Exclusively Christian TheologyThis forum is exclusively for those who consider themselves Christian and consider the Bible to be the inspired word of God.
Slogan/motto:
Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Reputation:
June 12th, 2012, 01:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gill White
Thank you, I read those chapters last night.
Through some studies, I see that Daniel 7, refers to: ''The name was Mystery: Babylon the Great, the Mother of Prostitutes and Detestable Things of the Earth''
How do you relate/connect those chapters in Proverb 1-7 to Revelations 17?
I will start a new thread, as this will cause this thread to be derailed from the OP: (or look for a thread relating to this discussion)
Rules are to come from God, God sets the rules, not man: If Colossians goes by God's rules, and you and I go by God's rules, then unity will happen. If one of us is not, then unity won't happen:
What are His rules, His will:
1Pe 2:23 GW
(23) Christ never verbally abused those who verbally abused him. When he (Christ) suffered, he (Christ) didn't make any threats but left everything to the one (God) who judges fairly.
......''He left ''us'' an example so that we could follow in his footsteps'' 1 Peter 2:21; 1 John 2:6
Our concern should be not in judging others but in living such a way as not to be a stumbling block to cause the fall of a brother. We should be willing to yield on insignificant matters, so as to help a brother stand.
We all need to take that burden of ourselves about judging, one has already been appointed in that position, that position has already been filled.
Acts 17:24-34 KJV
(24) God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
(25) Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
(26) And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
(27) That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
(28) For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
(29) Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
(30) And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
(31) Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
(32) And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked: and others said, We will hear thee again of this matter.
(33) So Paul departed from among them.
(34) Howbeit certain men clave unto him, and believed: among the which was Dionysius the Areopagite, and a woman named Damaris, and others with them.
God will judge the world, through Jesus Christ, the man whom God has ordained, God has given us this assurance, to all men, that God has raised Jesus Christ from the dead.
We need to get our answers from God, line it up with the Word of God, like the earlier church did: Acts 17:11
God's ways are always perfect.
Good post Gill, I am looking forward to your new thread.
Psalm 1[/color] and Job 28:28
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
June 12th, 2012, 09:55 AM
LA’s remark:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon
There was no man in Heaven until Christ was raised from the dead and was presented to God Almighty who created all things for His pleasure. Rev.chs 4 and 5.LA
Lifeisgood’s answer:
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeisgood
I think Enoch and Elijah were in Heaven. I could be wrong though.
Enoch is included by Paul (in Heb. 11) among the fathers who obtained a good report through faith; but “ALL these, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise” (Heb. 11:39).
What promise?
The “hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began (Titus 1:2).
So Enoch therefore is on of “ALL THESE” who have not yet obtained the promise of eternal life and inheritance. Enoch and all the worthies of old will receive the promise of eternal life at the return of Christ, the same time Christians obtain it (Heb. 11:40). That is yet future!!
LA’s answer:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon
Yes , Enoch, Elijah, and Moses are alive somewhere
It is always, yes I accept what is being said BUT
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon
Not in the place (in relation to) that Jesus now is.
I find this 'BUT' a lot around these posts. Have to keep that in mind all the time. There is always going to be a "'Yes', 'BUT.'"
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
November 16th, 2012, 06:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
When did he know?
He always knew. He just didn't tell us that He knew. And that is His prerogative.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
Until he was baptised he did not say much.
That you say that He did not say much until He was baptized does not mean He did not say much or did not know that He was deity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
If he had knowledge at birth he would not grow in wisdom. God gave him his powers after he was baptised. That is when he got his deity.
Jesus was ALWAYS deity. Deity cannot be granted, you either are deity or you are not.
NOTE: I should have said: Jesus, 'deity wrapped in flesh', was ALWAYS deity.
Truth is truth, it matters not if you believe it or not.
==========
No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:13–18)
No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:23–24)
==========
If the “Oughts” of the Old Testament were difficult to obey, Our Lord’s teaching is unfathomably more difficult. Remember, the commandments were given irrespective of human ability or inability to keep them; then when Jesus Christ came, instead of doing what we all too glibly say He did—put something easier before men, He made it a hundredfold more difficult, because He goes behind the law to the disposition. —Oswald Chambers
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"No serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus." ~ Otto Betz
Last edited by lifeisgood; November 18th, 2012 at 11:45 AM.
He always knew. He just didn't tell us that He knew. And that is His prerogative.
That you say that He did not say much until He was baptized does not mean He did not say much or did not know that He was deity.
Jesus received his power at his baptism (Acts 10:38)
Quote:
Jesus was ALWAYS deity. Deity cannot be granted, you either are deity or you are not.
I question that. Christ was given deity. Jesus was given Christ. Christ is a spirit.
