BATTLE TALK - Battle Royale III ~ Dee Dee vs. Jerry

[rapt]

AMEN, Rev 7:17! Great post.

That is a very good question for the disps and anyone who WORSHIPS the Jews like idolaters worship their idols:

Why is this applicable to every other cult member, Buhddists, Morman, Islam, Occultist, Satanist BUT NEVER THE JEW who is more antichrist THAN ALL put together?

 

[Revelation717]

I think anyone looking at this from a Biblical perspective and not just a blind eye turned towards the Jew can see fellowship and support of unbelievers is a damnable heresy!


2Jo:1:10: If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
2Jo:1:11: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

What did ya think of Dee Dee's last post? I thought it strongly pointed out that the limited Scripture Jerry has brought up defeats his whole point.

Hey, what's up with the Back Alley? Is that gonna be another debating forum?

 

[cirisme]

Danger, Danger!

Danger, Danger!

And no " no man comes to the Father is not an exaggeration.

Then neither is verse 21.

You know better than that.

Of course I do, that's why I take Jesus at His word.

Then what qualifies as the worst event in the world ??

I guess you would rather ask Josephus than Jesus.

And why do you think it wasn't 70 Ad?

Perhaps because there were many other terrible tribulations in history. World War II, for instance.

It seems to me it matches up with the predictions that Jesus talked about in Matthew and John in Revelation. Things that would come about "shortly ." What do you think ?

That Dee Dee hasn't made this connection, at least not yet.

Rev,

What other event is comparable to 70 AD?

Perhaps the destruction of the first temple. The war in 70 AD was like any other war, two nations fought, one lost the other won.

And even if it isn't comparable to other wars, that doesn't necesarily mean that it is the worst tribulation since the world was made.

What event could ever campare to losing Gid even IF they GAIN the WORLD, RICHES, TEMPLES, ETC...?

I assume you mean GOD. Nothing, but that's not the first or last time someone will reject God, or that God gave up to fleshly desires.

We have the destruction of Jerusalem and the Jews carried away captive during Nebachadnezzer's rule but that was for 70 years and the destruction was not as intense.

And am I arguing that the first destruction of the temple was the worst tribulation....

NO!

We have the Holocost, but the Jews didn't have Jerusalem nor the temple, so sad as it may be and terrible as it may have been it was loss of lives, surely, but LOSS of way of living religiously and economically as a NATION and people it was NOT.

It was a terrible event, no doubt, but that's not the last time we'll see stuff like that.

So we see these two tragic events that occured with the Jewish people cannot compare to the MOST tragic event to happen to the Jewish people since the beginning of the world

God has given them up to their idols and wishes numerous times, 70AD was no different.

- The were slaughtered and massacred en masse.
- Starved to death and forced to eat even their own children for survival.
- Their love for each other waxed cold and every person was against even his own family.
- They lost all their economic resources, their land laid waste, gold and valuables plundered.
- They lost the heart of their worship, the Temple when it was destroyed BRICK by BRICK. The beloved Temple was destroyed and remains so even almost 2000 years later.
- BUt most of all look at it from a Biblical perspective, God does not acknowledge them as His people nor does He hear their prayers but it has become abomination to Him, their worship is in vain and WILL REMAIN so UNTIL they say "Blessed is He that caometh in the name of the Lord" Until they say Blessed Jesus, which THEY (MOST) WILL NOT DO. They are damned to hell unless they receive Jesus, DAMNED FOR ETERNITY, guilty and dead in sins.

:thumb:

Sounds like a lot of wars with Jews...

Jesus told them this very thing, Joh:8:24: I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins

And this is supposed to prove the tribulation is past?

I know plenty of people who haved died in their sins

So at this point in time, 70 AD, the Jewish people LOST everything!

Again I ask,
"And this is supposed to prove the tribulation is past?"

Even though today they have gained back the land, not ALL but some, the land is STILL in turmoil, the TEMPLE is still destroyed and GOD STILL hides His face from their ABOMINABLE prayers made daily at the Wailing Wall, because Jesus said, "For if ye BELIEVE NOT that I am He, ye shall DIE in your SINS" and " For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord".

Okay, so this proves that the tribulation is past?

AND if they cannot see Jesus, the Bible says the also cannot see the Father! If they deny Jesus, they deny the Father and Jesus sahll DENY THEM!

