ReligionDiscuss General Theology, Religions and Denominations, God's Attributes, Predestination and Free Will, Dispensationalism, Eschatology, Philosophy, Origins, Archaeology, Science, World History and other such topics.
Or they could have grown up to be *gasp* normal people. But I guess we'll never know. Personally I can think of several solutions that don't involve murder. And yes, its murder regardless of who orders it.
I already covered this. God knows all and did as He saw fit; what He does is Just. The End
Slogan/motto:
Prefer "Disbeliever" to "Atheist". Beginning to think 100-200+ years ahead. Active Centrist Moderate, no option on "political spectrum" for Centrist.
Reputation:
June 6th, 2012, 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian_Nerd
I already covered this. God knows all and did as He saw fit; what He does is Just. The End
CN you are settled, but many are unsettled, by just the same thing - strange don't you think? Thing is I tried but failed to swallow the belief that you have swallowed, the belief that human evil = divine moral goodness.
BTW have you ever come across the Euthyphro Dilemma? its always hiding here in a thicket of verbiage
CN you are settled, but many are unsettled, by just the same thing - strange don't you think? Thing is I tried but failed to swallow the belief that you have swallowed, the belief that human evil = divine moral goodness.
BTW have you ever come across the Euthyphro Dilemma? its always hiding here in a thicket of verbiage
Well, I (to put it your way) swallowed the belief of Christ and it went down like a cold glass of water on a hot summer day. Yeah, buddy!
And I'm not talking about the belief that human evil = divine moral goodness. I'm talking about the belief that Christ's death on the cross has covered my sins so, that I may be seen as sinless at the Judgement seat. I do not wish to sin, though I will sin, and I know I can never be perfect and that is why christ died, because He knew we could not help ourselves to perfection.
Location: A spacious corner office overlooking the River Phlegethon
Rep Power: 50220
Atheist
More right than left
Slogan/motto:
"Do what thou wilt" shall be the hole in the floor.
Reputation:
June 6th, 2012, 02:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian_Nerd
Well, I (to put it your way) swallowed the belief of Christ and it went down like a cold glass of water on a hot summer day. Yeah, buddy!
And I'm not talking about the belief that human evil = divine moral goodness. I'm talking about the belief that Christ's death on the cross has covered my sins so, that I may be seen as sinless at the Judgement seat. I do not wish to sin, though I will sin, and I know I can never be perfect and that is why christ died, because He knew we could not help ourselves to perfection.
Why would you or anyone else want to be perfect?
"If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization."
Slogan/motto:
Prefer "Disbeliever" to "Atheist". Beginning to think 100-200+ years ahead. Active Centrist Moderate, no option on "political spectrum" for Centrist.
Reputation:
June 6th, 2012, 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian_Nerd
Well, I (to put it your way) swallowed the belief of Christ and it went down like a cold glass of water on a hot summer day. Yeah, buddy!
And I'm not talking about the belief that human evil = divine moral goodness. I'm talking about the belief that Christ's death on the cross has covered my sins so, that I may be seen as sinless at the Judgement seat. I do not wish to sin, though I will sin, and I know I can never be perfect and that is why christ died, because He knew we could not help ourselves to perfection.
That's where I started out believing. Why did I then have second thoughts? Precisely because the biblical idea of good deeply disturbed me. What, I, a mere man, stood up to God? God forbid! I dared examine the foundation and found only sand underneath the rock. The cornerstone rests on sand my friend.
I picked a thread and it all unraveled, there was no going back to comforting security of eternal life. It has been a wild disturbing ride for me, and is going to be for anyone else that presently clings to faith.
Nowadays I am more calm about things. I do not have a crazy inclinations to do my fellow man injury, I have found my true nature is peaceable enough. At the time, I considered truths concerning God to be unassailable.
I know it's kind of bad form to dare a believer to re-examine the truths he rests upon, even so that's the way I think now. Because it dragged me against my will every step of the way. To mangle-quote a famous heretic, Here I stand, I cannot do otherwise, and no God can help me, only the things that are truly real. Like truth, which can be painful as well as beneficial. The danger zone is in stepping back and imagining you are hearing everything all at once prior to conversion. I do not make light of the painfulness you face, because I was altogether reluctant to face it myself.
Try to accept I am being entirely sincere, and that there are many like me.
Slogan/motto:
I don't do superstition. It's bad luck.
Reputation:
June 6th, 2012, 04:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christian_Nerd
I already covered this. God knows all and did as He saw fit; what He does is Just. The End
Far from the end my friend. You know nothing of any proposed God other than words written by men, just like the words I write here, or the words you have written in this thread. Mere words bereft of unambiguous evidence, nothing more. Not the end by a long chalk!