Heb 1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Christ was given the fullness of his father.
Jesus said all power WAS GIVEN TO HIM.
Christ is the power of God, Jesus received Christ at his anointing.
He was a FORM of god, not the true GOD.
Psalm 1[/color] and Job 28:28
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
November 17th, 2012, 07:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
Jesus received his power at his baptism (Acts 10:38)
He ALWAYS had the power. What He did not have was the OK to use that power until the baptism.
Your unbelief cannot change the truth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
I question that.
That's your problem - you question the truth; you do NOT give yourself the OK to believe. You ALREADY have the power to believe but you question if you can or should belief. That's your issue BELIEF; the power you already have and you have ALWAYS known that you have always had the power to give yourself the OK to believe. However, you choose to deny yourself to believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
Christ was given deity. Jesus was given Christ. Christ is a spirit.
You either are deity or you are not. You cannot be given deity.
You nor I will NEVER be deity, will NEVER be granted deity, because we were NEVER deity to begin with.
Deity can do as deity pleases, and deity pleased to be wrapped in human flesh, sojourn in this rotten world, save humanity by dying on a Cross, and go back to its original abode, without EVER stopping being deity. Deity has no beginning neither does deity has an end, however, deity can decide to enter time and deity did enter time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
Christ was given the fullness of his father.
Jesus said all power WAS GIVEN TO HIM. Christ is the power of God, Jesus received Christ at his anointing. He was a FORM of god, not the true GOD.
You just keep on believing your man-made theory keypurr.
Truth is truth, it matters not if you believe it or not.
==========
No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:13–18)
No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:23–24)
==========
If the “Oughts” of the Old Testament were difficult to obey, Our Lord’s teaching is unfathomably more difficult. Remember, the commandments were given irrespective of human ability or inability to keep them; then when Jesus Christ came, instead of doing what we all too glibly say He did—put something easier before men, He made it a hundredfold more difficult, because He goes behind the law to the disposition. —Oswald Chambers
==========
"No serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus." ~ Otto Betz
He ALWAYS had the power. What He did not have was the OK to use that power until the baptism.
Your unbelief cannot change the truth.
That's your problem - you question the truth; you do NOT give yourself the OK to believe. You ALREADY have the power to believe but you question if you can or should belief. That's your issue BELIEF; the power you already have and you have ALWAYS known that you have always had the power to give yourself the OK to believe. However, you choose to deny yourself to believe.
You either are deity or you are not. You cannot be given deity.
You nor I will NEVER be deity, will NEVER be granted deity, because we were NEVER deity to begin with.
Deity can do as deity pleases, and deity pleased to be wrapped in human flesh, sojourn in this rotten world, save humanity by dying on a Cross, and go back to its original abode, without EVER stopping being deity. Deity has no beginning neither does deity has an end, however, deity can decide to enter time and deity did enter time.
You just keep on believing your man-made theory keypurr.
I tell you what I have been shown in scripture, I am not educated enough to make this up on my own. God has no boundaries, he can give anything to any body at any time. God gave his express image his fullness in Col 1, your acceptance of it is your choice. I did not write the Bible, I only read it with a prayer and an open mind.
Psalm 1[/color] and Job 28:28
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
Slogan/motto:
Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Reputation:
November 17th, 2012, 03:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeisgood
Jesus was ALWAYS deity. Deity cannot be granted, you either are deity or you are not.
Joh 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
Luk 22:69 Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.
1Jn 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
Act 9:20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
He ALWAYS had the power. What He did not have was the OK to use that power until the baptism.
Your unbelief cannot change the truth.
That's your problem - you question the truth; you do NOT give yourself the OK to believe. You ALREADY have the power to believe but you question if you can or should belief. That's your issue BELIEF; the power you already have and you have ALWAYS known that you have always had the power to give yourself the OK to believe. However, you choose to deny yourself to believe.
You either are deity or you are not. You cannot be given deity.
You nor I will NEVER be deity, will NEVER be granted deity, because we were NEVER deity to begin with.
Deity can do as deity pleases, and deity pleased to be wrapped in human flesh, sojourn in this rotten world, save humanity by dying on a Cross, and go back to its original abode, without EVER stopping being deity. Deity has no beginning neither does deity has an end, however, deity can decide to enter time and deity did enter time.
You just keep on believing your man-made theory keypurr.
Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Christ was given the power, he did not have it. (Acts 10:38)
Psalm 1[/color] and Job 28:28
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
November 18th, 2012, 11:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by keypurr
Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Christ was given the power, he did not have it. (Acts 10:38)
No, keypurr, by your own verses Christ did not receive any power. Christ did not need to be given any power. Christ always had the power. Christ always knew everything.
