Originally Posted by chrysostom
we are not using your definition
until you start using ours
you will not be communicating with us
Firstly there IS no such a word in the bible, God nowhere has said "behold I have given you free will" He does everywhere say CHOOSE ye this day whom you will SERVE. Choose this day between life and death. The fact that you [and 99 per cent of people] call this free will does not make it so.
Man does not have the characteristic of free will any more than he has wings to fly....I think if man had free will everyone would have wings to fly....he cannot say to God "You have placed before me life or death, righteousness and sin, but I will choose to sin AND still have life."
But man has already chosen, he has already sinned, he is in a fallen state...the devil had said "you will not die" he lied, he decieved man. Adam sinned supposing that he would not die. The devil is still telling folk today "it's your life, you're free, do what you want to do, you'll be alright, you will not die"
The picture in scripture is of the Jews in Egypt...where was their free will? they were slaves, in the furnace of affliction, under the heel of oppression. God sent a deliverer in Moses, but they could only be free by following Moses not else.
Look you Americans [beautiful Americans] you think you are free and like the rest of western civilisation, where the gospel has had most penetration there is the most freedom....but let them default on their debt repayments you might be surprised to find how little freedom you really have.
Where the gospel has had no penetration the people live in abject poverty and oppression, they are not free.
But we before Jesus came into our lives we too were in darkness, we wished we could live good upright lives but when temptation came we fell. Jesus has set us free.
It is VERY simple if you are bound to sin you are not free...how can you be? So I will keep my definition not of free will, for there is no free will only bondage to sin and death or salvation.
You say but you have chosen to be saved, but to be saved is to belong to the One who saved me...a freedom I do not wish to swap.