What is the "Historical Gospel" of Jesus Christ?

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Calling Caino dumb because of what he believes is an indication of your immaturity and is a poor witness for Christ.
He is incredibly dumb.
Who put you in charge of judging everyone's maturity?
Caino is a complete lunatic and you should know that by now. This indicates that your discernment is grossly lacking.
Christians should be able to discern, but you cannot.
 

Robert Pate

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He is incredibly dumb.
Who put you in charge of judging everyone's maturity?
Caino is a complete lunatic and you should know that by now. This indicates that your discernment is grossly lacking.
Christians should be able to discern, but you cannot.
It was the poor and unlearned that accepted Jesus as their savior. All of the prominent well educated Pharisees went to hell. You have a bitter Spirit.
 

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It was the poor and unlearned that accepted Jesus as their savior.
Caino is not "poor and unlearned" and does not accept Jesus as his savior (the real one, he has a made up one).
Caino mocks the idea that Jesus' death was a sacrifice for our sins. This is why Caino disparages Paul and the gospel that God gave to him.
All of the prominent well educated Pharisees went to hell.
Irrelevant to our discussion
You have a bitter Spirit.
No, I don't Mr. Judgmental.

P.S. Your complete ignorance about Caino's views makes your "judgment" of me quite hypocritical. Very unChristian of you.
 
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Robert Pate

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Caino is not "poor and unlearned" and does not access Jesus as his savior (the real one, he has a made up one).
Caino mocks the idea that Jesus' death was a sacrifice for our sins. This is why Caino disparages Paul and the gospel that God gave to him.

Irrelevant to our discussion

No, I don't Mr. Judgmental.

P.S. Your complete ignorance about Caino's views makes your "judgment" of me quite hypocritical. Very unChristian of you.
Everyone is of infinite value to God simply because Jesus shed his blood for everyone. Therefore, everyone should be treated with dignity and respect.
 

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Everyone is of infinite value to God simply because Jesus shed his blood for everyone. Therefore, everyone should be treated with dignity and respect.
Respect is earned and Caino has used up any and all of the respect that he once "deserved". Caino is 100% heretic and you should know that by now, but apparently you do not. Caino spits on the sacrifice of Christ that could save him, but instead he rejects it. Caino also rejects the apostle that God chose to deliver His message of grace to the world. That you defend Caino is clueless of you.

Go judge yourself for a change. You need it!
 

Caino

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Paul did not do his own thing. Paul received his Gospel directly from Jesus, Galatians 1:11, 12.

Paul was led by the Holy Spirit during his 25 year ministry. He travel more than 10,000 miles by donkey, foot and ship to take the Gospel of Jesus Christ to the pagan world. Every where that Paul went the Judaizers were there to persecute him. Of all the apostles Paul was the greatest.


Paul was sincere, he was reborn and saved, but Jesus hasn't returned yet, he didn't reappear one more time in Arabia to alter the Gospel of The Kingdom Heaven (change the focus to Christ and him theoretically Crucified as a substitute sin sacrifice) that was already sufficient to our salvation.

In the original Gospel salvation was by Faith in the Father and forgiveness was already available because the changeless God has ALWAYS been a forgiving Father. That explains why God allowed the evil ones the freedom of choice in rebelling and the opportunity to repent but sadly, they didn't and will be destroyed.

Matthew 4

23Jesus went throughout Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every disease and sickness among the people. 24News about Him spread all over Syria, and people brought to Him all who were ill with various diseases, those suffering acute pain, the demon-possessed, those having seizures, and the paralyzed—and He healed them.

25The large crowds that followed Him came from Galilee, the Decapolis, Jerusalem, Judea, and beyond the Jordan.

Jesus wasn't going around teaching that he was supposed to be killed as a sin sacrifice.

The reason that very little of that original Gospel is to be found in the NT is because the scripture books were written well into Paul's persuasive preaching of his Gospel about Jesus. Jesus' gospel was about dedication to the Father, realizing we are his sons through the spirit birth then dedicating our live to doing the Fathers will as Jesus did. Paul's Gospel was/is about Jesus.
 

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Paul was sincere, he was reborn and saved, but Jesus hasn't returned yet, he didn't reappear one more time in Arabia to alter the Gospel of The Kingdom Heaven (change the focus to Christ and him theoretically Crucified as a substitute sin sacrifice) that was already sufficient to our salvation.
Scripture says that Jesus appeared to Paul.
You are wrong (as usual).
 

