Open question: How does Christianity explain Islam from prophecy standpoint?
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Impossible for me to say. The preterist view answers many questions, but it doesn't answer all of them, so I'm perfectly willing to accept that Revelation 20 could be referring to an event that has yet to take place. In any case, any prophecy of scripture will be fulfilled only as God alone intends it to be fulfilled. One thing is certain: Prophecy will not be fulfilled according to the private interpretations and whims (2 Peter 1:20-21) of prophecy hucksters, who make merchandise of the Word of God in order to fatten their own bank accounts.
in case you are interested I have presented my views in this thread
I remember back pre-1973 when Armstrong used to phone us at British Israel World Federation Headquarters across from Buckingham Palace, asking our position/interpretation on hundreds of verses.
Whether Armstrong is a heretic or not, I don't know. He's an American Freemason probably, and I believe the main slander against him was his divorce and remarriage...a shakey thing to judge someone on given how rampant divorce and remarriage is among all denominations of Christianity nowadays.
British Israel articulated and published predates Armstrong by half a century. Almost all the early Empire military men and Biblical archaeologists were BI men, whether Unitarian or not, and whether Masons or not.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
Armstrong deviated from biblical truth on many points (cult). His WWCOG has since moved towards orthodoxy in a profound way. His personal life is not the issue.
Armstrong deviated from biblical truth on many points (cult). His WWCOG has since moved towards orthodoxy in a profound way. His personal life is not the issue.
British Israelism is not biblical.
Thanks for downgrading British-Israel from "Heretical" (Armstrongism, not me), to "not biblical".
I'm a solid-state physicist, and electrical engineer. Both of these are also "not biblical".
Luckily they don't make me a better or worse Christian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulos
British Israelism is also not supported by research in genetics, among other things
Nor should it be. Israel was a multi-racial nation from its inception, when thousands of Egyptian slaves of all races and nations joined Israel in fleeing the Egyptian army during the Exodus. Biblical law also allows a slave/servant of any race to join an Israelite family after 6 years of service. Also, all Abraham's servants were non-Abrahamites, but included in the Covenant of Abraham when they were circumcised along with all his household.
Several bedouin tribes also joined Israel as carpenters and water-carriers, in exchange for their lives.
Read the Bible: its great.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
Last edited by Nazaroo; July 23rd, 2010 at 05:23 PM.
It is apparent that this "quick-answer" is itself full of non-sequitous nonsense.
Quote:
(1) ...So, yes, many people from the northern ten tribes were deported to Assyria, never to be mentioned again. At the same time, there is sufficient evidence in Scripture to prove that the ten tribes were not lost, but rather in fact rejoined with Judah in the south.
In fact there is NO evidence in Scripture to support the idea that the bulk of the Ten Tribes rejoined Judah, on the return from Babylon.
In fact, Ezra/Nehemiah go out of their way to indicate that the very "people of the land" in Samaria who remained after the Assyrian invasions and captivity were utterly rejected, because they couldn't prove their Israelite lineage (all records were destroyed), even though it was obvious that they were descendants of the Northern 10 tribes.
Why else did they try to join the Jews of the Southern Kingdom in rebuilding Jerusalem and Temple?
But they were rejected by the Southern Judahites, not just because they couldn't prove they were Israelites, but also because they were considered "half-breeds" and rejected on racist grounds.
This is painfully obvious, since Ezra and his gang rejected even Southern Jews who had intermarried with non-Judahites, and demanded all of them to either dump their wives and children, or get lost!
The Northern Israelites did not in any way join the Southern kingdom re-started by Ezra, except a very small number under extreme conditions (they were known and could prove their ancestry, and they had no "racial defilement" or inter-racial marriages or children).
yet it is clear that the Samaritans and others WERE Israelites, who traced their heritage back to Jacob (See John 4:12), and Jesus did not challenge this truth, but takes it for granted (John 4:21).
Quote:
(1) (cont.)... It is likely that when Judah was deported by the Babylonians, the people would have sought out the Israelites in Assyria (very near Babylon) and rejoined with them. ...
On the contrary, the Babylonian Jews utterly rejected the Israelites from the Northern Kingdom. The Babylonian Jews were elitists and racists.
Jesus rejected their foolishness, and invited the Israelites of the Diaspora back into the New Covenant (John 12:20, cf. John 7:35)
They were indeed "lost" and would have remained so if the Jews had remained in control of the Covenant.
