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Right. Grace is a gift, and we access that grace by faith. Our faith in the righteousness of God which is revealed in the faith of Jesus Christ...from faith to faith.
[No correction intended here]
From faith [ours] to faith [His] that the reverse might be true, i.e., from faith [His] to faith [ours]. "Deep calling unto deep"__in both directions.
Last edited by Cross Reference; June 6th, 2012 at 06:03 AM.
From faith [ours] to faith [His] that the reverse might be true, i.e., from faith [His] to faith [ours]. "Deep calling unto deep"__in both directions.
Amen...I like it.
Gen. 12:7
And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it.
Gen. 12:13
And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt.
Think before the cross. Before Jesus was on it, before it could be made available to all.
Read Romans 5:1 in that light. It is a two part verse by Paul speaking in past and preset tenses:
"Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace [reconciliation] with God through our Lord Jesus Christ" Romans 5:1 (KJV)
1. We were "justified"
2. We [now] have "peace" because of Jesus Christ. I.e., Closure to our salvation.
This was part of the setting free of the captives. These being the ones righteous ones who were still alive. The others, of course, were those held in the grave [paradise] who were also set free at the same time.
After the cross, folks who came to God in faith, were both justified and saved by Jesus Christ. There was no need to wait for the Blood.
How am I doing?
Ah, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying those before the cross are saved the same way we are...by faith...and I couldn't agree more. Yep, I agree about Paradise, too.
Then, after the cross....
Rom. 4:24
But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
Ah, if I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying those before the cross are saved the same way we are...by faith...and I couldn't agree more. Yep, I agree about Paradise, too.
Then, after the cross....
Rom. 4:24
But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;
After all these years finally! Friends for life! . . . .
the question "whose faith" is absolutely soaked in equivocal fallacy.
If *I* don't believe *I* don't have faith. If *I* have no faith I am damned forevcer
And Jesus himself said to people he healed "YOUR faith has saved you" he did not say "My faith has saved you."
I am not saying i can or should pump up said faith.
AS for Galatians 2:20 being taken literalistically, that Paul no longer lived so the faith he had was Christ's not his, this is absurd. the passage is hyperbole.
If Paul no longer lived he was dead, literally, so he was an animated corpse, a zombie animated by the Holy Spirit.
the question "whose faith" is absolutely soaked in equivocal fallacy.
If *I* don't believe *I* don't have faith. If *I* have no faith I am damned forevcer
And Jesus himself said to people he healed "YOUR faith has saved you" he did not say "My faith has saved you."
I am not saying i can or should pump up said faith.
AS for Galatians 2:20 being taken literalistically, that Paul no longer lived so the faith he had was Christ's not his, this is absurd. the passage is hyperbole.
If Paul no longer lived he was dead, literally, so he was an animated corpse, a zombie animated by the Holy Spirit.
you think so?
Jesus said He is the way the truth and the LIFE. We don't live by our faith in Him, but by His faith. We believe (our faith toward Christ) that we might be justified by the "faith of Christ." That's the "from faith to faith" spoken of in Rom. 1:17
Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Paul means we die to self, and allow Him to live through us. Putting away all our selfish desires and obeying Him.
I see the importance being, that it is no longer I that live, but Christ in me. So if the very substance of your life is Christ. Any faith that is had is upheld by Him. If you are dead, where will you obtain this faith, and what will you attribute it to?
Jesus said He is the way the truth and the LIFE. We don't live by our faith in Him, but by His faith. We believe (our faith toward Christ) that we might be justified by the "faith of Christ." That's the "from faith to faith" spoken of in Rom. 1:17
Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Paul means we die to self, and allow Him to live through us. Putting away all our selfish desires and obeying Him.
Indeed, Paul was explaining the result of intimacy and His submission to the Mind of God in all things in his life__and this by His love TO the Father.
this is the equivocal fallacy i was talking about.
it stems from stumbling over the word OF.
put it this way
the persecution OF the church was when the church was persecuted. or does it mean when the church itself persecutes (well, it has done its share). Does the persecution of diocletian mean that diocletian was persecuted or that he did the persecution. the word Of is like that.
"the faith of christ" means the gospel or the christian faith. it does not and cannot mean that Jesus NOW trusts anything. that he did trust when he was in teh days of his flesh does not mean that he trusts anything now, for as omnipotent God he knows everything
you have hopelessly twisted the concepts by twisting the words.
I see the importance being, that it is no longer I that live, but Christ in me. So if the very substance of your life is Christ. Any faith that is had is upheld by Him. If you are dead, where will you obtain this faith, and what will you attribute it to?
. . a total twisting of the word "dead"
"dead" in scripture also means alienated from God as well as non functioning or extinct.
missing ths point makes for utter absurdity.
If I no longer live is literal and not hyperbole then it is not i that obey it is not i that love, it is not i that need to repent of anything.
this is the equivocal fallacy i was talking about.
it stems from stumbling over the word OF.
put it this way
the persecution OF the church was when the church was persecuted. or does it mean when the church itself persecutes (well, it has done its share). Does the persecution of diocletian mean that diocletian was persecuted or that he did the persecution. the word Of is like that.
"the faith of christ" means the gospel or the christian faith. it does not and cannot mean that Jesus NOW trusts anything. that he did trust when he was in teh days of his flesh does not mean that he trusts anything now, for as omnipotent God he knows everything
you have hopelessly twisted the concepts by twisting the words.
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