Caino

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Scripture says that Jesus appeared to Paul.
You are wrong (as usual).
Scripture says many conflicting things like punishing Israel for killing Jesus......... when it also implies that was Gods "plan" all along from the beginning.

Scripture has Jesus excoriating the Jews for rejecting his original Gospel message ...........when Paul says "Christ and him crucified" was that message.

These inconsistencies and conflicts exist because the scripture is human and contains opinions of various people. Much of the NT is Paul's own personal opinions and speculation about the meaning of the death of the Jesus he never knew in person. Lots of people here Jesus talking to them but that doesn't make it so.

You are confused, insecure and defensive as usual.
 

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Scripture says many conflicting things like punishing Israel for killing Jesus......... when it also implies that was Gods "plan" all along from the beginning.
Please demonstrate FROM SCRIPTURE your supposed argument for this.
Scripture has Jesus excoriating the Jews for rejecting his original Gospel message ...........when Paul says "Christ and him crucified" was that message.
Please define, clearly and unabiguously, this "original gospel" from SCRIPTURE.
These inconsistencies and conflicts exist because the scripture is human and contains opinions of various people.
Nonsense. the only errors are typos and such. No improvements can be had from your space aliens.
Much of the NT is Paul's own personal opinions and speculation about the meaning of the death of the Jesus he never knew in person.
Much of Paul's epistles are revelation from God. When it's Paul's opinion, he says so.
Lots of people here Jesus talking to them but that doesn't make it so.
Some people hear space aliens talking to them... but that doesn't make it so.
You are confused, insecure and defensive as usual.
The only confused one between me and you is YOU!
 
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Caino

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Please demonstrate FROM SCRIPTURE your supposed argument for this.
19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.


Jesus saw it differently:

Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the monuments of the righteous. 30And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31So you testify against yourselves that you are the sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32Fill up, then,g the measure of the sin of your fathers. 33You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape the sentence of hell?

Only an unthinking person would conclude that Jesus was hoping he would be killed as a sin debt payment for the worlds sins!

But Jesus did know that the Jews would finally seal their doom having rejected their sacred calling and determined to reject the Gospel and kill the Son! So he turned the other cheek, laid down his life and took it up again of his own volition, and used the occasion of the rejection to become the cornerstone of hope and faith for a new world outside of Juda-ism. The Father and Son worked together to effect the parting of the way's with the Israelites and the broken agreement.


Please define, clearly and unabiguously, this "original gospel" from SCRIPTURE.
The original gospel was largely lost, forgotten, overwritten by the excitement of the resurrection an preaching of the speedy return of Jesus which they assumed was imminent. The old or original "good news" was God as Father of each individual, not just a national God of Israel. It was salvation by faith (not just works) and forgiveness by receiving it and in turn forgiving others. The profitable religious institution of Judaism didn't like Jesus' simple appeal and they sure didn't like the idea that Gentiles were their brothers, that they were to share God the Father with ALL people of the earth!

So one can only show parts and pieces of Jesus' original Kingdom of Heaven Gospel in scripture that he taught for 3+ years before being apprehended and killed because of it. Paul's preaching influenced the recollection of Gospel writers. They began to see Jesus as Paul saw him. The NT is basically a discussion of Paul's experiences and conclusions.

The Christian church replaced the Kingdom of Heaven. That will one day change.

Much of Paul's epistles are revelation from God. When it's Paul's opinion, he says so.
Paul wasn't God nor were his words the Word of God, equal to Jesus. That's a Christian "claim" or belief.
 

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19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

21 Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead, and gave him glory; that your faith and hope might be in God.


Jesus saw it differently:

Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the monuments of the righteous. 30And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31So you testify against yourselves that you are the sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32Fill up, then,g the measure of the sin of your fathers. 33You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape the sentence of hell?

