ReligionDiscuss General Theology, Religions and Denominations, God's Attributes, Predestination and Free Will, Dispensationalism, Eschatology, Philosophy, Origins, Archaeology, Science, World History and other such topics.
Wow, Keypurr! I never thought I'd ever see you post these words.
As long as you realize that they are not my words. But at least you can see I look at both sides when I post. The NET is a very trinitarian slanted Bible. But even they questioned that verse. I still hold that Jesus is a created being friend. He has a God. He may be godlike but he is not equal to his creator. My studies on the pre existence of the spirit in Christ has opened up many new ideas about his creation. You never gave me your ideas on the morning stars.
Peace
Psalm 1[/color] and Job 28:28
Rev 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Joh 4:23 "But an hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for such people the Father seeks to be His worshipers.
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
May 16th, 2012, 10:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote
First, the word "has" in John 5:26 is the Greek word "echo" which means "to hold." It means that the Father and the Son have the authority to give life. The whole section is about Christ's EQUAL authority with the Father. It is the same word used in Revelation 1:18 inwhich Jesus said, "I hold (echo) the keys of hades and death." His holding keys is about His authority.
Second, 1 John 1:2 says that the Word IS the eternal life and that He was WITH the Father and is therefore SEPARATE from Him. Therefore, the "true God and eternal life" in 1 John 5:20 CANNOT be the Father. Or do you think the Father is WITH Himself in 1 John 1:2?
BUSTED!
Superman and Green Lantern ain't got
Nothing on Wile E.
What you have failed to read is that the Father gave to Jesus Christ that authority.
Jesus Christ did not have it until he was given it.
Why? Why not?
I John 1:1-4
God's words are what are being presented in scripture.
You have not seen God, nor have you had a personal audience with Jesus Christ, but you do have God's logos, His word, His words, to read and learn from and believe and reap the blessings of believing.
Jesus Christ taught scriptures and when so instructed by God, whatever God wanted him to speak, namely, words, logos.
Logos of truth, messages, words of truth.
One major way of communication is words.
Without words, the scriptures would be blank pages.
The word was with God. John 1:1
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
What you have failed to read is that the Father gave to Jesus Christ that authority.
Oatmeal,
You're really beginning to pi__ me off now. I have answered this a million times and you know it. So please move on to a new argument. Pahilippians 2 says that Christ preexisted as God and made Himself nothing and became obedient and was exalted to His former position of authority.
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
May 16th, 2012, 11:35 AM
Quote:
Oatmeal,
You're really beginning to pi__ me off now. I have answered this a million times and you know it. So please move on to a new argument. Pahilippians 2 says that Christ preexisted as God and made Himself nothing and became obedient and was exalted to His former position of authority.
Quote:
A HALF TRUTH IS A FULL LIE!
Quote:
Please move on to something new!
Aww! You are unhappy because you cannot answer my posts and it makes you unhappy?
Well, first, you should actually do some homework when it comes to scripture. Acts 17:11
Secondly, you have answered little if anything.
Based on your so called answers, I doubt you even read my posts.
Quote:
Pahilippians 2
I am not sure what you are referring to!?
Quote:
Pahilippians 2 says that Christ preexisted as God and made Himself nothing and became obedient and was exalted to His former position of authority.
Maybe
Quote:
Pahilippians 2
states that, but scriptures do not.
Quote:
A HALF TRUTH IS A FULL LIE!
So if someone says, "Wile is a homosexual human being" that statement is false in every way!?
You are not a homosexual and you are not a human being?
Interesting, that logic would explain the reason you come up with so many unscriptural conclusions.
Quote:
Please move on to something new!
I just did.
Boy, this programming on this website sucks.
It erases stuff for no apparent reason.
Sorry if their programming makes this post difficult to sort out.
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
You're really beginning to pi__ me off now. I have answered this a million times and you know it. So please move on to a new argument. Pahilippians 2 says that Christ preexisted as God and made Himself nothing and became obedient and was exalted to His former position of authority.
Quote:
A HALF TRUTH IS A FULL LIE!