I hope you haven't squandered all your time by trying to present something you think is "news" to me, as I have already heard all these things.

Why is this applicable to every other cult member, Buhddists, Morman, Islam, Occultist, Satanist BUT NEVER THE JEW who is more antichrist THAN ALL others put together!

Eh?

One of fastest ways to get on my ignore list is to make up a bunch of strawmen.

 

[Jaltus]

A quick note to Dee Dee:

Bauer does not back an English translation of "genea," as he wrote the dictionary in German. It was Gingrich, Arndt, and Danker who put it into English.

 

[rapt]

James 2
1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

2 For if there come unto your assembly a (Jew), and there come in also a (Gentile)

3 And ye have respect to (Jew), and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the (Gentile), Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool:

4 Are ye not then partial in yourselves, and are become judges of evil thoughts?

7 Do not (the Jews) blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?

8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:

9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham OUR father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Jn 8:33 (The Jews) answered (Jesus), We be Abraham's seed...

39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.

40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

41 Ye do the deeds of your father.

Then said they to him, ...we have one Father, even God.

42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me...

44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. ...

45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.



Gal 3:6 Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.


26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.


28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for YE ARE ALL ONE in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

How much clearer could it be? How can we respect the Jew above anyone else, ESPECIALLY when they reject Jesus Christ? They are NOT the children of God without faith in Christ. They are of the DEVIL. They BLASPHEME the name of Christ. They will DIE IN THEIR SINS unless they repent and believe the gospel, the everlasting righteousness that was brought to them in the first century, even before their temple and city was made desolate by the one who they crucified.

 

[cirisme]

How much clearer could it be? How can we respect the Jew above anyone else, ESPECIALLY when they reject Jesus Christ? They are NOT the children of God without faith in Christ. They are of the DEVIL. They BLASPHEME the name of Christ. They will DIE IN THEIR SINS unless they repent and believe the gospel, the everlasting righteousness that was brought to them in the first century, even before their temple and city was made desolate by the one who they crucified.

One of fastest ways to get on my ignore list is to make up a bunch of strawmen.

I will now ask you to refrain from such blatant lies and attacks about me.

 

[rapt]

mrsnacks:

And why do you think it wasn't 70 Ad?


Cirisme:

Perhaps because there were many other terrible tribulations in history. World War II, for instance.

The war in 70 AD was like any other war, two nations fought, one lost the other won.

And even if it isn't comparable to other wars, that doesn't necesarily mean that it is the worst tribulation since the world was made.



Jesus made it CLEAR in Luke 21 that the tribulation He spake of was only to befall the unbelieving Jews at that time:

20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.

21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.

22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon THIS people.

24 And THEY shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Even if you're not convinced, these things are brought up for others who read these strings.

 

[Revelation717]

Cirisme,

What attacks?

I haven't seen you attacked by anyone here.


You quoted me then stated:

"--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
717- "So at this point in time, 70 AD, the Jewish people LOST everything!"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Cirisme - "Again I ask,
"And this is supposed to prove the tribulation is past?"


What maore could befall a person or nation of people than to lose EVERYTHING ~ especially ~GOD?

AN ENTIRE NATION OF PEOPLE WERE FORSAKEN BY GOD AS A RESULT OF THEIR MURDER OF HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON!

What else do you wait for?

What could possibly be more HORRIFIC than this?

I guess those that burn in hell well also be saying "Eh- it's not sooo hot, so we must not be in hell ~Yea - there's HOPE!" :doh:

What I'm saying here is, "What in the world do we need to say, "Yep that's it the tribulation is past"

 

[Yxboom]

Now I know I this is a hockey match!

 

[rapt]

Cirisme quotes HIMSELF :

One of fastest ways to get on my ignore list is to make up a bunch of strawmen.

..and then says:

I will now ask you to refrain from such blatant lies and attacks about me.