Only an unthinking person would conclude that Jesus was hoping he would be killed as a sin debt payment for the worlds sins!
Cherry-picking is no way to understand scripture.
John 10:15 (AKJV/PCE)
(10:15) As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
Jesus was BOTH murdered and self-sacrificed.
But Jesus did know that the Jews would finally seal their doom having rejected their sacred calling and determined to reject the Gospel and kill the Son!
They did not "seal their doom" permanently. Jesus will return to be their (the remnant of believing Israelites) King on the earth, where Israel will be the head of the nations. Note what Jesus said about them:
Luke 23:34 (AKJV/PCE)
(23:34) ¶ Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.
And Peter:
Acts 3:17-18 (AKJV/PCE)
(3:17) And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did [it], as [did] also your rulers. (3:18) But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
So he turned the other cheek, laid down his life and took it up again of his own volition, and used the occasion of the rejection to become the cornerstone of hope and faith for a new world outside of Juda-ism.
There was nothing "outside of Judaism" there. God gave Israel a set of rules and a future if they obey. God has not given up on them forever, that is just something that people like you make up.

Ezek 36:25-38 (AKJV/PCE)
(36:25) ¶ Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. (36:26) A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (36:27) And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. (36:28) And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God. (36:29) I will also save you from all your uncleannesses: and I will call for the corn, and will increase it, and lay no famine upon you. (36:30) And I will multiply the fruit of the tree, and the increase of the field, that ye shall receive no more reproach of famine among the heathen. (36:31) Then shall ye remember your own evil ways, and your doings that [were] not good, and shall lothe yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations. (36:32) Not for your sakes do I [this], saith the Lord GOD, be it known unto you: be ashamed and confounded for your own ways, O house of Israel. (36:33) Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause [you] to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded. (36:34) And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by. (36:35) And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities [are become] fenced, [and] are inhabited. (36:36) Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I the LORD build the ruined [places, and] plant that that was desolate: I the LORD have spoken [it], and I will do [it]. (36:37) Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will yet [for] this be inquired of by the house of Israel, to do [it] for them; I will increase them with men like a flock. (36:38) As the holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her solemn feasts; so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men: and they shall know that I [am] the LORD.
The Father and Son worked together to effect the parting of the way's with the Israelites and the broken agreement.
You look at only one side of the story. Their restoration is also guaranteed by God.
Ezek 37:21-28 (AKJV/PCE)
(37:21) And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (37:22) And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: (37:23) Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God. (37:24) And David my servant [shall be] king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. (37:25) And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, [even] they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David [shall be] their prince for ever. (37:26) Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. (37:27) My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. (37:28) And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
The original gospel was largely lost, forgotten, overwritten by the excitement of the resurrection an preaching of the speedy return of Jesus which they assumed was imminent.
Christ told them that He would return before they had gone to all of the cities in Israel.
Matt 10:23 (AKJV/PCE)
(10:23) But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
The old or original "good news" was God as Father of each individual, not just a national God of Israel. It was salvation by faith (not just works) and forgiveness by receiving it and in turn forgiving others. The profitable religious institution of Judaism didn't like Jesus' simple appeal and they sure didn't like the idea that Gentiles were their brothers, that they were to share God the Father with ALL people of the earth!
SCRIPTURE... show the SCRIPTURE... I don't care about your FAIRY TALE telling.
So one can only show parts and pieces of Jesus' original Kingdom of Heaven Gospel in scripture that he taught for 3+ years before being apprehended and killed because of it. Paul's preaching influenced the recollection of Gospel writers.
More assertions without evidence on your part. FAIRY TALES is all that you tell.
They began to see Jesus as Paul saw him.
Paul told the truth; you lie.
The NT is basically a discussion of Paul's experiences and conclusions.
Your "god" cannot create a "bible".
The Christian church replaced the Kingdom of Heaven. That will one day change.
🤪 :rolleyes:
Paul wasn't God nor were his words the Word of God, equal to Jesus.
Jesus revealed things to Paul that Paul recorded in the Bible. You vomit fairy tales.
That's a Christian "claim" or belief.
Your whole story is a fairy tale that simply is not true and opposes the truth.
 
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Caino

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Cherry-picking is no way to understand scripture.

Jesus was BOTH murdered and self-sacrificed.

They did not "seal their doom" permanently. Jesus will return to be their (the remnant of believing Israelites) King on the earth, where Israel will be the head of the nations. Note what Jesus said about them:

And Peter:


There was nothing "outside of Judaism" there. God gave Israel a set of rules and a future if they obey. God has not given up on them forever, that is just something that people like you make up.