But Jesus ignored the Jews when they rejected Him, and accepted the disenfranchised Israelites of the Northern Kingdom dispersed throughout the Roman Empire without hope of rejoining the "Israel" the Jews had built.
Most of the Israelites of the Northern Tribes never returned to Palestine, and after the destruction of the Temple lost all hope or reason to do so. They remained dispersed all over Eurasia, and instead, the Gospel came to them, and many accepted it.
The Lost Ten Tribes remained hidden in the Wilderness (cf. Rev. 12:1-6) but were not "Lost" in the eyes of God.
The destruction of the Temple signalled that the only return was through the Gospel, and so most lost their Identity willingly and embraced the New Covenant.
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(2) Is it possible that some of the deported Israelites immigrated to Europe, even England? Yes. It is likely? No.
...
[then follows some hypothetical reasoning, but no historical or geographical 'evidence' whatever.]
On the other hand, British-Israelite historians and archaeologists have actually bothered to attempt to document the migration of all European tribes and nations, and have spent decades examining all kinds of archaeological and historical evidence for documenting this.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
Nor should it be. Israel was a multi-racial nation from its inception, when thousands of Egyptian slaves of all races and nations joined Israel in fleeing the Egyptian army during the Exodus.
Still, you'd think that some Semitic racial admixture would have taken place somewhere along the line, but genetic mapping shows no evidence of it.
If you haven't done something like this already, you can trace your own genetic heritage by having your DNA tested:
Physicists don't recognise Youtube as an authority on advanced genetics.
If only you'd quoted David Suzuki. I have five minutes for him, because he's Canadian.
Otherwise, let me just say now, evolution is shiite, and the only real science is physics.
Ask any physicist: we think biologists are gay.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
If you haven't done something like this already, you can trace your own genetic heritage by having your DNA tested:
No serious person has time for such pointless navel-gazing.
I would rate the activity you suggest as about the same level as gratuitous masterbation. I don't recommend wasting your time with this, unless you are retarded, and can't contribute anything else to help mankind. Have you any better suggestions, like drilling water-wells for villages without clean water?
peace
nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
No serious person has time for such pointless navel-gazing.
I would rate the activity you suggest as about the same level as gratuitous masterbation. I don't recommend wasting your time with this, unless you are retarded, and can't contribute anything else to help mankind. Have you any better suggestions, like drilling water-wells for villages without clean water?
What's the matter, Naz? Are you simply too afraid to find out that you are not, in fact, an "Israelite"--but some of the Palestinians are?
Mapping the human genome is hardly "retarded". Your immature words reflect poorly upon no one but yourself.
And just for the record, I am all for drilling water-wells.
Last edited by Paulos; July 23rd, 2010 at 10:58 PM.
What's the matter, Naz? Are you simply too afraid to find out that you are not, in fact, an "Israelite"--but some of the Palestinians are?
As explained (apparently you don't bother to read posts), there is no genetic fingerprint for "Israelite". It was multi-racial from its inception.
Quote:
Mapping the human genome is hardly "retarded".
I'd go one further:
Its open rebellion to tamper with the genetic mechanisms,
and thats why the last earth was destroyed by deluge.
Those who participate now will be destroyed.
Quote:
And just for the record, I am all for drilling water-wells.
Well, its a start.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
As explained (apparently you don't bother to read posts),
there is no genetic fingerprint for "Israelite". It was multi-racial from its inception.
There is a genetic fingerprint for the Jews, and there would also be a genetic footprint for modern-day descendants of the northern 10 tribes of Israelites who were racial Semites. What makes you assume that the multi-racial Israelites didn't interbreed? The fact is that they did, and evidence of this would show up in genetic mapping.
By the way, Jews are also multi-racial, but they still have common genetic markers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nazaroo
If only you'd quoted David Suzuki. I have five minutes for him, because he's Canadian.
David Suzuki would call you foolish for saying something like that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nazaroo
Ask any physicist: we think biologists are gay.
David Suzuki would call you foolish for saying something like that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nazaroo
Its open rebellion to tamper with the genetic mechanisms,
and thats why the last earth was destroyed by deluge.
Those who participate now will be destroyed.
David Suzuki would call you foolish for saying something like that, and he would be right.
Simply mapping the human genome does not equal "tampering with genetic mechanisms."
Last edited by Paulos; July 24th, 2010 at 12:11 AM.
