ARCHIVE: Will You Be Celebrating Christmas?

[JoyfulRook]

In a reply to Hilston:

I'll comment as soon as you tell us how long you've had homosexual tendencies.

And Hilston never responds! :think: :shocked:


(Maybe he had to take off his shoes and socks and is still counting. :chuckle: )

 

[Mr. 5020]

:chuckle:

 

[Hilston]

Any takers?

Any takers?

DH or Mr. 5020,

Since koban seems to be disinclined to participate in a theological discussion with me, do either of you have an opinion about this verse?

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

What does it mean and how would it apply today?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[koban]

DH or Mr. 5020,

Since koban seems to be disinclined to participate in a theological discussion with me, do either of you have an opinion about this verse?

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

What does it mean and how would it apply today?

Thanks,
Jim

Sorry Jim, I was away celebrating Christmas with my family - you know, the old "over the river and through the woods" thing? You must have been exposed to that before you had your theological beliefs so severely twisted. :freak:

As far as beating this theological discussion/dead horse, I could add nothing to the efforts of Knight, Sozo and others to try to correct you. You're gonna believe whatever you wanna believe and justify it in your own mind by twisting scripture.

Besides, I'm disinclined to discuss such matters with a suspected homosexual. :chuckle:

 

[Hilston]

Girl-bike, sundress ...

Girl-bike, sundress ...

Sorry Jim, I was away celebrating Christmas with my family - you know, the old "over the river and through the woods" thing? You must have been exposed to that before you had your theological beliefs so severely twisted. :freak:

I understand. But you should be aware that someone was apparently using your screenname and posted 28 times between the time I asked you the question on Dec 25 and your response just now, more than 2 days later.

As far as beating this theological discussion/dead horse, I could add nothing to the efforts of Knight, Sozo and others to try to correct you.

I don't blame you for copping out. I even anticipated this (see my previous post to DH and Mr. 5020).

You're gonna believe whatever you wanna believe and justify it in your own mind by twisting scripture.

Funny, I was just wondering if the same thing might be true about you. Those who follow my discussions will have a hearty chuckle over this and find it rather revealing that you're the one who doesn't want to discuss it.

"Why don't you go ride your girl-bike home and put on your sundress? You'll look so pretty." ~ Brak's Dad to Zorak.

Jim

 

[koban]

I understand. But you should be aware that someone was apparently using your screenname and posted 28 times between the time I asked you the question on Dec 25 and your response just now, more than 2 days later.

Gee Jim, sorry I didn't get to your post right away!

I don't blame you for copping out. I even anticipated this (see my previous post to DH and Mr. 5020).

And I don't blame you for admitting your exegesis is fatally flawed. Must be a hard admission to make, but good for you! :thumb:

Funny, I was just wondering if the same thing might be true about you.

Not so funny. When one is backed into a corner, about all one can do is accuse your accuser. :chuckle:

Those who follow my discussions will have a hearty chuckle

At least in this thread, I have to admit that's true! :darwinsm:

over this and find it rather revealing that you're the one who doesn't want to discuss it.

I have nothing to add that hasn't been covered by Knight, Sozo and others. Are you having difficulty understanding this? The flaws in your reasoning have been ably pointed out to you and just as readily dismissed by you.

"Why don't you go ride your girl-bike home and put on your sundress? You'll look so pretty." ~ Brak's Dad to Zorak.

Keep your sick fantasies to yourself, :flamer:

 

[Frank Ernest]

Let me see. I celebrated Christmas on December 25th. I celebrated the Official Secular Government-Sanctioned Holiday on December 26th. Did a Bible study on both days. (Actually, I do Bible study most every day.)

Rather than worrying with supposed theological niceties, I enjoyed the time off doing what I want. I did take time to thank Jesus for coming to us and praise and thank God for all His blessings. I asked the Holy Spirit to lead, guide and direct. Well, that's kind of a daily thing too.

'Bout covers it.

 

[Hilston]

Question about Ro 14:4,5

Question about Ro 14:4,5

Hi koban,

I was wondering if you would share with this thread your take on the following passage:

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

If you happen to agree with someone else's already expressed view of it, that's fine, too. Please indicate whom that would be.

