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  • Just so you are made aware: I do not entertain "synergism" in any form, and have received much flack for arguing that even the work of sanctification is monergistic. I have come to hate the word "co-operation." AMR and I in particular have had an ongoing disagreement on the subject, so I do not expect or demand that you will agree with me either. :)

    It is my belief that any and all fruits of regeneration result from the indwelling of the Holy Sprit (Galatians 5:22-23) including all aspects of holy living, and gaining the privilege of prayer. It is His abiding in us, that guarantees our being in Christ to partake of the divine nature and His priestly intercessions that provide us access to the throne of grace. Without The Spirit of Christ we can do nothing. John 15:5
    I agree all "necessity" abides in God and that He works and functions for His good pleasure and purposes. However, the Incarnation and the redemption of creaturely sons of God were foundational to that good pleasure and purposes, and creation was the means by which that Everlasting Covenant was made known to His elect. Creation mirrors God. Romans 1:19-20

    Creation was not necessary (God could have achieved the same in other ways), but it manifests His great love and grace amongst men, which brings Him glory!
    I am trying to express a distinction between temporal chronological order, and necessary manifestation of divine moral/ logical order.

    Truly, the Mind of God is moral, rational, orderly, and logical . . and the sons of God were made in His image, right?

    The inverse outworkings of creation, developed within the confines of mechanical chronological time for the benefit of many generations, is ultimately meant to revea, in timely manner, the supremely moral, logical, and sovereign purpose (Gospel) of God to ALL generations of His Elect. (e.g. I Peter 3:9;15)
    Your words:

    " there is no "prior to the beginning" for God; just as there is no "after the beginning" for God. He interacts with time-constrained creation in a timeless manner. What is sequentiality for us is a simultaneity for God. There is no linear ordering, even in the inverse. There is no sense of quantitification to any of creation. For God it is all qualitative."


    I speak of "beginning" only in regard to creation as God's means of revelation . . .

    All of creation (including ~time~) was deemed NECESSARY to reveal this timeless Truth to the created sons of God; made subject to time, but chosen to co-inherit the timeless Kingdom of God with Jesus Christ.
    My Supra view, is that all of creation (time) manifests nothing less than the eternal purpose (mind) of God; which proves to be nothing other than holy, rational, orderly, and logical.

    The execution of the will of God, as revealed in creation, proves to be historically inverse to the logical decrees/ordinations of God prior to the "beginning."

    Thus, the decree to create is last in logical order being the first to reveal to man, the ultimate purpose and will of God: that the spiritual sons of God are made fit to partake of all the Divine benefits of His accomplished works on the cross, to the praise of His glory.

    Dr. Robert Reymond spells this out with great and much more clarity in his "A New Systematic Theology of the Christian Faith" pages 494-496 if you have his volume on hand. . . his explanation which I fully endorse.
    The timelessness of God and the eternal essence of His purposes, somehow must correspond to and be explained by the "beginning" of the manifestation of both, as revealed via creation, to His creatures. Hopefully, you will share further . . .
    You posted:

    "There is no "before" or "after" for God in any functional sense that those in creation can assign to him. He is both "nowhere" and "nowhen" while also being "everywhere" and "everywhen"."

    Agreed! And this is exactly why I label myself as a Supra . . . for the alternate view of the Infra, drags time and historical events into the eternal decrees (revealed purposes) of God.

    God did not decree/ordain to save many sinners ~after~ the fall. God decreed/ordained to save sinners knowing they would fall . . . before He created them.

    Love the pic of you and your sweet kitty!
    A Christian interested in their orthodoxy, has to walk a minefield of heresies, and watch every step to avoid error and/or destruction of witness. Even when reading our great fathers of the faith; e.g. Augustine, we look only to follow the safe path they found through it all, while we remain alert to not repeat any of their missteps. (Psalm 23) It is a daunting mission, especially when studying the Trinity and Christology, but of course careful faithfulness comes with great reward and brings glory to God.
    I have taken great pleasure in seeing an alignment with Reformed teaching in your recent posts and I am not surprised, because when souls are truly given a hunger and thirst for Truth, they all eventually exhibit saving faith in the covenant purpose & promises (mind) of God Almighty. I Corinthians 2:9-16
    My infraction ban expired the 5th. Actually I am shocked at how fast a year can go by. Things look different around here . . . thanks for the welcome! I appreciate seeing you posting.
    I'm doing better. Passed out at work a few weeks ago and they never did figure out why. They are chalking it up to dehydration. I hope that's what it was. :eek:
    Then using the extraneous thread to goad me doubles my disappointment. I was clear that the dedicated thread was a long time work in progress. The pace may not be to your liking, but why adopt these tactics? When folks, less informed that perhaps you or I, are making an effort to bring forth the diety of Christ to pagan JWs, Arians, etc., why inject into the discussion matters beyond the scope and maturity of the participants? If I or others take this bait, then the intended discussion quickly gets sidelined and ends up with the intended targets proudly claiming, "see, even these trinitarians do not know what they are talking about." This is odious to me for we should never become stumbling blocks to others. Your post directed to me in the thread only adds to my longanimity from our past discussions for I had hoped we had moved past this.
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