David Suzuki would call you a fool for saying something like that.
...
David Suzuki would call you a fool for saying something like that.
Well, David Suzuki IS a fool, in the full and clear Biblical sense:
A "fool" is someone who disbelieves in God. (Psalm 53:1).
Suzuki is publicly an atheist, although he talks like an agnostic, to appear friendly to New Age tree-huggers, who are a superstitious lot, and are easily spooked into fleeing like antelope. Here's a typical report of Suzuki in a recent "God Debate":
Quote:
"...the atheist [Suzuki] — who doesn’t seem to know if he’s an agnostic or an atheist, or if he does, didn’t bother coming up with a valid argument as to why we should not be arguing over terminology and instead settled for evading the attack — didn’t do nearly as well. He tried to use humour, but humour doesn’t sustain weak arguments. He never once presented a concrete argument for why God doesn’t exist, only that the arguments for God’s existence are too weak. But I could easily conclude that I don’t know and that God may or may not exist. He seemed to be taking a leap of faith in believing that God’s non-existence is the more reasonable option." http://blogs.ubc.ca/lillienne/2008/0...he-god-debate/
Obviously listeners who were already predisposed to agnosticism or atheism were deeply disappointed in Suzuki's limp-wristed attack on theism.
As I said, there is little reason to listen to Suzuki, if you are already a committed Christian, like you have listed yourself....what are you really, Paulos?
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Quote:
David Suzuki would call you a fool for saying something like that, and he would be right.
No. He would be wrong again. I'm not a fool (=atheist), I'm a God-believer. And you are claiming to be one too, only you are acting like an apologist for agnosticism or liberal secular humanism, or some other gay trash.
Lets see why you are both still wrong on the question of mapping the humane genome, which you seem to think is an intelligent, worthy thing to do:
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Furthermore, mapping the human genome does not equal "tampering with genetic mechanisms."
Yes it does. Here's why:
(1) If I investigate and discover the chemical laws surrounding gunpowder, a powerful force which no one denies can be harnessed for 'peaceful purposes' (e.g. mining, building dams and roads, preventing dangerous dictators from ruling the world etc.), but then publish the information in a paperback available to every idiot on the planet with opportunity...
(2) If I design and build machinery and mechanisms to exploit explosives, and which are easily adapted to 'NON-peaceful purposes' (e.g. handguns, grenades, rocket-launchers, ICBMs etc.), and also publish those designs freely, and even provide working models, and make these also available to anyone with economic opportunity to own and operate them...
(3) If I set up companies to supply ammunition, suppiies, resources, transport, support-equipment etc. to all and sundry, regardless of religious belief, political ideology, moral standards, emotional or mental flaws, commitment to causes which have dubious ethical merit,...
Then even though I protest that I am only engaging in 'science' and the noble cause of expansion of knowledge, the improvement of technology and efficiency etc., sooner or later, you are going to have to admit that I am really aiding and abetting terrorism, anarchy, war, and am wreaking great evil on millions of innocents.
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The Bankruptcy of "Science as Saviour"
We have come to the end of the naive era that thought 'science' could solve every problem, that 'medicine' could cure every disease, that man's innate goodness only needed education to end evil, etc.
We now live in a very real and well-understood world in which we know that science and technology can do nothing of the kind; that our ethical and moral crisis is wholly independent of technology, which only gives us more opportunities for greater and greater evil.
Most scientists today no longer think that endless expansion of our knowledge and power (which automatically includes destructive power) is a good thing.
Just as 'special effects' in movies have now far outstripped our ability to write good stories, so technology has far outstripped our ability to use it ethically, and everybody knows (everyone with a brain that is) that there is no point in continuing to expand scientific knowledge, without first putting in place ethical frameworks and restraints in access to prevent us from destroying ourselves and the planet.
The Human Genome project is the perfect example of a technology that we don't need, can't control, and which will destroy us. Even physicists who love science, and who originally became scientists in the noble cause of expanding knowledge know that the game is over.
peace
Nazaroo
"But if anyone, even an angel from heaven,
were to preach any other gospel than that of
Jesus the Christ, crucified, buried, and
raised from the dead by God the Father,
to deliver us from this present evil world,
let that false preacher be accursed.' (Gal 1:1-4,8-9)
Thanks Paulos. I'll have to take Wiki with a grain of salt as I doubt the preterists have had a chance to correct any errors or biases in those articles.
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