saying the old testament is obsolete that would be the new testament is saying it. Now whether you call it covenant or testament its still just the law and the prophets.

Luke 16:16
16 "The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it.
(NKJ)

Matt 11:12-13
12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 "For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
(NKJ)

[Untellectual]

Originally Posted by Squeaky

I said
The definition of the word testament is covenant. Read the revelation I'm not the one saying the old testament is obsolete that would be the new testament is saying it. Now whether you call it covenant or testament its still just the law and the prophets.

Luke 16:16
16 "The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it.
(NKJ)

Matt 11:12-13
12 "And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent take it by force.
13 "For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
(NKJ)

Galatians 3:17 What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise.

The Law is the old covenant. So, the old covenant came after Abraham. Yet, if we call the scriptures old covenant, we make Abraham old covenant. But, did God have a covenant with Abraham before the old covenant/testament?

In Hebrews, the old covenant (the prophet Moses and the people of Israel) is refered to as that which Jeremiah spoke of. The people had failed to keep it. The writer of Hebrews shows that when a new covenant was spoken of, that meant something for the old covenant. I believe the words are, "becoming obsolete".

Shalom,

Jacob