Thanks,
Jim

 

[koban]

Let me see. I celebrated Christmas on December 25th. I celebrated the Official Secular Government-Sanctioned Holiday on December 26th. Did a Bible study on both days. (Actually, I do Bible study most every day.)

Rather than worrying with supposed theological niceties, I enjoyed the time off doing what I want. I did take time to thank Jesus for coming to us and praise and thank God for all His blessings. I asked the Holy Spirit to lead, guide and direct. Well, that's kind of a daily thing too.

'Bout covers it.

Seems like you're pretty well grounded Frank!


Sure hope you don't go to hell for it! :chuckle:

 

[koban]

Hi koban,

I was wondering if you would share with this thread your take on the following passage:

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

If you happen to agree with someone else's already expressed view of it, that's fine, too. Please indicate whom that would be.

Thanks,
Jim

It may take some digging and may be a while.

Trying to shake off a virus here. (software)

 

[Frank Ernest]

Seems like you're pretty well grounded Frank!


Sure hope you don't go to hell for it! :chuckle:

:darwinsm: Oh, no. I'm headed for Heaven one of these days. Still working on the "Well done, my good and faithful servant." pin.

 

[JoyfulRook]

DH or Mr. 5020,



Since koban seems to be disinclined to participate in a theological discussion with me, do either of you have an opinion about this verse?

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

What does it mean and how would it apply today?


Thanks,
Jim

I'm not quite sure what it means. I'll read the context and get back to you.

 

[Lucky]

If having a mother's day sermon religionizes the day, makes it into a symbolic holy day, then that is prohibited by Christ for His Body. Giving one's mother a card and flowers does not religionize the day.

So giving cards and flowers to mothers is okay. Having a sermon on the topic of mothers is okay. But if both are done on the same day it becomes angel worship and spits in the face of Christ's teaching. Oh, hold on, my Legalist-BS-ometer™ went off and it's annoying the heck out of me.

 

[Hilston]

Further clarification ...

Further clarification ...

So giving cards and flowers to mothers is okay. Having a sermon on the topic of mothers is okay. But if both are done on the same day it becomes angel worship and spits in the face of Christ's teaching. Oh, hold on, my Legalist-BS-ometer™ went off and it's annoying the heck out of me.

No, if they're done as a religiously symbolic and ritualistic exercise, it opposes the teachings of Christ. That's what Galatians 4:8-11 and Colossians 2:8-23 teach, as well as many other places in the epistles. Obedience to Christ's teaching is not legalism unless you're counting on your own obedience to justify you before God.

Thanks for the opportunity to further clarify.

Jim

 

[koban]

No, if they're done as a religiously symbolic and ritualistic exercise, it opposes the teachings of Christ. That's what Galatians 4:8-11 and Colossians 2:8-23 teach, as well as many other places in the epistles. Obedience to Christ's teaching is not legalism unless you're counting on your own obedience to justify you before God.

Thanks for the opportunity to further clarify.

Jim

Still haven't decided whether I'm going down the rabbit trail with you on Romans 14:4, but I couldn't let this one pass.

I'm justified before God by Christ's sacrifice.

You?

 

[Lucky]

No, if they're done as a religiously symbolic and ritualistic exercise, it opposes the teachings of Christ. That's what Galatians 4:8-11 and Colossians 2:8-23 teach, as well as many other places in the epistles.

"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:"

If I understand you, your interpretation is this, correct?

"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in your lack of respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:"

 

[Greywolf]

DH or Mr. 5020,

Since koban seems to be disinclined to participate in a theological discussion with me, do either of you have an opinion about this verse?

Ro 14:4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. 5 One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind.​

What does it mean and how would it apply today?

Thanks,
Jim

I realize I'm not on the invited list. But if it's all right with you, I'd like to discuss the issue.

Below, I've divide Romans 14:1-13 into several sections, and provided my view of what God is trying to say in each verse (from his perspective).

Romans 14:1

Receive one who is weak in the faith, but not to disputes over doubtful things.

