Theology Club: Who was FIRST in the Body of Christ ??

[DAN P]

Hi to all , and it unblieveable TO ME that most do not know WHO was the FIRST / PROTOS in the Body of Christ !!

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS saved by Grace !! Acts 9:6

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS , who was BAPTIZO / PLACED into the Body of Christ , 1 Cor 12:13

1 Tim 1:15 and 16 , SAYS that FIRST / PROTOS was , SAUL/PAUL !!

Faithful (is) the word and worthy of all reception that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners , of WHOM I AM FIRST /PROTOS .

Paul is NOT SAYING that Jesus is only saving people that are the worst of sinners , BUT that Saul/Paul was a PATTERN of the Ones coming to believe on Him unto everlasting life .

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS saved by Grace !! Acts 9:6

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS , BAPTIZO / PLACED into the Body of Christ , 1 Cor 12:13 !!

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS to reveal the Dispensation of the MYSTERY , Rom 16:25 , Eph 3:1-10 and Col 1:25 .

SAUL / PAUL was PROTOS , PROTOS , and always PROTOS !!

DAN P

 

[surrender]

Hi to all , and it unblieveable TO ME that most do not know WHO was the FIRST / PROTOS in the Body of Christ !!

Why does it matter?

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS saved by Grace !! Acts 9:6

Well, now, that’s a different question than the first. Acts 9:6 simply speaks of a man obeying the voice of God. If that’s being “saved by grace,” we can find that happening in Genesis.

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS , who was BAPTIZO / PLACED into the Body of Christ , 1 Cor 12:13

Again, why exactly is that information significant?

1 Tim 1:15 and 16 , SAYS that FIRST / PROTOS was , SAUL/PAUL !!

12 I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service, 13 even though I was formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor. Yet I was shown mercy because I acted ignorantly in unbelief ; 14 and the grace of our Lord was more than abundant, with the faith and love which are found in Christ Jesus. 15 It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all. 16 Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost, Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life.

Paul is not saying he was the first sinner to be saved by Jesus in verse 15. He’s saying he was the worst sinner, because he persecuted the church of God (“I was a blasphemer, persecutor, violent aggressor”). Besides, Paul could not have been the very first sinner saved for that would mean that Peter wasn’t a saved sinner yet. Unsaved sinners don’t have eternal life, but Peter did have eternal life (1 John 5:13). In verse 16, Paul says he found mercy because he was the worst sinner, so that Jesus could demonstrate his perfect patience as an example for others who would believe.

 

[Nick M]

Why does it matter?

Because people's eternal lives are at stake. What a stupid question.

The "New Testament" is full of contradictions that the heathen use to try and pull people from the faith. If you follow the many religions, like the RCC for example, you might think you have to earn your way to heaven. And it is very easy to prooftext that position. As long as you stick to the "four gospels", and avoid Paul. As an example, in Acts 5 you see two people that sinned their way out of salvation, and are in prison today. They were not in the Body of Christ, dead to sin and the law. They were part of the kingdom on earth. Or were to be.

 

[surrender]

Because people's eternal lives are at stake.

No, Nick, people's lives are not at stake if they don't know who was first in the body of Christ. Sounds like you may not have a grasp on the gospel after all.

What a stupid question.

At least you got the spelling right this time. Good for you.

The "New Testament" is full of contradictions that the heathen use to try and pull people from the faith. If you follow the many religions, like the RCC for example, you might think you have to earn your way to heaven. And it is very easy to prooftext that position. As long as you stick to the "four gospels", and avoid Paul. As an example, in Acts 5 you see two people that sinned their way out of salvation, and are in prison today. They were not in the Body of Christ, dead to sin and the law. They were part of the kingdom on earth. Or were to be.

First of all, you are not God so you don't know where those two people are today. Second of all, what you've described here (your "concern" that people will think they can work their way to heaven) is completely unrelated to the topic. There is no big significance to determining who was first in the body of Christ. That information is peripheral, not salvific and can't be determined with certainty anyway.

 

[Nang]

Hi to all , and it unblieveable TO ME that most do not know WHO was the FIRST / PROTOS in the Body of Christ !!

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS saved by Grace !! Acts 9:6

Who was the FIRST / PROTOS , who was BAPTIZO / PLACED into the Body of Christ , 1 Cor 12:13

1 Tim 1:15 and 16 , SAYS that FIRST / PROTOS was , SAUL/PAUL !!

Faithful (is) the word and worthy of all reception that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners , of WHOM I AM FIRST /PROTOS .

Paul is NOT SAYING that Jesus is only saving people that are the worst of sinners , BUT that Saul/Paul was a PATTERN of the Ones coming to believe on Him unto everlasting life .

