[noguru]

Originally Posted by ghost

No it's not, so you're an idiot and a liar.

No, death has always meant separation. You don't know anything, which is why you don't worship God, but instead worship men.

So IOW, "death" does not literally mean "physical death" to you, it means "seperation from God"? I suspect this is your logic based upon the fact that on that day Adam and Eve were expelled from the Garden of Eden, is that correct?

Bump!

I do not think I will get an answer from the mighty Ghost on this question. I guess I need to just lay back and see.

[noguru]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

The Bible, in so many ways, just hurts evolution. It's funny that theistic evolutionists try to say common descent is obvious, and yet they deny the obvious in Scripture.
People lived for at least 120 years before the Flood. Noah lived for 800. Natural impossibility.
Their answer: metaphor
Adam was created from dust, and women came from him, neither from animals.
Their answer: metaphor
The Garden of Eden in general: metaphor
The Flood: metaphor
No sin before Adam: ?metaphor?
Any explanation of these metaphors?
Their answer: They are just metaphors (neg rep! smite! mockery! repetative and circular arguing!)


It's ridiculous. They have created their own god and try to attribute it to Jesus. The theology is just false, and that's all there is to it.

That is all so inaccurate. But good for you, nice show. You fit all those inaccurate statements in a single post. You must be quite proud of yourself.

[Sum1sGruj]

Originally Posted by noguru

That is all so inaccurate. But good for you, nice show. You fit all those inaccurate statements in a single post. You must be quite proud of yourself.

Oh yeah, I also forgot., when revealing these things, they claim it is not so, but have nothing to show for it and eventually go right back to do proclaiming the same. Circularity at it's most simple design

[noguru]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

Oh yeah, I also forgot., when revealing these things, they claim it is not so, but have nothing to show for it and eventually go right back to do proclaiming the same. Circularity at it's most simple design

What? How is your view of scripture any different from mine in regard to figurative language? Pleas explain that to me so that I may know how superior you view of scripture actually is.

[noguru]

Originally Posted by noguru

So IOW, "death" does not literally mean "physical death" to you, it means "seperation from God"? I suspect this is your logic based upon the fact that on that day Adam and Eve were expelled from the Garden of Eden, is that correct?

Bump!

I do not think I will get an answer from the mighty Ghost on this question. I guess I need to just lay back and see.

[Stripe]

noguru.

[Sum1sGruj]

Originally Posted by noguru

What? How is your view of scripture any different from mine in regard to figurative language? Pleas explain that to me so that I may know how superior you view of scripture actually is.

Because I realize that the contexts of Genesis are just not flexible enough to support common descent, metaphorical or no. Never met a theistic evolutionist who could show otherwise, just rather say otherwise. And what do you know., that hasn't changed on TOL either.

[Stripe]

It'd be much easier to progress a discussion if the people who reject the plain teaching of scripture would simply admit that they do so.

[The Barbarian]

Because I realize that the contexts of Genesis are just not flexible enough to support common descent, metaphorical or no. Never met a theistic evolutionist who could show otherwise, just rather say otherwise. And what do you know., that hasn't changed on TOL either.

Perhaps it would help you, if you could show how Genesis rules out evolution. You've seen that it rules out the "life from nothing" doctrine of YE creationism. But so far, no one can show that it rules out evolution.

[some other dude]

Originally Posted by Stripe

It'd be much easier to progress a discussion if the people who reject the plain teaching of scripture would simply admit that they do so.

Does it matter if they admit it?

They make it obvious when they post.

[I aint no monkey]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian

Perhaps it would help you, if you could show how Genesis rules out evolution. You've seen that it rules out the "life from nothing" doctrine of YE creationism. But so far, no one can show that it rules out evolution.

You have already been shown in this thread how the Bible does not support evolution and in fact the whole Bible from Genesis to Revelation is dependent on the creation story in Genesis being true and literal. Your salvation testimony validates that the Genesis creation story is literal and true.

