17 Year Old Shot And Killed By Cop

[patrick jane]

Yes, I know how they were all possible. Deven was sitting on Frost, they were struggling. They were both moving around. Deven bent over Frost at times so the bullet traveled downward. Downward in this case is in relation to Deven's body. Deven sat up at times, so bullets traveled upward. Other shots were at no significant angle up or down so the report doesn't mention it. It all very possible and the prosecutor knew that and stated that in the report. To disagree now is to enter your own conspiracy fantasy land.

At times ? How long do you think this lasted ? How much force can one muster while bullets are bouncing around inside of them, blowing their organs and insides out ?

 

[Granite]

At times ? How long do you think this lasted ? How much force can one muster while bullets are bouncing around inside of them, blowing their organs and insides out ?

Four seconds, mind you.

 

[ok doser]

I'm sure I could still keep somebody pinned with 5 or 6 bullets in me

four seconds

"During the fight, both combatants were likely moving their arms and bodies..."

really? :noway:

 

[GuySmiley]

From page 18: "During the fight, both combatants were likely moving their arms and bodies, which explains the different bullet trajectories."

One would think Frost would be able to actually explain this himself. Either he didn't, or we're not privy to information he provided on this topic--which is unlikely. If he had, the report wouldn't need to use weasel words to explain how an officer "pinned" to the ground would still be able to move freely.

What the report's asking us to believe is that Frost was

a) pinned, yet able to move
b) able to fire several shots from a sharp downward trajectory while pinned to his back on the ground
c) and remained pinned after seven shots had been fired by the body of his assailant

This doesn't hold up. And even the report doesn't use unequivocal language here.

Pinned doesn't mean his entire body was glued down. Only one shot was mentioned as being in a sharp downward trajectory. Clearly he was "pinned" by the dead weight of Deven's body, which gives us more insight that when the writer says "pinned" he doesn't mean absolutely unable to move.

 

[Granite]

Pinned doesn't mean his entire body was glued down. Only one shot was mentioned as being in a sharp downward trajectory. Clearly he was "pinned" by the dead weight of Deven's body, which gives us more insight that when the writer says "pinned" he doesn't mean absolutely unable to move.

Head: Downward
Chest: "Steeply" downward
Left lower chest: "Slightly" downward

So three wounds with a downward trajectory one way or another. And during the struggle we're expected to believe although Frost's intention for his firearm was obvious Guildford ignored the officer's arm, upper body, and the firearm itself. And the best the report can do is say it's "likely" they moved enough during the struggle to explain away any inconsistencies with the gunshots.

 

[GuySmiley]

Head: Downward
Chest: "Steeply" downward
Left lower chest: "Slightly" downward

So three wounds with a downward trajectory one way or another. And during the struggle we're expected to believe although Frost's intention for his firearm was obvious Guildford ignored the officer's arm, upper body, and the firearm itself. And the best the report can do is say it's "likely" they moved enough during the struggle to explain away any inconsistencies with the gunshots.

Apparently Guildford was concentrating on beating Frost's face in. I think if Frost said they were fighting, its ok to say they were likely moving. We don't need specific statements from Frost to say he was also moving.

 

[Granite]

Apparently Guildford was concentrating on beating Frost's face in. I think if Frost said they were fighting, its ok to say they were likely moving. We don't need specific statements from Frost to say he was also moving.

If he told authorities so one way or another this tidbit didn't make its way into the report. Which, again, leaves us weasel words and room for authorities to squirm.

 

[patrick jane]

four seconds



really? :noway:

Yes and the situation obviously called for 6 initial shots and one head shot to seal the deal. He couldn't stop shooting once he started.

 

[ok doser]

again, if i'm a cop and a criminal is on top of me pounding my face, i'm going to empty my clip into him

to kill him

 

[lifeisgood]

I had seen the video before.

Tragic, tragic, tragic.

Indeed.

However.... when a police officer asks you to comply you need to comply. You can have your lawyer help you with any perceived injustice later. But at the scene just do as the officer says.

No instant gratification though. Most everybody these days, want 'instant' gratification.