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS saved by Grace !! Acts 9:6

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS , BAPTIZO / PLACED into the Body of Christ , 1 Cor 12:13 !!

SAUL / PAUL was the FIRST / PROTOS to reveal the Dispensation of the MYSTERY , Rom 16:25 , Eph 3:1-10 and Col 1:25 .

SAUL / PAUL was PROTOS , PROTOS , and always PROTOS !!

DAN P

The first souls chosen to be the spiritual body of Christ, were also the first souls who received the promises of God's grace and believed God.

The first souls in the body of Christ, were those of the physical lineage that produced the Christ: Eve - Seth - Noah - Abraham - Moses - David . . . etc.

Nang

 

[OMEGA]

Nick M.

It does not matter who was the first in the Body of Christ.

The 12 Disciples argued who would be Greatest in the Kingdom.

The 12 Apostles were the First in the Body because they were

the first to receive the Comforter.

But Jesus said that Many are Called and few Chosen

and we know that many first called Christians turned back

because of the Galatians.

Gal_3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth,

before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

 

[DAN P]

Nick M.

It does not matter who was the first in the Body of Christ.

The 12 Disciples argued who would be Greatest in the Kingdom.

The 12 Apostles were the First in the Body because they were

the first to receive the Comforter.

But Jesus said that Many are Called and few Chosen

and we know that many first called Christians turned back

because of the Galatians.

Gal_3:1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth,

before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?

Hi , and though you DO NOT believe that who was FIRST / PROTOS does not Matter , that is an Acts 2 and Covenant theology LINE .

It is scriptual , so it MATTERS , 1 Tim 1:15-16 !!

The COMFORTER was promised to Israel by Jesus and your agruement is MOOT and without Merit !!

dan p

 

[surrender]

Hi , and though you DO NOT believe that who was FIRST / PROTOS does not Matter , that is an Acts 2 and Covenant theology LINE .

It is scriptual , so it MATTERS , 1 Tim 1:15-16 !!

The COMFORTER was promised to Israel by Jesus and your agruement is MOOT and without Merit !!

dan p

You base your entire doctrine on that one debatable verse? As pointed out in post #2, Paul is not saying he was the first sinner to be saved when he wrote, “Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief” (1 Tim. 1:15). He is saying he is the worst sinner, and we know he is saying that he is the worst sinner because he just finished writing that Jesus put him into service even though he was “formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor” (1 Tim. 1:12-13).

 

[DAN P]

You base your entire doctrine on that one debatable verse? As QUOTE]


Hi , and I will give you more in a new OP !!

 

[surrender]

You base your entire doctrine on that one debatable verse? As QUOTE]


Hi , and I will give you more in a new OP !!

You can respond to me here. I'm not sure you should keep opening so many crossover threads.

 

[Nick M]

No, Nick, people's lives are not at stake if they don't know who was first in the body of Christ.

If you follow the many religions, like the RCC for example, you might think you have to earn your way to heaven. And it is very easy to prooftext that position. As long as you stick to the "four gospels", and avoid Paul. As an example, in Acts 5 you see two people that sinned their way out of salvation, and are in prison today. They were not in the Body of Christ, dead to sin and the law. They were part of the kingdom on earth. Or were to be.

Some people do not recognize Paul's authority.

First of all, you are not God so you don't know where those two people are today.

Didn't you just do the same in telling me I could be wrong? Yep.

Second of all, what you've described here (your "concern" that people will think they can work their way to heaven) is completely unrelated to the topic.

No, it is exacly the topic. Perverts like you want to twist the gospel. There is no other motive that can be shown to discredit Paul's gospel.

 

[surrender]

Some people do not recognize Paul's authority.

I don’t know what you mean. All Christians believe that Paul speaks on behalf of God.

Didn't you just do the same in telling me I could be wrong? Yep.

No, you and I did not do anything similar. Saying you could be wrong (which I did) is not the same thing as saying someone is not saved (which you did).

No, it is exacly the topic.

You’re wrong, Nick. Knowing who was first in the body of Christ is NOT salvific.

Perverts like you

When you bully and call names the way you continuously revert to when met with others whose views differ from yours, you reveal that you lack sophistication, maturity and ultimately you discredit yourself.

want to twist the gospel. There is no other motive that can be shown to discredit Paul's gospel.

The core of Paul’s good news is that God sent His son, Jesus, to save sinners through his life, ministry, death and resurrection and become King of Israel and Lord of the Gentiles. If you reject that, Nick, you reject Paul’s gospel.

 

[DAN P]

You can respond to me here. I'm not sure you should keep opening so many crossover threads.

