Mortal sin, free will, and going to Communion

Idolater

"Foundation of the World" Dispensationalist χρ
Avoiding going to Sunday Mass is a grave sin.

Grave sins are grave because of their objective weight, not due to any subjective judgment.

A "mortal sin" is a grave sin which is committed with informed consent, which means with full knowledge and with deliberate consent.

Sometimes people seem very clearly to just be trying to weasel out of going to Mass. What the point of this thread is, is that this does not necessarily mean that the people's own direct experience, is that they're just trying to get out of having to go to Mass.

People can be under spells. This is why the bishops are not keen on withholding Communion, because we don't know if a person who is pretty apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, but going to Communion when they do come back (without going to confession first), is a Christian who is under a spell, or is a non-believer.

Christians apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, who are doing so while under spells, are not fully guilty of skipping Mass, which means it's not a mortal sin, which means it's at worst a venial sin, which means these Christians are not endangering themselves to partake of the altar.

Spells can be in the form of peer pressure, old habits, anxiety, and many other mundane conditions which people encounter all the time. It could also be a threat of some sort, which pressures you to skip Mass against your will. The common theme of all these various circumstances, is that they diminish, attenuate or even nullify altogether your free will.
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
Avoiding going to Sunday Mass is a grave sin.

Grave sins are grave because of their objective weight, not due to any subjective judgment.

A "mortal sin" is a grave sin which is committed with informed consent, which means with full knowledge and with deliberate consent.

Sometimes people seem very clearly to just be trying to weasel out of going to Mass. What the point of this thread is, is that this does not necessarily mean that the people's own direct experience, is that they're just trying to get out of having to go to Mass.

People can be under spells. This is why the bishops are not keen on withholding Communion, because we don't know if a person who is pretty apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, but going to Communion when they do come back (without going to confession first), is a Christian who is under a spell, or is a non-believer.

Christians apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, who are doing so while under spells, are not fully guilty of skipping Mass, which means it's not a mortal sin, which means it's at worst a venial sin, which means these Christians are not endangering themselves to partake of the altar.

Spells can be in the form of peer pressure, old habits, anxiety, and many other mundane conditions which people encounter all the time. It could also be a threat of some sort, which pressures you to skip Mass against your will. The common theme of all these various circumstances, is that they diminish, attenuate or even nullify altogether your free will.
It is a sin if you are following the "law of catholics".
Personally, I am a Christian, and free from such laws.
 

Jefferson

Administrator
Staff member
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When I was in my 20s I noticed a major difference between Catholics & protestants. It wasn't just that my Catholic friends had more premarital sex, but that they were so shameless about it.

Their attitude was, "This is what mass is for. I get to sin all I want. I just have to remember to go mass, take communion and confess my sins to my priest and I'm good to go for another week of premarital sex! Pretty sweet deal!!!"
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
When I was in my 20s I noticed a major difference between Catholics & protestants. It wasn't just that my Catholic friends had more premarital sex, but that they were so shameless about it.

Their attitude was, "This is what mass is for. I get to sin all I want. I just have to remember to go mass, take communion and confess my sins to my priest and I'm good to go for another week of premarital sex! Pretty sweet deal!!!"


😂 I find that very hard to believe. I've never heard a Catholic ever say that, even have that attitude, and I grew up in a Catholic family and very Catholic environment for most of my life. Also, having sex outside marriage is a mortal sin and you can't go to Communion unless you've gone to confession first. Every Catholic knows that.
 

Jefferson

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Staff member
Administrator
Super Moderator
😂 I find that very hard to believe. I've never heard a Catholic ever say that, even have that attitude, and I grew up in a Catholic family and very Catholic environment for most of my life.
I had a different experience.
Also, having sex outside marriage is a mortal sin and you can't go to Communion unless you've gone to confession first. Every Catholic knows that.
I didn't claim my list was chronological. I don't know that much about Catholicism.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
I had a different experience.

That's the problem with anecdotes, whether yours or mine.

I didn't claim my list was chronological. I don't know that much about Catholicism.

Apparently neither did your friends! Not that I'm judging, but I am drawing a line of distinction between observant Catholics and cultural Catholics. Even the mob was in church for baptisms, weddings, and funerals.
 

Catholic Crusader

Kyrie Eleison
Banned
Avoiding going to Sunday Mass is a grave sin.

Grave sins are grave because of their objective weight, not due to any subjective judgment.

A "mortal sin" is a grave sin which is committed with informed consent, which means with full knowledge and with deliberate consent.

Sometimes people seem very clearly to just be trying to weasel out of going to Mass. What the point of this thread is, is that this does not necessarily mean that the people's own direct experience, is that they're just trying to get out of having to go to Mass.

People can be under spells. This is why the bishops are not keen on withholding Communion, because we don't know if a person who is pretty apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, but going to Communion when they do come back (without going to confession first), is a Christian who is under a spell, or is a non-believer.

Christians apparently flagrantly skipping Mass, who are doing so while under spells, are not fully guilty of skipping Mass, which means it's not a mortal sin, which means it's at worst a venial sin, which means these Christians are not endangering themselves to partake of the altar.

Spells can be in the form of peer pressure, old habits, anxiety, and many other mundane conditions which people encounter all the time. It could also be a threat of some sort, which pressures you to skip Mass against your will. The common theme of all these various circumstances, is that they diminish, attenuate or even nullify altogether your free will.