You look at only one side of the story. Their restoration is also guaranteed by God.


Christ told them that He would return before they had gone to all of the cities in Israel.


SCRIPTURE... show the SCRIPTURE... I don't care about your FAIRY TALE telling.

More assertions without evidence on your part. FAIRY TALES is all that you tell.

Paul told the truth; you lie.

Your "god" cannot create a "bible".

🤪 :rolleyes:

Jesus revealed things to Paul that Paul recorded in the Bible. You vomit fairy tales.

Your whole story is a fairy tale that simply is not true and opposes the truth.
If Jesus wanted Paul to be an apostle he would have chosen him while on the earth. I don’t believe that Jesus returned for a quick trip to meet with Paul to give him a new Gospel.

The claim that Jesus was hoping to be rejected and killed as a sin sacrifice conflicts with the fact that it was the will of the devil and in opposition to his positive work with the original gospel. But you have to ignore that “he went first to his own”.

God has always been forgiving, he certainly never conceived of such a scheme as requiring an innocent to die as a condition to forgive the guilty.
 

JudgeRightly

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If Jesus wanted Paul to be an apostle he would have chosen him while on the earth.

So you're limiting Christ to only picking people while he's on earth... why? For what reason is He only limited to picking people while on earth?

I don’t believe that Jesus returned for a quick trip to meet with Paul to give him a new Gospel.

Argument from incredulity is a fallacy, Caino.

The claim that Jesus was hoping to be rejected and killed as a sin sacrifice conflicts with the fact that it was the will of the devil and in opposition to his positive work with the original gospel. But you have to ignore that “he went first to his own”.

You must have never read Ephesians 1:11. Oh wait... That was written by Paul, wasn't it.....

God has always been forgiving, he certainly never conceived of such a scheme as requiring an innocent to die as a condition to forgive the guilty.

Intentionally painting what God did in a bad light to fit your own beliefs is wrong, Caino.

I won't take the time to explain it to you, as it would be casting pearls before swine, but I will throw you a life preserver: you should learn what "penal substitution" means, along with "kinsman redeemer."
 

Caino

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So you're limiting Christ to only picking people while he's on earth... why? For what reason is He only limited to picking people while on earth?
He wouldn't pick someone to teach a different, compromised Gospel for the sake of pleasing pre-existing religious ideology in the Greco-Roman world. But hey, I believe Paul's conversion was real, many people have had them, but that doesn't mean that every thought, word and letter he spoke going forward was the "Word of God".

Paul was the first great evangelist of Jesus to the Gentile world. His message was Jesus as Paul understood him. Paul's followers made him into a demigod when he left, even converting his letters of correspondence into Gods word.

I do think Paul was "called" but so were the other apostles, NONE of which were perfect or demigods.



Intentionally painting what God did in a bad light to fit your own beliefs is wrong, Caino.
Explaining that the speculation and conjecture about the meaning of the death on the cross isn't criticism of God, it's criticism of the men who made such conclusions into a new Gospel after Jesus left. Jesus warned us about false prophets. They meant well and Jesus did foster the church as the only thing he had to work with but just because men become religious doesn't mean they are perfect.



I won't take the time to explain it to you, as it would be casting pearls before swine, but I will throw you a life preserver: you should learn what "penal substitution" means, along with "kinsman redeemer."
I know what both of those terms mean, Jesus never used them nor taught them. Those ideas come from the human EGO that finds it difficult to receive a gift without feeling he must do something equal in return to square up the account.

You should take some time to learn what forgiveness is, what a Loving Father is.

Penal substitution is theoretical salvation which only requires intellectual, theological belief.

The Gospel of Jesus was about a real change of heart, acknowledging sin, receiving Gods forgiveness and in turn forgive others, a living faith.
 
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JudgeRightly

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He wouldn't pick someone to teach a different,

Because you say so?

compromised Gospel

Question begging. Fallacy. Stop it.

for the sake of pleasing pre-existing religious ideology in the Greco-Roman world.

This is what I meant by nonsense, Caino.

But hey, I believe Paul's conversion was real, many people have had them, but that doesn't mean that every thought, word and letter he spoke going forward was the "Word of God".

It's not just an assumption, Caino. Scripture outside of Paul affirms his writings to be the word of God. (1 Peter 3:15-16 was written by Peter, not by Paul.)