Hi , and this a Dispensational sub-forum , so start your owm OP and stop complaining and WHINNING about me !!

That is IF you have something to write about , huh , do it ??

You have not not can refute what I have written , so when will you try ??

dan p

 

[surrender]

Hi , and this a Dispensational sub-forum , so start your owm OP and stop complaining and WHINNING about me !!

Stop asking me to open new threads just because you can’t refute my posts to you.

That is IF you have something to write about , huh , do it ??

I have in post #2 and #8.

I’ll write it again, since you keep “missing” it.

You base your entire doctrine on that one debatable verse. As pointed out in post #2, Paul is not saying he was the first sinner to be saved when he wrote, “Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief” (1 Tim. 1:15). He is saying he is the worst sinner, and we know he is saying that he is the worst sinner because he just finished writing that Jesus put him into service even though he was “formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor” (1 Tim. 1:12-13).

 

[DAN P]

Stop asking me to open new threads just because you can’t refute my posts to you.

I have in post #2 and #8.

I’ll write it again, since you keep “missing” it.

You base your entire doctrine on that one debatable verse. As pointed out in post #2, Paul is not saying he was the first sinner to be saved when he wrote, “Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief” (1 Tim. 1:15). He is saying he is the worst sinner, and we know he is saying that he is the worst sinner because he just finished writing that Jesus put him into service even though he was “formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor” (1 Tim. 1:12-13).

Hi , and just where does Paul say in 1 Tim 1:15 , that he is the WORST of sinners !!

It does say " of whom I am FIRST/PROTOS , and FIRST /PROTOS is also used in verse 16 !!

In Phil 3:6 , the Holy Spirit calls Paul , BLAMELESS !!

It contradicts what you wrote ??

Explain it to me , if you can !!

You can do it ??

dan p

 

[surrender]

Hi , and just where does Paul say in 1 Tim 1:15 , that he is the WORST of sinners !!

1 Timonth 1:15:

Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners--of whom I am the worst. (NIV)

Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: (ASV)

It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all. (NAS)

This saying is reliable and deserves full acceptance: "Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners"—and I'm the biggest sinner of all. (CEB)

The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost. (ESV)

This is a true saying, and everyone should believe it: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners -- and I was the worst of them all. (NLT)

It does say " of whom I am FIRST/PROTOS , and FIRST /PROTOS is also used in verse 16 !!

Right. The word can mean foremost, leading or first.

In Phil 3:6 , the Holy Spirit calls Paul , BLAMELESS !!

It contradicts what you wrote ??

Explain it to me , if you can !!

You can do it ??

Paul is a saved sinner.

 

[DAN P]

1 Timonth 1:15:

Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners--of whom I am the worst. (NIV)

Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: (ASV)

It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all. (NAS)

This saying is reliable and deserves full acceptance: "Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners"—and I'm the biggest sinner of all. (CEB)

The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost. (ESV)

This is a true saying, and everyone should believe it: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners -- and I was the worst of them all. (NLT)

Right. The word can mean foremost, leading or first.

Paul is a saved sinner.

Hi , and like a novice , you believe that Translations are Inspired , STRIKE #1.

#2 , When I did some research , it is found in the OT .

#3 ,I , found it in Ezek 7:24 , a Hebrew fem/man noun , RA , so check H 7451 .

#4 ; A literal translation , is the Greek word PROTOS , which means FIRST !!

#5 , I do not believe in KJV ONLY , but it is better than what you used in your post and RA is not used in 1 Tim 1:15 OR in verse 16 !!

dan p

 

[surrender]

Hi , and like a novice , you believe that Translations are Inspired , STRIKE #1.

And I suppose your personal translation is inspired?

Paul is not saying he was the first sinner ever to be saved when he wrote, “Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief” (1 Tim. 1:15). He is saying he is the worst sinner or the foremost sinner, and we know he is saying that he is the worst or foremost sinner because he just finished writing that Jesus put him into service even though he was “formerly a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent aggressor” (1 Tim. 1:12-13).

 

[DAN P]

And I suppose your personal translation is inspired?

QUOTE]

Hi , and anyone can google the internet and see that the Greek in 1 Tim 1:15-16 , the word used is PROTOS , get with the memo !!


ALL can see that in verse 16 , PROTOS is translated FIRST , so why did the translators not use WORST ??

dan p

 

[surrender]

Hi , and anyone can google the internet and see that the Greek in 1 Tim 1:15-16 , the word used is PROTOS , get with the memo !!


ALL can see that in verse 16 , PROTOS is translated FIRST , so why did the translators not use WORST ??

dan p

The same word is used here:

15 It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all. 16 Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost, Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life.