Quote:
Please move on to something new!
Aww! You are unhappy because you cannot answer my posts and it makes you unhappy?
Well, first, you should actually do some homework when it comes to scripture. Acts 17:11
Secondly, you have answered little if anything.
Based on your so called answers, I doubt you even read my posts.
Quote:
Pahilippians 2
I am not sure what you are referring to!?
Quote:
Pahilippians 2 says that Christ preexisted as God and made Himself nothing and became obedient and was exalted to His former position of authority.
Maybe
Quote:
Pahilippians 2
states that, but scriptures do not.
Quote:
A HALF TRUTH IS A FULL LIE!
So if someone says, "Wile is a homosexual human being" that statement is false in every way!?
You are not a homosexual and you are not a human being?
Interesting, that logic would explain the reason you come up with so many unscriptural conclusions.
Quote:
Please move on to something new!
I just did.
Boy, this programming on this website sucks.
It erases stuff for no apparent reason.
Sorry if their programming makes this post difficult to sort out.
oatmeal
Philippians 2 says that Jesus existed in the form (nature) of God and then made Himself nothing and took upon Himself the form (nature) of man. It says that He became obedient unto the death of the cross and that God exalted Him to His former position of authority again.
Then it says that He is to be confessed as "Lord" (YHWH, Isaiah 45:23) to the glory of the Father.
I'm sure He's glad to have you around to tell Him who He can and cannot be.
Should I bow to Oatmeal's "superior intellect?"
Why do you challenge Him and us like this? Why don't you understand how arrogant we believe you to be with such?
You a mere mortal trying to define the divine as if you are exceedingly capable? Do you have A's for grades? PhD?
Tell me you have something for this kind of arrogance, please. (and I'm not being mean. This is how arians on here strike me everyday)
Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that works in us,
to Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, forever. Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21
1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. But when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. - Let's at least work at it?
*************************************
Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
You say that the Father is your God but you contradict Him, The Father said,
8 But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”[a]
10 And:
“You, Lord, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
The Father says that the Son is God and even attribrutes the creation to Him.
Your reply,
"Jesus is not God and never will be."
You certainly have a knack for contradicting the book of Hebrews. It says that Christ became the SOURCE of eternal salvation.
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
May 16th, 2012, 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lon
I'm sure He's glad to have you around to tell Him who He can and cannot be.
Should I bow to Oatmeal's "superior intellect?"
Why do you challenge Him and us like this? Why don't you understand how arrogant we believe you to be with such?
You a mere mortal trying to define the divine as if you are exceedingly capable? Do you have A's for grades? PhD?
Tell me you have something for this kind of arrogance, please. (and I'm not being mean. This is how arians on here strike me everyday)
Lon,
the difference between you and I is that I actually believe what is written.
Take I Timothy 2:5
God is God
Men are men
our mediator is the man Christ Jesus
I believe what is written.
Jesus Christ is a man, actually, THE MAN.
God's right hand man.
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
May 16th, 2012, 01:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote
Philippians 2 says that Jesus existed in the form (nature) of God and then made Himself nothing and took upon Himself the form (nature) of man. It says that He became obedient unto the death of the cross and that God exalted Him to His former position of authority again.
Then it says that He is to be confessed as "Lord" (YHWH, Isaiah 45:23) to the glory of the Father.
THIS IS THE WHOLE TRUTH!
Is that what Philippians 2:6-10 teaches
Jesus Christ thought it not robbery to be equal with God.
You say that is one passage that proves that Jesus is God?
You say this passage makes it clear that Jesus thought he was/is God himself?
Is that your take on this?
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
Slogan/motto:
II Timothy 2:15, Psalms 6:5, I John 3:1-2, Romans 5:1 I John 4:18, I Timothy 2:4-5, II Corinthians 9:8,11, III John 2
Reputation:
May 16th, 2012, 01:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wile E. Coyote
You say that the Father is your God but you contradict Him, The Father said,
8 But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”[a]
10 And:
“You, Lord, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
The Father says that the Son is God and even attribrutes the creation to Him.