There's too much anger going around (both sides). No space for reasoning any more and that's one reason as to why these things happen.

And from the police's perspective I think it's kinda silly that he would be pulling people over for flashing their bright's at him.

I was told a long time ago that you are to NEVER to flash your lights when you see a cop. At that time, I was told that that meant that you are warning others that a cop is in the area (there are hidden cops when they are doing a sweep of an area) and that would implicate you as 'interfering' with them.

I do not think that's what happened here though.

But.... they are both white so I don't see any protests starting up anytime soon

How sad that as a society we have demeaned ourselves to 'you're white' / 'you're black,' instead of 'you're another human being such as I.'

 

[aikido7]

The Christian theologian made a point when he said there were two ways we relate to each other:

I:IT

and

I:THOU

When we dehumanize others, we see them as an "it." In fact, all living things can be regarded this way.

The "I:THOU" relationship is a holy one that acknowledges God in the other.

Soldiers fight and shoot at "ITs." Christians regard all others in the "I-THOU"
matrix.

 

[patrick jane]

The Christian theologian made a point when he said there were two ways we relate to each other:

I:IT

and

I:THOU

When we dehumanize others, we see them as an "it." In fact, all living things can be regarded this way.

The "I:THOU" relationship is a holy one that acknowledges God in the other.

Soldiers fight and shoot at "ITs." Christians regard all others in the "I-THOU"
matrix.

ok then.

 

[Mocking You]

Now we are into conspiracy theory land, have fun.

Conspiracy Land?

We're reading the report on the autopsy. BTW, you will notice that the head shot:

"Entered Deven's right front scalp....the trajectory was from the right-to-left, from the front-to-back, and downward. The shot occurred at close, near-contact range, as evidenced by soot on the skin."

Hmmm... so Deven, who is allegedly sitting on the cop's waist/hips gets shot on the top right side of his head. This means the cop likely shot him left-handed with his hand above Deven's head? Not possible.

 

[Mocking You]

Or some were and some weren't like the report says.


His hips could be pinned and his arms and upper body could be free to move.

So why wasn't he using his free hands and arms to block the punches? Where in the report to we hear about bruised and bloody knuckles on Deven? Oh, that's right....we don't hear about that.

 

[GuySmiley]

Conspiracy Land?

We're reading the report on the autopsy. BTW, you will notice that the head shot:

"Entered Deven's right front scalp....the trajectory was from the right-to-left, from the front-to-back, and downward. The shot occurred at close, near-contact range, as evidenced by soot on the skin."

Hmmm... so Deven, who is allegedly sitting on the cop's waist/hips gets shot on the top right side of his head. This means the cop likely shot him left-handed with his hand above Deven's head? Not possible.

It's possible.

 

[GuySmiley]

So why wasn't he using his free hands and arms to block the punches? Where in the report to we hear about bruised and bloody knuckles on Deven? Oh, that's right....we don't hear about that.

Have you ever cleared a jammed gun with one hand? Nobody has. Its in the report.

 

[Mocking You]

Have you ever cleared a jammed gun with one hand? Nobody has. Its in the report.

The gun ALLEGEDLY jammed.

And Deven's bloody knuckles?

 

[GuySmiley]

The gun ALLEGEDLY jammed.

And Deven's bloody knuckles?

Yes, allegedly jammed, and they found the unfired round just where they should have. So the evidence supports that the gun jammed. The report says nothing about Deven's knuckles, so, you know, absence of evidence . . .

 

[Granite]

It's possible.

Very unlikely, and you know it. Who here's really straining against the facts and spinning a conspiracy theory, Guy?

 

[GuySmiley]

Very unlikely, and you know it. Who here's really straining against the facts and spinning a conspiracy theory, Guy?

I think its highly likely. If Deven were to bend down and the cop wanted to get a fatal shot, you'd have to reach up and angle the gun down against his head. You'd be trying to reach around where his hand are and out of his vision. I think its more likely to put the gun at the top of his head and shoot downward than to put the gun right in his face or under his chin where Deven would be trying to block your hands or even take the gun away.