I think it's time to ignore somebody, for sure! :doh:

 

[mrsnacks]

I guess my question is more a psychological one. It seems to me so crystal clear that the Great Trib is a past event drawing not only from the Word of God, but outside sources such as the writings of Josephus etc. How is it that it's so difficult to see that ? Why I was blind to that was simply accepting and trusting that Lindsey , Impe, , and the rest knew better than I . I never challenged their teaching. And what I've found since I came over to preterism is that the disp close on me like a fist around a doornob. I don't claim to have all the answers . I'm fairly new ( 7 months ) . But in all the 30 years of holding to the futurist view, I've never known anyone to really challenge them or me to justify the why's of what they believe. I wasn't aware of apocalyptic language usage , figures of speech, or church history in general. Bible studies were basically what does the passage mean to you ?? It's just a given to accept the gurus of prophecy . When Lindsey speaks ----everyone listens. If they make false predictions and redefine the word "generation" several times that's okay, and say the words "soon" "I come quickly" "at the doors " " the time is near" and etc---it doesn't mean what it means. It could mean 2000 years into the future. Stars aren't really stars mentioned in Rev-------They are meteors or comets . You can't see the sun in Rev because of the pollution on earth and it goes on and on. It goes to show, that Revelation was as it says written to the churches at that time. It was to that generation , not ours because it is not only hard to understand today ( it's not impossible ) --but that they clearly had the understanding because it was contemporary at that time. The Bible is an ancient book (God's Word) to us livimg today. We are supposed to have the Holy Spirit leading us to all truth. As someone said, " the strongest argument against Christianity are Christians. " Is frustration one of the fruits of the Spirit ??

 

[rapt]

mrsnacks,


Jesus, Paul, Peter, and John all warned of false teachers. They were around even while the apostles were alive, but came into the church like a flood after they died, exalting themselves as the apostles of Christ. We've had 2000 years for them to spread their deceit, and they're STILL spreading it. Only now they have the mass media to reach so much farther than ever before. Evil men and seducers have waxed worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.

But the Holy Spirit and the grace of God much more abounds where sin and lies do. If we want to know the truth, we CAN'T let others do our homework or our praying for us; we must do it ourselves. We can't trust in men and allow our hearts to depart from God along with the crowd. We must realize that the popular way is the wide way that leads to destruction, and know that only FEW will ever find the truth that leads to life. We must STRIVE to enter in at the narrow gate, and REJECT the popular theories and fantasies of men. You have begun to run the race, after 30 years of going the wrong direction, and by the grace of God you will complete it, if you stand fast and be not intimidated by the cunning craftiness whereby they lie in wait to deceive. If we are faithful in that which is least, God will give us more. If we are unfaithful, even that we seem to have will be taken from us. God's ways are equal; man's way isn't.

 

[cirisme]

Jesus made it CLEAR in Luke 21

Jesus made it clear in Matthew 24:21 this would be the worst tribulation in the world.

Rev,

I haven't seen you attacked by anyone here.

What maore could befall a person or nation of people than to lose EVERYTHING ~ especially ~GOD?

Nothing!

In case you missed it my last post,

Nothing! Nothing! Nothing!

But this has happened to people and nations all the time. (To the Jews, multiple times ) I don't see anything that makes 70 AD too special in that respect.

 

[cirisme]

I think it's time to ignore somebody, for sure!

Thanks!!!! That's the best thing you can do for my conversion to "preterism"...

 

[rapt]

Cirisme:

Thanks!!!! That's the best thing you can do for my conversion to "preterism"...

From what? What are you now, Cirisme? A Jew? Do you even profess CHristianity at all?

 

[rapt]

Cirisme, no one has told any blatant lies about you or attacked you in this string. When you were confronted with that fact you said nothing. Why don't you apologize for making that statement. If it isn't true, then what is it?

 

[rapt]

For someone that makes an average of fourteen and a half posts per day you sure don't say much.

 

[cirisme]

From what?

Duh, futurism.



Although, if I have to be like you, you can forget it.

 

[cirisme]

Cirisme, no one has told any blatant lies about you or attacked you in this string.

Hmmm....

Why is this applicable to every other cult member, Buhddists, Morman, Islam, Occultist, Satanist BUT NEVER THE JEW who is more antichrist THAN ALL others put together!

I already said the opposite was true.

Why don't you apologize for making that statement.

What statement?

I'm sorry for saying Rev lied about me, even though he did.

Perhaps rev should apologize for misrepresenting me.

 

[rapt]

We were both refering to the UNBELIEVING Jews.

:doh: Prov 26:12

But if you're a disp AND a Jew, then it's no wonder you were offended by such a statement. Disps WORSHIP the Jews more than Christ. Disp'ism holds the same basic unbelief as the ubelieving Jews do while they CLAIM to believe the New Testament. Like the unbelieving Jew, they deny the fulfillment of Dan 9:24-27.