Your reply,
"Jesus is not God and never will be."
You certainly have a knack for contradicting the book of Hebrews. It says that Christ became the SOURCE of eternal salvation.
Your reply,
I don't care!"
Quote:
You say that the Father is your God but you contradict Him,
Yes, the Father is the only true God. It is he only that I seek to serve.
How is it that I contradict him?
Because I believe that God had a son who is not THE GOD, but rather the son of God?
God called Moses God, Exodus 7:1
So Moses is the fourth person in your trinity?
Oops, quadnity.
God calls those who HE chooses to be rulers and judges over His people "gods" Add those to your newly ordained "quadnity"
Exodus 22:9,28
"For all manner of trespass, whether it be for ox, for ***, for sheep, for raiment, or for any manner of lost thing which another challengeth to be his, the cause of both parties shall come before the judges; and whom the judges shall condemn, he shall pay double unto his neighbour."
"Thou shalt not revile the gods, nor curse the ruler of thy people."
Judges in verse 9 is elohim
gods in verse 28 is elohim
How many rulers, judges of God's people were there?
Add them to your quadnity
Quote:
I don't care!
No, I really don't care for your uninformed opinions of what is clearly stated in the scriptures.
If you truly examine all the scriptural evidence, you would learn truth, not opinion.
Maybe you will see that someday.
oatmeal
"And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42
"For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?" Psalm 6:5
I John 3:1-2. Prov 14:34 Psalm 133:1
Last edited by oatmeal; May 16th, 2012 at 01:32 PM.
Reason: added scriptures
1Co 16:13 Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.
--------------------------
Ex 32:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
Ex 33:3 Unto a land flowing with milk and honey: for I will not go up in the midst of thee; for thou art a stiffnecked people: lest I consume thee in the way.
Ex 33:5 For the LORD had said unto Moses, Say unto the children of Israel, Ye are a stiffnecked people: I will come up into the midst of thee in a moment, and consume thee: therefore now put off thy ornaments from thee, that I may know what to do unto thee.
Ex 34:9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.
De 9:6 Understand therefore, that the LORD thy God giveth thee not this good land to possess it for thy righteousness; for thou art a stiffnecked people.
De 9:13 Furthermore the LORD spake unto me, saying, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
De 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
2Ch 30:8 Now be ye not stiffnecked, as your fathers were, but yield yourselves unto the LORD, and enter into his sanctuary, which he hath sanctified for ever: and serve the LORD your God, that the fierceness of his wrath may turn away from you.
Ac 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
1Co 16:13 Watch ye, stand fast in the faith, quit you like men, be strong.
--------------------------
Ex 32:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
Ex 33:3 Unto a land flowing with milk and honey: for I will not go up in the midst of thee; for thou art a stiffnecked people: lest I consume thee in the way.
Ex 33:5 For the LORD had said unto Moses, Say unto the children of Israel, Ye are a stiffnecked people: I will come up into the midst of thee in a moment, and consume thee: therefore now put off thy ornaments from thee, that I may know what to do unto thee.
Ex 34:9 And he said, If now I have found grace in thy sight, O Lord, let my Lord, I pray thee, go among us; for it is a stiffnecked people; and pardon our iniquity and our sin, and take us for thine inheritance.
De 9:6 Understand therefore, that the LORD thy God giveth thee not this good land to possess it for thy righteousness; for thou art a stiffnecked people.
De 9:13 Furthermore the LORD spake unto me, saying, I have seen this people, and, behold, it is a stiffnecked people:
De 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
2Ch 30:8 Now be ye not stiffnecked, as your fathers were, but yield yourselves unto the LORD, and enter into his sanctuary, which he hath sanctified for ever: and serve the LORD your God, that the fierceness of his wrath may turn away from you.
Ac 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
You say that you believe that Jesus is Jehovah. Oatmeal denies that Jesus is Jehovah and you say that he is "stubborn for what is right." But if Jesus is Jehovah and Oatmeal denies this, then he is stubborn for what is wrong.
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
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