"WORK out your salvation with fear and trembling" - Oh uh - 4 letter word!!
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Slogan/motto:
"Love separates for the sake of union." - Rumi
Reputation:
April 13th, 2012, 11:28 PM
You have taken the verse out of context. God is actually doing the work, not the believer.
"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure." Philippians 2:12-13
"God has elected all, but few have come to realize His Will is but their own." - A Course in Miracles
Also, what needs to be "worked out" is our fear. That's salvation.
"God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.
Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.
There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love." 1 John 4:16-18
"Where fear has gone there love must come, because there are but these alternatives. Where one appears, the other disappears. And which you share becomes the only one you have." - A Course in Miracles
"The concepts which now prove to be fundamental to our understanding of nature...seem to my mind to be structures of pure thought...the unvierse begins to look more like a great thought than a great machine." - Sir James Jeans
Resident Course Student and Panentheist
Last edited by Damian; April 14th, 2012 at 09:42 AM.
The Protestant notion that we somehow "get" saved and "have" salvation regardless of what we do...that's a notion that, so far as I can see, is pretty much absent from the Fathers of the Church.
When a Man Lies He Murders
Some Part of the World
These Are the Pale Deaths Which
Men Miscall Their Lives
All this I Cannot Bear
to Witness Any Longer
Cannot the Kingdom of Salvation
Take Me Home
Slogan/motto:
2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 06:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jefferson
The verse doesn't say we are to work FOR our salvation with fear and trembling but rather we are to work OUT our salvation (that we already have) with fear and trembling.
We work it OUT by voicing it!
1 Corinthians 1:21 KJV For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
2 Timothy 4:2-5 KJV Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
Slogan/motto:
2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 06:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Traditio
The Protestant notion that we somehow "get" saved and "have" salvation regardless of what we do...that's a notion that, so far as I can see, is pretty much absent from the Fathers of the Church.
Romans 4:4-5 KJV Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Titus 3:4-7 KJV But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 06:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruthSetsFree
yes, work is a 4 letter word
some think they can get to Heaven by sitting on their hands...
of course no one sits on his hands all the time... but some think they should use their hands to work at making $$... not working out something like salvation, which they seem to think should be totally FREE
True, GRACE is a gift...
but it is given to those who WANT it...
Grace disappears when one sins... esp mortal sin...
so we have to "work out our own salvation with fear and trembling" as Phil 2:12 (St Paul) tells us
there is no eternal security
sin destroys and we have to WORK against it... through prayer, acts of charity, etc...
Having received the gift of salvation, it takes work to use it.
When you get a gift for your birthday, you have to do work to use it.
You have to unwrap it, open up the box, look inside, take it out, read the instructions, you have to do work to use it.
You can't lose salvation, you cannot earn salvation of this age of grace, but you could ignore it and not work to use it.
We received the gift of salvation and it sits in the closet?
No we received it in, into ourselves, it is in us. There fore to use it we must "work it out" energize it, put it to use.
Jesus Christ paid for all the sins of the world, including the ones we did after we received the gift of salvation.
He is a complete savior.
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
Slogan/motto:
love others as u love yourself... and thank God you dont have to like them
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 08:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrysostom
you need to point out that we do not earn our salvation
so
they don't misunderstand
i thought i did that by saying we are saved by grace... implying it
But i see u r right... wasn't very clear
Even so, maybe i wasn't clear because i am so sick of this nonsense that is OSAS or virtual OSAS... Heck, even some Catholics live like OSASers..
It is not our works per se that save us, but we cannot get to Heaven without good works...
nature abhors a vacuum
If there is a vacuum of good works... meaning if someone doesnt do them...
by default, he sins... there is nothing in between good an bad works... its one or the other...
for example if the Holy Spirit led u to spend extra time in prayer but you chose to take on a part time job @ night instead... a job that didn't allow 4 prayer, to speak of ... you are not only commiting the sin of disobedience, but are falling into materialism and etc... and if your mind and heart r caught up with materialism... you will NOT love God.. Jesus said "You cannot serve God and mammon"
Slogan/motto:
love others as u love yourself... and thank God you dont have to like them
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 08:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by heir
Romans 4:4-5 KJV Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Titus 3:4-7 KJV But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
how does either one of those passages translate into:
Slogan/motto:
love others as u love yourself... and thank God you dont have to like them
Reputation:
April 14th, 2012, 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lighthouse
Scripture?
Not all that God wants for us is found in Scirpture, explicitly or otherwise. The Church preceded Scripture (New T) and produced the NT... in the 300s. It is dangerous to go by scripture alone... After all, was there no Church b4 the printing press was invented in 1440 (when books became more easily accessible/ affordabble?) The Bible as we know is a fairly modern phenomenon, which is why the Church chained the Bible to the podium @ the Church... couldn' afford to have it stolen... (though ignorant peoiple will tell u another story... geez... whatever...)
That being said, there is PLENTY of scirpture that tells us we are NOT saved by faith alone... James 2:12 is probably the most clear, but there are many others. i have read the entire Bible and certain books i have read over and over.. heard over and over also... at daily Mass. If u attend daily Mass for 3 yrs you will hear something like 80% of the Bible, the most "important" parts...
Quote:
If we are saved by grace [Eph. 2:8-10] And grace abounds all the more when sin abounds [Rom. 5:20] how can we lose salvation?
have u forgotten waht comes after that psg you quote?
something like this
"Does that mean we can sin? God forbid!"
Quote:
If it isn't earned how is it lost?
if someone gave u a gift but then you "lost it"
that does not mean it was earned in the 1st place, doesn't make it any less a gift...
and one can get a gift back that has been lost once he repents and makes, as the RCC calls it "a firm purpose of amendment"
You need to be baptized to be saved? Thats a new rule im not aware of... And how do I know if he's saved or not... If he heard the gospel and believed that Christ died for him and he proclaimed Jesus as Lord, then yes.
Even if he committed mass genocide after... He's still saved.
Its not really salvation if you can just lose it...
Dont like it? take it up with God
In other words, you believe in a petty God who doesn't really judge by evils, but rather getting water dumped on one's head. So an atheist will be damned over Hitler?
That is absolute garbage.
I don't believe in your god. Sorry. In fact, if such a being operates that way, then they are not God, just a conflicted, malevolent, unfair, self-absorbed, malignant waste of celestial space. I think people who even choose to believe in such a god simply have something fundamentally fried in their mental capacities.
What a joke. And you have the nerve to tell me to get saved and sit on some imaginary high horse,.
Get a grip, fool.
That is absolute garbage. 
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