Paul was the first great evangelist of Jesus to the Gentile world. His message was Jesus as Paul understood him.

Wrong.

Paul's gospel was revealed to him by Jesus.

Paul's followers made him into a demigod when he left,

Liar.

even converting his letters of correspondence into Gods word.

Again: Peter considered Paul's writings to be scripture DURING Paul's lifetime.

I do think Paul was "called" but so were the other apostles,

Which is exactly the point.

NONE of which were perfect or demigods.

Straw man.

Explaining that the speculation and conjecture about the meaning of the death on the cross isn't criticism of God, it's criticism of the men who made such conclusions into a new Gospel after Jesus left.

What you did wasn't "explaining" anything. It was projecting your beliefs onto scripture.

Jesus warned us about false prophets.

Such as yourself.

They meant well and Jesus did foster the church as the only thing he had to work with but just because men become religious doesn't mean they are perfect.

Straw man.

I know what both of those terms mean,

No, you don't. At the very least, you don't know or understand how it is tied in to the story of the Bible.

Jesus never used them nor taught them.

Argument from silence. Fallacy. Stop it.

Those ideas come from the human EGO that finds it difficult to receive a gift without feeling he must do something equal in return to square up the account.

Nonsense.

You should take some time to learn what forgiveness is, what a Loving Father is.

Forgiveness, as Jesus taught it, requires repentance.

If people don't repent, it's a bad idea to forgive them, because it teaches them that they don't have to repent towards God for Him to forgive them, rather that it's superfluous, when it's not.

Love is not hate. Forgiving everyone without exception is an expression of hatred towards them, because you are not teaching them reality.

Penal substitution is theoretical salvation which only requires intellectual, theological belief.

Like I said, you have no idea what it's about.

The Gospel of Jesus was about a real change of heart, acknowledging sin, receiving Gods forgiveness and in turn forgive others, a living faith.

Wrong.
 

Caino

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Because you say so?
Because Jesus had already taught the Gospel to the apostles that they were to go out into the world and teach. He never said he was coming back to teach Saul somewhere in Arabia a new Gospel.


The Great Commission
(Mark 16:14–18)

16Meanwhile, the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain Jesus had designated. 17When they saw Him, they worshiped Him, but some doubted.

18Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. 19Therefore go and make disciplesd of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”

Some apostles remained loyal to Jesus and went out into the world and taught the original Gospel. Peter and more so Paul unwittingly took over the movement and message. The rest is history. None of the other apostles rose to the kind of public prominence that Paul did. Some apostles vanished out in the world preaching the Gospel.


It's not just an assumption, Caino. Scripture outside of Paul affirms his writings to be the word of God. (1 Peter 3:15-16 was written by Peter, not by Paul.)

Sorry neither was Peter a God or perfect if he in fact wrote 1 Peter 3:15-16

Matthew 1. Matthew 26:69-70.
69. Now Peter sat outside in the courtyard. And a servant girl came to him, saying, “You also were with Jesus of Galilee.”
70. But he denied it before them all, saying, “I do not know what you are saying.”


Matthew 2. Matthew 26:71-72.
71. And when he had gone out to the gateway, another girl saw him and said to those who were there, “This fellow also was with Jesus of Nazareth.”
72. But again he denied with an oath, “I do not know the Man!”


Matthew 3. Matthew 26:73-74.
73. And a little later those who stood by came up and said to Peter, “Surely you also are one of them, for your speech betrays you.”
74. Then he began to curse and swear, saying, “I do not know the Man!”
Immediately a rooster crowed.


BTW, the accounts of the denials differ as should be expected because different imperfect people wrote them. There are many conflicting details concerning the same events in the Bible, again as should be expected. God didn't write it, institutional religion makes that claim to buttress their authority.


Paul's gospel was revealed to him by Jesus.
So his followers say.


Again: Peter considered Paul's writings to be scripture DURING Paul's lifetime.

Peter denied Jesus 3 times even after having been warned in his lifetime. Peter, a great man but not perfect.

No, you don't. At the very least, you don't know or understand how it is tied in to the story of the Bible.
Yes I do, you have too much pride to accept Gods Love and forgiveness so you have to concoct a substitute. The atonment is an assult upon Gods own free will.