Odd though, don't you think, that the god you believe in accepts no higher figure above himself. Does this not make him an atheist?
Why would and atheist be so demeaning of his fellow atheists?
Everyone's mad except me and thee, and I'm not so sure about thee.
I think it more interesting to be a Rising Ape than a Falling Angel - Terry Pratchet
Far from the end my friend. You know nothing of any proposed God other than words written by men, just like the words I write here, or the words you have written in this thread. Mere words bereft of unambiguous evidence, nothing more. Not the end by a long chalk!
Odd though, don't you think, that the god you believe in accepts no higher figure above himself. Does this not make him an atheist?
Why would and atheist be so demeaning of his fellow atheists?
You have a funny definition of atheist for an atheist.
It actually closely resembles my definition for it and i agree with you on its really about not accepting authority over oneself, instead of lack of belief in god(s) like you all usually claim.
My definition:
Atheist - refuses to accept a higher figure (authority) other than themselves.
As to what you said about God though, God believes in God, so your rhetoric was pointless.
That's where I started out believing. Why did I then have second thoughts? Precisely because the biblical idea of good deeply disturbed me. What, I, a mere man, stood up to God? God forbid! I dared examine the foundation and found only sand underneath the rock. The cornerstone rests on sand my friend.
I picked a thread and it all unraveled, there was no going back to comforting security of eternal life. It has been a wild disturbing ride for me, and is going to be for anyone else that presently clings to faith.
Nowadays I am more calm about things. I do not have a crazy inclinations to do my fellow man injury, I have found my true nature is peaceable enough. At the time, I considered truths concerning God to be unassailable.
I know it's kind of bad form to dare a believer to re-examine the truths he rests upon, even so that's the way I think now. Because it dragged me against my will every step of the way. To mangle-quote a famous heretic, Here I stand, I cannot do otherwise, and no God can help me, only the things that are truly real. Like truth, which can be painful as well as beneficial. The danger zone is in stepping back and imagining you are hearing everything all at once prior to conversion. I do not make light of the painfulness you face, because I was altogether reluctant to face it myself.
Try to accept I am being entirely sincere, and that there are many like me.
Peace.
All must choose to accept God or deny God. You are free to say what you may.
You tell me to believe you; I tell you to believe Christ; and that's about as far as we can go.
Recognizing the unresolvable problem between the adherent and those otherwise inclined on the foundation of moral distinction, here's a simpler question and one recognizing the practical truth of the matter, that most Christians come to their religion by way of the gospels and reliance on Christ: what specific objection and condemnation have these same OT fire breathers to that?
I asked one of them early to no avail, given he was obviously invested in the singular battle he felt confident of winning. But it's a fair question. Christians are for and about Christ, not about explaining the context of the unfulfilled Law and the absolute severity and fearsome approach of the Law in that state or its point.
So what is the objection to the fulfilled Law that the Christian actually follows? I suspect there's little to no, but it's worth asking.
Are you saying you would prefer to not discuss that disreputable Old Testament, since God seems to have undertaken sensitivity and kindness training in the period between the Old and New Testaments?
Far from the end my friend. You know nothing of any proposed God other than words written by men, just like the words I write here, or the words you have written in this thread. Mere words bereft of unambiguous evidence, nothing more. Not the end by a long chalk!
Odd though, don't you think, that the god you believe in accepts no higher figure above himself. Does this not make him an atheist?
Why would and atheist be so demeaning of his fellow atheists?
I have said this already, the Word of God is just that, God's Words..
All must choose to accept God or deny God. You are free to say what you may.
You tell me to believe you; I tell you to believe Christ; and that's about as far as we can go.
Christ said “Bring the little children unto me, for of such is the kingdom of heaven.” I didn’t see where he singled out just children of (supposedly) righteous parents, and I don’t see even a hint that he asked for genocide of entire tribes, and specifically the most innocent – the little ones. But I realize you appreciate the Old Testament God ordering child slaughter as much as you appreciate Christ teaching love and protection for infants.
All this thread does is make your god look like a bastard.
Not tolerated on this website. Change it from a value judgement. We really don't care to tolerate worthless opinions about our God here. Learn from the atheists/agnostics who have survived here by thinking before speaking. If not, you will be forgotten in a week.
Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that works in us,
to Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, forever. Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21
1Co 13:11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. But when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. - Let's at least work at it?
*************************************
Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
I agree. Several times in the past couple of years I have attended events where he spoke to this subject. That is to his credit.
But realize that he is aware of what Christianity posits as God, and has found that persona so unlikeable that it was a large part of the inspiration for Dawkins to write the book "The God Delusion".
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."
Linear Mode