Even though those things are all true, wording them like that will not win over many people. LOL

Why is Avoiding going to Sunday Mass is a grave sin?
 

Idolater

"Foundation of the World" Dispensationalist χρ
Even though those things are all true, wording them like that will not win over many people. LOL
I told you before, you're the one who's rhetorically gifted, not me.
Why is Avoiding going to Sunday Mass is a grave sin?
Jesus wants us and instructs us to attend Mass on every Sunday (or Saturday evening; the vigil Mass), that's just the textbook obligation. Why is skipping Sunday Mass grave matter? That's up to Him, idk.
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
I told you before, you're the one who's rhetorically gifted, not me.

Jesus wants us and instructs us to attend Mass on every Sunday (or Saturday evening; the vigil Mass), that's just the textbook obligation. Why is skipping Sunday Mass grave matter? That's up to Him, idk.
Do you have a scripture for that?
 

Idolater

"Foundation of the World" Dispensationalist χρ
Yeah. 1st Timothy 3:1 Paul explicates "office of a bishop", which is an office, which is an institution, which was established by the Apostles personally, which was explicitly in the Bible intended to perpetuate "until the Lord comes".

So the Lord hasn't come yet. So that means the institution of the office of a bishop still persists to this day and in our time.

The bishops teach as is their duty (office means duty).

The Bible says they teach what they are taught, by the Apostles.

Any more questions? Hoping?
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
Yeah. 1st Timothy 3:1 Paul explicates "office of a bishop", which is an office, which is an institution, which was established by the Apostles personally, which was explicitly in the Bible intended to perpetuate "until the Lord comes".
So the Lord hasn't come yet. So that means the institution of the office of a bishop still persists to this day and in our time.
The bishops teach as is their duty (office means duty).
The Bible says they teach what they are taught, by the Apostles.
Any more questions? Hoping?
As your teaching isn't in the bible, it is obviously not something the Lord had His bishops preach.
That being said, it is a false teaching and of the devil.
Another false teaching contrary to what the word of God teaches is that the bishops can't marry.
Not to mention that they are to be blameless.
 

Idolater

"Foundation of the World" Dispensationalist χρ
As your teaching isn't in the bible
My teachers are in the Bible.
And what do you think Hebrews 10:25 alludes to anyway. "Not in the Bible" lol Hoping. lol.
, it is obviously not something the Lord had His bishops preach.
That being said, it is a false teaching and of the devil.
Another false teaching contrary to what the word of God teaches is that the bishops can't marry.
Not to mention that they are to be blameless.
 

Catholic Crusader

Kyrie Eleison
Banned
Do you have a scripture for that?

"Do this in memory of me."

When Jesus says to do things, Catholics do it. Protestants generally ignore Jesus' commands

"Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood you have no life in you."

We have Life. You do not. At least, that is what Jesus says.

Your problem is with Jesus not us
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
It is in the Bible. You are making a false statement.
Where in the bible are we told to call some guy "father"?
Where in the bible are we told not to eat meet on Fridays?
Where in the bible are we taught that the leaders must wear outrageous gowns and hats?
Your bishops teach thing condemned in the bible.
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
"Do this in memory of me."

When Jesus says to do things, Catholics do it. Protestants generally ignore Jesus' commands
Things like..."Go and sin no more"?
Things like..."Pray for your enemies and do good unto them", and "Turn the other cheek",?
Your false teachers bless bombs for the military !
"Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood you have no life in you."
We have Life. You do not. At least, that is what Jesus says.
Your problem is with Jesus not us
Where are we taught that it must be on any certain day?
I have no problems with Jesus or with you.
It is false religions that I have a problem with.
Religions that accommodate sin are not of God.
 

Hoping

Well-known member
Banned
My teachers are in the Bible.
And what do you think Hebrews 10:25 alludes to anyway. "Not in the Bible" lol Hoping. lol.
It "alludes to" meeting together.
What do the next five verses "allude to"?
It is written..."For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people." (Heb 10:26-30)
Instead of holding on to faith, your religion accommodates sin with a "sacrament" of confession.
That is just a glorification of retelling your sins over and over again.
It is written that "God heareth not sinners." (John 9:31)
Until a man's repentance from sin is true, they waste their time praying.
 

Catholic Crusader

Kyrie Eleison
Banned
Where in the bible are we told to call some guy "father"?
Where in the bible are we told not to eat meet on Fridays?
Where in the bible are we taught that the leaders must wear outrageous gowns and hats?
Your bishops teach thing condemned in the bible.


You are the religious version of a Democrat. When you cannot answer one argument you start spewing out all sorts or propaganda spaghetti hoping a few pieces with stick the wall.

People like you do not know how to have thoughtful respectful conversations.

You asked "Do you have a scripture for that?"

And I replied: ""Do this in memory of me."
"Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood you have no life in you."

Instead of continuing the conversation you changed subject and started spewing out nonsense. Like I said, people like you do not know how to have thoughtful respectful conversations.

So, each one of your NEW issues I quoted have all been discussed in various threads.

Find one and ask your question, don't derail this thread with your ignorance and your lack of ability to stay on one topic.


Where in the bible are we told to call some guy "father"?


Where in the bible are we taught that the leaders must wear outrageous gowns and hats?

Why do you care what they wear. What a stupid question.

Your bishops teach thing condemned in the bible.

LOL.
 
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