Jesus, on the other hand, deity wrapped in flesh, was the one who received the power to do the works that God had predestined Him to do.
That you choose to separate Christ from Jesus does not change the truth of what the Bible teaches.
Truth is truth, it matters not if you believe it or not.
==========
No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:13–18)
No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:23–24)
==========
If the “Oughts” of the Old Testament were difficult to obey, Our Lord’s teaching is unfathomably more difficult. Remember, the commandments were given irrespective of human ability or inability to keep them; then when Jesus Christ came, instead of doing what we all too glibly say He did—put something easier before men, He made it a hundredfold more difficult, because He goes behind the law to the disposition. —Oswald Chambers
==========
"No serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus." ~ Otto Betz
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
November 18th, 2012, 11:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon
Joh 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; Joh 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
Luk 22:69 Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God.
1Jn 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
Act 9:20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
LA
Jesus was deity wrapped in flesh, therefore, for me He was AND is always deity.
Truth is truth, it matters not if you believe it or not.
==========
No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:13–18)
No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:23–24)
==========
If the “Oughts” of the Old Testament were difficult to obey, Our Lord’s teaching is unfathomably more difficult. Remember, the commandments were given irrespective of human ability or inability to keep them; then when Jesus Christ came, instead of doing what we all too glibly say He did—put something easier before men, He made it a hundredfold more difficult, because He goes behind the law to the disposition. —Oswald Chambers
==========
"No serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus." ~ Otto Betz
Slogan/motto:
Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Reputation:
November 18th, 2012, 01:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeisgood
Jesus was deity wrapped in flesh, therefore, for me He was AND is always deity.
Please consider this, it may take some time. Old thought patterns can die hard.
The idea that man is made of body, soul , and spirit, is wrong.
Man is spirit and body who lives. The soul is the life. If man dies then he is dead where dead is absence of soul.
Jesus was not born into a human body. He was born of human spirit and body.
The Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary to conceive life in the egg of Mary. It was a miracle. It was not the transference of a God into an egg.
Such a human is just not human, and Jesus was born fully human.
Heb 2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
Heb 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
Slogan/motto:
Ecclesiastes 1:9 ---
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Reputation:
November 18th, 2012, 02:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazy afternoon
Please consider this, it may take some time. Old thought patterns can die hard.
The idea that man is made of body, soul , and spirit, is wrong.
Man is spirit and body who lives. The soul is the life. If man dies then he is dead where dead is absence of soul.
Jesus was not born into a human body. He was born of human spirit and body.
The Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary to conceive life in the egg of Mary. It was a miracle. It was not the transference of a God into an egg.
Such a human is just not human, and Jesus was born fully human.
Heb 2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
Heb 2:17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
Heb 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
LA
LA, I am not God so I will not be able to give you an answer that will satisfy you; however, I believe that Jesus Christ is both God and Man.
- Jesus had to be God to give the world the means for men to be saved by fulfilling the work of the Cross.
- Jesus had to be Man to be able to be the representative man.
Like someone in here somewhere said: "Christ mediates for man as Man. Christ mediates for God as God."
Truth is truth, it matters not if you believe it or not.
==========
No man can come to God except through Christ. (Jn. 14:20)
No man can come to Christ unless he comes through the Cross. (Jn. 3:16; Eph. 2:13–18)
No man can come to the Cross without a denial of self. (Lk. 9:23–24)
==========
If the “Oughts” of the Old Testament were difficult to obey, Our Lord’s teaching is unfathomably more difficult. Remember, the commandments were given irrespective of human ability or inability to keep them; then when Jesus Christ came, instead of doing what we all too glibly say He did—put something easier before men, He made it a hundredfold more difficult, because He goes behind the law to the disposition. —Oswald Chambers
==========
"No serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non-historicity of Jesus." ~ Otto Betz
Slogan/motto:
Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.
Reputation:
November 18th, 2012, 06:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeisgood
LA, I am not God so I will not be able to give you an answer that will satisfy you; however, I believe that Jesus Christ is both God and Man.
- Jesus had to be God to give the world the means for men to be saved by fulfilling the work of the Cross.
The opposite is true.
Jesus Christ was and had to be a righteous man to effect the work of the cross or it was against Gods own law.
-
Quote:
Jesus had to be Man to be able to be the representative man.
Like someone in here somewhere said: "Christ mediates for man as Man. Christ mediates for God as God."
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
God calls men to know His son Jesus who is a man in God.
Jesus Christ was and had to be a righteous man to effect the work of the cross or it was against Gods own law.
Only a PERFECTsacrifice could effect that work.
Quote:
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
God calls men to know His son Jesus who is a man in God.
LA
He's the eternal Son.
1 John 1:1-2
1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;
2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us
He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.
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