I Support Capital Punishment
- Thread starter Freak
- Start date
BillyBob said:
I never said that you said that we shouldn't question the government. I understand your point and agree with it. But, to those who depend on a literal interpretation of scripture (not you BillyBob), I want to know how they square Romans13 with the reality of the current capital punishment laws (or abortion laws).
As far as I can tell, the subject as started by Freak is whether capital punishment as sanctioned by the government is biblically defensible. If you read Romans13 literally, there doesn't seem to be any wiggle room. Whatever the government decides to do is OK with God.
Caille said:
I don't rely on scripture to defend the obvious, but I appreciate you guys stepping in if it will help Freak see things the right way.
To me, Capital Punishment and punishment of criminals in general has nothing to do with the Bible, it has to do with maintaining a safe, orderly society.
I'd like to see what a hollow point will do to a head at close range.
[I'm guessing there won't be much head left....]
Besides, 50 cents is a lot cheaper than keeping him alive for 20 years at $80 a day, why not spring for the best. Tell you what, I'll buy the ammo!!! :banana:
[I'm guessing there won't be much head left....]
Besides, 50 cents is a lot cheaper than keeping him alive for 20 years at $80 a day, why not spring for the best. Tell you what, I'll buy the ammo!!! :banana:
one4christ
New member
Per my earlier post:
I Support Capital Punishment
here...
Bible Concerning: Witchcraft & Death
and here...
Christians discussing criminal justice
To see if I could get an idea of what some positions held by others who have posted on Capital Punishment. After many hours of searching and reading through the posts, I discovered that there wasn't really a clearly defined reasoning from the scriptures (from point A to Z) for the various postions held (unless I completely missed it). So here are the 4 different possiblities that I deduced based upon what I read in the posts.
So, I am leaning toword #3 from what scriptures I have read, and fleshing it out a bit more -
Any law that is instituted by the governing authorities, where that law does not directly violate the standards of God's word, should be followed as an adherence to God's word.
If this is true, then the following could all be true if our government instituted these as laws:
Murderers could be put to death, Teenagers who hit their parents, Child abductors (even the astranged parent), a child who curses their parent (curses as in condemns, as in damnation I believe), a woman who gets an abortion could all be put to death The operative word here is COULD be, doesn't 'have' to be. I would assume that rape would be included in the list but I haven't found any scriptural reference to that yet.
By what some would call 'modern sensibilities', this all seems extreme. I haven't developed a complete position on this based on the scriptures yet. Since I am not that familiar with old testament laws and requirements, I will have to continue to look into this further.
If anyone has any other thoughts on 1) other possible alternate positions than those listed above, 2) why they hold a certain postion, or 3) where I can find further info on this topic either on the web or elsewhere.
... or, perhaps if someone holds one of the above views, they could post their (complete) reasoning from the scripture here, since it seemed that previous posts were a smattering of bits and pieces of these different perspectives.
So, I looked here...one4christ said:
I Support Capital Punishment
here...
Bible Concerning: Witchcraft & Death
and here...
Christians discussing criminal justice
To see if I could get an idea of what some positions held by others who have posted on Capital Punishment. After many hours of searching and reading through the posts, I discovered that there wasn't really a clearly defined reasoning from the scriptures (from point A to Z) for the various postions held (unless I completely missed it). So here are the 4 different possiblities that I deduced based upon what I read in the posts.
1. The death penalty for ALL OT crimes that were punishable by death should still be enforced, and the NT covenant did not abolish the OT Mosaic law in regard to these.
2. The specific OT Mosaic laws in regard to the death penalty were no longer applicable WHERE they applied specifically to the levitical (priesthood) laws. Other OT laws requiring the death penalty should still in effect.
3. The NT did away with all OT laws and requirements, but we are still under the civil and governing authorities, including the death penalty as defined in the OT if it is in effect.
4. The NT did away with the death penalty altogether, and some form other form of punishment could be applied, but not death. This would mean that governing authorities that institute the death penalty are in conflict with the bible.
2. The specific OT Mosaic laws in regard to the death penalty were no longer applicable WHERE they applied specifically to the levitical (priesthood) laws. Other OT laws requiring the death penalty should still in effect.
3. The NT did away with all OT laws and requirements, but we are still under the civil and governing authorities, including the death penalty as defined in the OT if it is in effect.
4. The NT did away with the death penalty altogether, and some form other form of punishment could be applied, but not death. This would mean that governing authorities that institute the death penalty are in conflict with the bible.
So, I am leaning toword #3 from what scriptures I have read, and fleshing it out a bit more -
Any law that is instituted by the governing authorities, where that law does not directly violate the standards of God's word, should be followed as an adherence to God's word.
If this is true, then the following could all be true if our government instituted these as laws:
drbrumley said:
Murderers could be put to death, Teenagers who hit their parents, Child abductors (even the astranged parent), a child who curses their parent (curses as in condemns, as in damnation I believe), a woman who gets an abortion could all be put to death The operative word here is COULD be, doesn't 'have' to be. I would assume that rape would be included in the list but I haven't found any scriptural reference to that yet.
By what some would call 'modern sensibilities', this all seems extreme. I haven't developed a complete position on this based on the scriptures yet. Since I am not that familiar with old testament laws and requirements, I will have to continue to look into this further.
If anyone has any other thoughts on 1) other possible alternate positions than those listed above, 2) why they hold a certain postion, or 3) where I can find further info on this topic either on the web or elsewhere.
... or, perhaps if someone holds one of the above views, they could post their (complete) reasoning from the scripture here, since it seemed that previous posts were a smattering of bits and pieces of these different perspectives.
one4christ said:
Nope. Not all of them.
The NT, actually it was the death of Christ, only did away with the law for purposes of righteousness. So it no longer applies to Christians, in that regard. But the criminal code should. And if the government is enforcing it, then a Christian should submit if they have broken it.
Nope. I can think of one off the top of my head. Observance of the Sabbath.
That one is most definitely false. We are under the legal authorities, but should advocate the laws that would make this a better place. Including the death penalty for murderers, rapists, child molesters and homosexuals.
The NT, actually it was the death of Christ, only did away with the law for purposes of righteousness. So it no longer applies to Christians, in that regard. But the criminal code should. And if the government is enforcing it, then a Christian should submit if they have broken it.
This is untrue as well.
I've already explained this is untrue.
Where does it say anything about teenagers, or hitting parents? And murderers should be put to death. And women who get abortions should be put to death.
No doubt.
There are plenty of explanations. Just look for threads on theonomy, and see what its supporters have to say.
The laws that called for the death penalty that no longer apply are the ones that related to the laws that were only for Israel. No laws concerning the Sabbath are applicable. No laws concerning the priesthood are applicable. No laws that concern lineage are applicable.
Talk to Jefferson, Bob Enyart, and Clete. They support theonomy, and can show you why, from Scripture, and logic.
one4christ
New member
Thanks Lighthouse! They can post here if they like also. In the meantime I am exploring other perspecitves on this topic and would like to hear from others too.Lighthouse said:
Until next time - may we all bring glory and honor to our Lord and Master Jesus Christ in all that we do...
Lighthouse: are you over here killing women who had abortions?
Didn't we cover this?
I think you might want to put some conditions on that.
Like "women who had unnesasary abortions should be put to death"
Lest you confuse any rational people who wandered in here.
Didn't we cover this?
I think you might want to put some conditions on that.
Like "women who had unnesasary abortions should be put to death"
Lest you confuse any rational people who wandered in here.