God in Exodus told us to work 6 days and rest 1 just like he did when he created everything. That is the 4th commandment of the Ten Commandments and we can surely take the Ten Commandments literally. And that is what we traditionally do, we work 6 days and rest 1. If a day isn’t a day, what is it? Should we work millions of years and then rest millions of years?

What did Jesus say about the creation story? Mark 10:6 Jesus says that God made male and females from the beginning of creation. What did Paul say about the creation story? He said that death and sin came into the world though one man, Adam and that is why we need a last Adam, Christ. If there was no death before Adam that means that evolution didn’t happen. Romans 5:12 1 Corinthians 15:45

[Stripe]

Originally Posted by some other dude

Does it matter if they admit it?

Yes, because they have to force the bible to accommodate their ideas - which necessarily means unaccommodating the truth. Instead of being able to discuss the facts according to an obvious disagreement, theistic evolutionists pollute a discussion by introducing a raft of nonsense ideas that atheists can harp on rather than facing the logical conclusions of their ideas.

It'd be easier. But it would probably not be better.

Case in point - the fish thread. Atheists have the answer to the challenge posed, but can easily hide behind the so-called Christians fighting against the very rational answers given.

It's gotten so bad that even the so called Christians hide behind anything rather than face the weight of the answers given.

[ghost]

Originally Posted by I aint no monkey

You have already been shown in this thread how the Bible does not support evolution and in fact the whole Bible from Genesis to Revelation is dependent on the creation story in Genesis being true and literal. Your salvation testimony validates that the Genesis creation story is literal and true.

God in Exodus told us to work 6 days and rest 1 just like he did when he created everything. That is the 4th commandment of the Ten Commandments and we can surely take the Ten Commandments literally. And that is what we traditionally do, we work 6 days and rest 1. If a day isn’t a day, what is it? Should we work millions of years and then rest millions of years?

What did Jesus say about the creation story? Mark 10:6 Jesus says that God made male and females from the beginning of creation. What did Paul say about the creation story? He said that death and sin came into the world though one man, Adam and that is why we need a last Adam, Christ. If there was no death before Adam that means that evolution didn’t happen. Romans 5:12 1 Corinthians 15:45

Not to mention that the text clearly presents that the days were noted as a morning and an evening. Just because we now measure morning and evenings by the sun, does not mean that the same amount of time was noted by God apart from them.

The time frame for the 6th day is the same as the time frame for the 5th, the 4th, and so on. If a "day" is thousands of years, you have a problem with Adam, the genealogical records, and the day of God's rest. Is He resting now? Jesus says He is working during His earthly ministry. Adam did not live thousands of years (the 6th day).

[voltaire]

Originally Posted by Desert Reign

The plain meaning of 'death' is physical death, the death of the body. This is confirmed in chapters 4 and 5 of Genesis where the word death/die is used numerous times with the obvious meaning of physical death. Indeed, the repeated phrase "and he died" is usually taken as a direct fulfillment of the threat given to Adam "on the day you eat of it you will surely die".

In order to interpret day as anything other than a period of 24 hours, you have got to abandon premise 2 above. And the same goes for death: if you want to interpret that as spiritual death, you have got to abandon premise 1.

Cheers,

Death may have the obvious meaning of physical death in chapters 4 and 5 of Genesis, but how do you draw the conclusion that death in Genesis 2:17 means physical death from that? Genesis 4 and 5 are not the only uses of the word die and death in the bible. How is the threat to adam fulfilled everytime it is mentioned "and he died"? Other people are dying, not adam. I'm sorry but your logic is beyond comprehension. Your main problem is that you make astronomical leaps that are not warranted.

[Nick M]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian

Perhaps it would help you, if you could show how Genesis rules out evolution.

Have you ever even read the Bible? It explicitly states God created on those days, and they were good.

Here are some things for you to ponder, and maybe you will also believe his gospel some day, if you confess this truth you know is true.

Genesis 1

11And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

12And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

13And the evening and the morning were the third day.

21And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good.

22And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth.

23And the evening and the morning were the fifth day.

Those are the days when he made plant life and then the animals. And God said they will come forth like their own kind. They will come forth like their own kind. Do you know what that means? Do you want to take a stab at it?