Forgiveness, as Jesus taught it, requires repentance.

If people don't repent, it's a bad idea to forgive them, because it teaches them that they don't have to repent towards God for Him to forgive them, rather that it's superfluous, when it's not.
As far as you are concerned to forgive as Jesus taught it is to "un-judge them" and let the ultimate Judge be their Judge. "Judge not that you be not Judged".


Love is not hate. Forgiving everyone without exception is an expression of hatred towards them, because you are not teaching them reality.
Again, for us forgiveness means to "un-judge". If we have not first judged people then forgiving them instant an issue. We are not competent judges of men's souls. Even Jesus took this position "And I do not judge you, for there is one who judges for me."
 

Robert Pate

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Because you say so?



Question begging. Fallacy. Stop it.



This is what I meant by nonsense, Caino.



It's not just an assumption, Caino. Scripture outside of Paul affirms his writings to be the word of God. (1 Peter 3:15-16 was written by Peter, not by Paul.)



Wrong.

Paul's gospel was revealed to him by Jesus.



Liar.



Again: Peter considered Paul's writings to be scripture DURING Paul's lifetime.



Which is exactly the point.



Straw man.



What you did wasn't "explaining" anything. It was projecting your beliefs onto scripture.



Such as yourself.



Straw man.



No, you don't. At the very least, you don't know or understand how it is tied in to the story of the Bible.



Argument from silence. Fallacy. Stop it.



Nonsense.



Forgiveness, as Jesus taught it, requires repentance.

If people don't repent, it's a bad idea to forgive them, because it teaches them that they don't have to repent towards God for Him to forgive them, rather that it's superfluous, when it's not.

Love is not hate. Forgiving everyone without exception is an expression of hatred towards them, because you are not teaching them reality.



Like I said, you have no idea what it's about.



Wrong.
Neither one of you understand "The Historical Gospel of Jesus Christ". The Gospel calls all things into question, especially religion, which is a work of the law. Any religious thing that we do is a work of the law, Paul said, "By the works of the law (what we do) no flesh will be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin" Romans 3:20. Many think that they are justified by their religion. There is nothing, absolutely nothing that we can do to please God. God only accepts the works and the person of Jesus Christ, we are accepted only in him and because of him. In the judgment the only ones that are going to be saved are those that are "In Christ". To be "In Christ" means that you are trusting in his righteousness and in his atonement for your sins, plus nothing.
 

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Because Jesus had already taught the Gospel to the apostles that they were to go out into the world and teach. He never said he was coming back to teach Saul somewhere in Arabia a new Gospel.
There are MANY gospels in the Bible. GOSPEL simply means GOOD NEWS.
Jesus did NOT preach the GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD while He was on earth ministering to ISRAEL. Jesus preached the GOSPEL OF THE KINGDOM.
Matt 15:24 (AKJV/PCE)
(15:24) But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Rom 15:8 (AKJV/PCE)
(15:8) Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises [made] unto the fathers:
The Great Commission
(Mark 16:14–18)

16Meanwhile, the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain Jesus had designated. 17When they saw Him, they worshiped Him, but some doubted.

18Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. 19Therefore go and make disciplesd of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey all that I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
Jesus taught Israel (the eleven with one replacement to be added later) to keep the law of Moses.
Matt 23:1-3 (AKJV/PCE)
(23:1) Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, (23:2) Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: (23:3) All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, [that] observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
 

Right Divider

Body part
Neither one of you understand "The Historical Gospel of Jesus Christ".
You mean the one that you will not define? What about Mark 1:1? Why do you ignore this verse?
The Gospel calls all things into question, especially religion, which is a work of the law. Any religious thing that we do is a work of the law, Paul said, "By the works of the law (what we do) no flesh will be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin" Romans 3:20. Many think that they are justified by their religion. There is nothing, absolutely nothing that we can do to please God. God only accepts the works and the person of Jesus Christ, we are accepted only in him and because of him. In the judgment the only ones that are going to be saved are those that are "In Christ". To be "In Christ" means that you are trusting in his righteousness and in his atonement for your sins, plus nothing.
There are MANY gospels in the Bible and you do NOT understand what they are or how they relate to one another.

Stop falsely accusing and DISCUSS THE SCRIPTURE.
 
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