Theology Club: unspeakable words

[heir]

2 Corinthians 12:1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

2 Corinthians 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Corinthians 12:5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

2 Corinthians 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

What were the unspeakable words that Paul heard? What was the truth that Paul was holding out on saying?

 

[Danoh]

In light of a chapter like 2 Cor. 11, etc., my own understanding is that 2 Cor. 12 is the very same issue he was lamenting in 1 Cor. 2 and 3.

His Apostleship unto the Mystery...

Their continued "babes in Christ" immaturity...

Thus, his being unable to speak of the Mystery unto them as unto "them that are perfect" or mature, in the basics of Paul's "my gospel" and thus; ready for the "meat" that is the Mystery.

 

[Psalmist]

2 Corinthians 12:1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

2 Corinthians 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Corinthians 12:5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

2 Corinthians 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

What were the unspeakable words that Paul heard? What was the truth that Paul was holding out on saying?

It may have been things heard in paradise.

It may not be lawful to speak, because they were not understood.

It may have taken place on the road to Damascus.​

 

[Danoh]

If Mid-Acts is anything it is about being picky in the details where being so is of necessary use...

In this, a thought... when quoting passages that end with a ";" and a ")" if you replace the ")" with a "]" it gets you around the resulting smiley this forum's program is unable to "rightly divide" the distinction as to the poster's actual intent between those two.

This ";" and this ")" resulting in this where this ";" and "]" resulting in this ";]" had been one's intent.

Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5, 23.

 

[glorydaz]

In light of a chapter like 2 Cor. 11, etc., my own understanding is that 2 Cor. 12 is the very same issue he was lamenting in 1 Cor. 2 and 3.

His Apostleship unto the Mystery...

Their continued "babes in Christ" immaturity...

Thus, his being unable to speak of the Mystery unto them as unto "them that are perfect" or mature, in the basics of Paul's "my gospel" and thus; ready for the "meat" that is the Mystery.

It seems like the phrase "which it is not lawful for a man to utter" is odd since he says "all things are lawful" later on in Cor. Maybe it was something we aren't supposed to know until the "times of the gentiles be fulfilled".

 

[glorydaz]

If Mid-Acts is anything it is about being picky in the details where being so is of necessary use...

In this, a thought... when quoting passages that end with a ";" and a ")" if you replace the ")" with a "]" it gets you around the resulting smiley this forum's program is unable to "rightly divide" the distinction as to the poster's actual intent between those two.

This ";" and this ")" resulting in this where this ";" and "]" resulting in this ";]" had been one's intent.

Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5, 23.

I just hit the space bar in between. Less complicated. :chuckle:

 

[patrick jane]

2 Corinthians 12:1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

2 Corinthians 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Corinthians 12:5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

2 Corinthians 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

What were the unspeakable words that Paul heard? What was the truth that Paul was holding out on saying?

secret things of God and Christ -

 

[Danoh]

I just hit the space bar in between. Less complicated. :chuckle:

Leave it to me to complicate a thing, lol

Though what causes that in me, also has its pluses

 

[patrick jane]

If Mid-Acts is anything it is about being picky in the details where being so is of necessary use...

In this, a thought... when quoting passages that end with a ";" and a ")" if you replace the ")" with a "]" it gets you around the resulting smiley this forum's program is unable to "rightly divide" the distinction as to the poster's actual intent between those two.

This ";" and this ")" resulting in this where this ";" and "]" resulting in this ";]" had been one's intent.

Nevertheless, Rom. 14:5, 23.

i just ate Mom's homemade vegetable soup - :shut:

 

[DAN P]

2 Corinthians 12:1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

2 Corinthians 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Corinthians 12:5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

2 Corinthians 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

What were the unspeakable words that Paul heard? What was the truth that Paul was holding out on saying?

Hi and 2 Cor 12:4 , " that he was caught away into the Paradise , and heard UNSPOKEN WORDS which are Unlawful ( for ) a man to speak ."

#1 , Verse 2 goes back to the beginning of Paul learning the MYSTERY 14 years after he being saved in Acts 9:6 .

#2 , The THORN in the flesh was given so that he would not BOAST as verse 7 indicates !

#3 He was taken to the the 3 heaven to see and to encourage that through Paul's weakness God's POWER would work through him

#4, Unspeakables words , means , to Scared to be Uttered .\\\m

#5 , The 3 heaven is where all OT saints were taken to after they died , called Abraham's Bosom !!

#6 By his weakness Paul was then Powerful , verse 10 !

#7 Paul had many Revelations concerning the MYSTERY and of course this one is one of MANY !!

DAN P

 

[patrick jane]

2 Corinthians 12:1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

2 Corinthians 12:3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

2 Corinthians 12:5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

2 Corinthians 12:6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

What were the unspeakable words that Paul heard? What was the truth that Paul was holding out on saying?

he also uses that terminology in Romans 8:26 KJV -

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Acts 22
21 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.


Ding Ding!
Winner.

 

[glorydaz]

Acts 22
21 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.


Ding Ding!
Winner.

Oh, so it was "unlawful" to include the gentiles and they would try to kill him? If that's it, I think I get it.

 

[heir]

Acts 22
21 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.


Ding Ding!
Winner.

Bingo! We have a winner! :BRAVO:

My guess is, Paul wouldn't have gotten anywhere with the Jew on his first sending if he told them that alien Gentiles like that of the Ephesians were going to be not only offered salvation, but salvation apart from anything to do with Israel! So he held out until the remnant was gathered.

 

[glorydaz]

Bingo! We have a winner! :BRAVO:

My guess is, Paul wouldn't have gotten anywhere with the Jew on his first sending if he told them that alien Gentiles like that of the Ephesians were going to be not only offered salvation, but salvation apart from anything to do with Israel! So he held out until the remnant was gathered.

Yeah, after you posted this great OP and I got to thinking about the "unlawful" part, I had to scratch my head. Paul had said all things were lawful. I couldn't think what would be "unlawful" and why it would be unlawful. :think:

STP is indeed a winner....in more ways than one. (I never win at Bingo) :sigh:

 

[patrick jane]

Acts 22
21 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.


Ding Ding!
Winner.

yeah, big deeeyal. i knew that. i was just seein' how long it took you guys. big deeeeyal !!!!

 

[heir]

yeah, big deeeyal. i knew that. i was just seein' how long it took you guys. big deeeeyal !!!!

:chuckle:

 

[patrick jane]

Acts 22
21 And he said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

22 And they gave him audience unto this word, and then lifted up their voices, and said, Away with such a fellow from the earth: for it is not fit that he should live.


Ding Ding!
Winner.

at one point i started trying to count the times and the chapters/verses that speak of Paul or Paul and Barnabas or other brethren that were constantly being persecuted, pursued, plotted murder against, almost killed and facing rebuke at every turn, and the times that Paul perceived that they would.

Acts 13:50 KJV - and many other times; even before he was called Paul


Acts 7:56-57 KJV and 58, 59, 60

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Yeah, after you posted this great OP and I got to thinking about the "unlawful" part, I had to scratch my head. Paul had said all things were lawful. I couldn't think what would be "unlawful" and why it would be unlawful. :think:

STP is indeed a winner....in more ways than one. (I never win at Bingo) :sigh:

Yes, it was acceptable to preach to Gentiles who came to God through Israel, but they lost their cool when Paul was sent to far hence Gentiles...basically pagan Gentiles.