Don't bicker over little things.

Romans 14:2-3

For one believes he may eat all things, but he who is weak eats only vegetables. Let not him who eats despise him who does not eat, and let not him who does not eat judge him who eats; for God has received him.

You guys are going to have differences of opinion. Don't hate each other over them.

Romans 14:4

Who are you to judge another’s servant? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for God is able to make him stand.

Who are you (Person 1) to judge another's (my) servant (Person 2)? To his own master (me) he stands or falls.

Remember, it's what I think that matters.

Romans 14:5-8

One person esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let each be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes the day, observes it to the Lord;[a] and he who does not observe the day, to the Lord he does not observe it. He who eats, eats to the Lord, for he gives God thanks; and he who does not eat, to the Lord he does not eat, and gives God thanks. For none of us lives to himself, and no one dies to himself. For if we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. Therefore, whether we live or die, we are the Lord’s.

Again, you guys are going to have differences of opinion. Make up your own mind about these things, and just keep in mind that whatever you do, it should be for me.

Romans 14:9

For to this end Christ died and rose and lived again, that He might be Lord of both the dead and the living.

I didn't sacrifice my only son so you guy could squabble over technicalities. (Don't make me come down there :Clete: )

Romans 14:10-13

But why do you judge your brother? Or why do you show contempt for your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.[c] For it is written:

“ As I live, says the LORD,
Every knee shall bow to Me,
And every tongue shall confess to God.”[d]

So then each of us shall give account of himself to God. Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather resolve this, not to put a stumbling block or a cause to fall in our brother’s way.

Don't you worry about judging your brothers, I'll take care of that. It'll only trip you up if you try to do it.


So in conclustion, I think the passage you quoted is trying to say that it doesn't matter whether or not you celebrate Christmas, just so long as whatever you decide to do is for God.

 

[Vaquero45]

No, if they're done as a religiously symbolic and ritualistic exercise, it opposes the teachings of Christ. That's what Galatians 4:8-11 and Colossians 2:8-23 teach, as well as many other places in the epistles. Obedience to Christ's teaching is not legalism unless you're counting on your own obedience to justify you before God.

Thanks for the opportunity to further clarify.

Jim

Hello Hilston, I'm enjoying the heck out of your BR efforts, thanks. :up:

On this issue, (Christmas) I would say that it is ok to celebrate as long as it isn't done as an effort to please (justify myself to) God. If I thought it dishonored God, or added to the Gospel of Grace I wouldn't do it.

If I didn't celebrate Christmas I don't believe God would even take notice, let alone care, and if I do celebrate Christmas I don't believe I gain anything in God's eyes. It doesn't bother my conscience in any way to celebrate it, but if it does yours, I respect your decision, and should not “hurt” “him for whom Christ died” with celebration. (Ro.14: 15-16) (by throwing it in your face, for instance) Are we on the same page?

My own take on Christmas is that it is mostly a silly hectic materialistic holiday, but I also think it is nice to specially remember and thank God for giving us Jesus. I don't put any spiritual weight on it. To me it's a fun tradition, and I dont see any issue with giving special thanks for Jesus on that day.

And sorry if I missed a post of yours that clarified this, it's a long thread.

 

[Hilston]

Plus nothing ...

Plus nothing ...

Still haven't decided whether I'm going down the rabbit trail with you on Romans 14:4, but I couldn't let this one pass.

I'm justified before God by Christ's sacrifice.

You?

Exactly. Christ's sacrifice, plus nothing else. No obedience, no faith, no good intentions can justify me before God. Only the shed blood of Christ in my behalf.

 

[God_Is_Truth]

My own take on Christmas is that it is mostly a silly hectic materialistic holiday, but I also think it is nice to specially remember and thank God for giving us Jesus. I don't put any spiritual weight on it. To me it's a fun tradition, and I dont see any issue with giving special thanks for Jesus on that day.

But if you give special thanks on that one day, doesn't that mean you are giving less thanks than you can be giving on every other day? Didn't Paul write to give thanks in everything? Shouldn't we be as thankful as we can, all the time, i.e. in everything?