I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
Tam, it's not important to me, what Clete thinks. I respect your
views, that's all I have to say on the matter.
I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
I agree.
Do you think Clete doesn't?
I tell everyone that homo behavior is vile.
I tell everyone that Jesus saves folks while they are dead in sin (ie. homos, murderers, etc).
How is that confusing Church and State?
So what should the Christian do about criminals?
Three things. In order of importance (based on the number of people effected by each point)....
1. Advocate that the criminal behavior remain criminalized or be recriminalized.
2. Develop a strong social stigma against the behavior.
3. Seek individual repentance and salvation.
None of which is remotely possible in a world where I get judged WAY more harshly by nearly every Christian than any of them would ever judge the most vile of God hating homosexuals. Christians today, as a rule, have it completely backward. They put the criminal under grace and judge the believer as guilty at the first hint of someone's feeling getting hurt. It's madness!
Resting in Him,
Clete
Don't tell me Clete is still being slandered? Gays on parade don't listen to the gospel. It's absurd to claim they do. I know them well....very well. Their conscience can't convict them if they feel no shame. "Hey dude don't walk around in a g-string kissing each other in front of my kids." Say it. They feel no shame in this country because people accept them...even embrace them. Heck, they even put them on a pedestal. I'll say it again. First a person has to feel the NEED for a Saviour. The blind ACKNOWLEDGE they're blind. The lame ACKNOWLEDGE they're lame. It's why they flocked to the Lord when He walked this earth and it's why we all turned to God for salvation. First the need must be recognized. Tell them that....if they deny it, leave them be until God brings them even lower.
Don't tell me Clete is still being slandered? Gays on parade don't listen to the gospel. It's absurd to claim they do. I know them well....very well. Their conscience can't convict them if they feel no shame. "Hey dude don't walk around in a g-string kissing each other in front of my kids." Say it. They feel no shame in this country because people accept them...even embrace them. Heck, they even put them on a pedestal. I'll say it again. First a person has to feel the NEED for a Saviour. The blind ACKNOWLEDGE they're blind. The lame ACKNOWLEDGE they're lame. It's why they flocked to the Lord when He walked this earth and it's why we all turned to God for salvation. First the need must be recognized. Tell them that....if they deny it, leave them be until God brings them even lower.
This is libel.You do every time you scream what you do at a "homo". When are they supposed to hear the gospel of Christ from you, as your screaming, "Get away from me..."? You have deemed them unworthy to hear the good news that is the power of God to save ANY and ALL them that believe! In so doing (not doing), you are not doing the work of the Lord, the work of the ministry. How and when will they hear the word of truth, the gospel of their salvation if not from you, an ambassador for Christ?
No, it's right here and it's sound (2 Timothy 1:7-10 KJV). I'm not the one running around screaming at people for what they do in their flesh, you are.You're an emotional wreck.Great. When will you ever give them the good news?
When will they hear from you that Christ took their place? Where is the word of reconciliation, ambassador for Christ?
When will you use it lawfully as an ambassador for Christ and point to the ground leveling cross of Christ from the scriptures (Romans 3:21-24 KJV, Romans 4:25 KJV, Romans 6:23 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Galatians 3:22 KJV)?
Get in the game (as they say), because as it stands now, you're on the bench.
You're still talking about worldly matters and I'm speaking about
Spiritual matters. Get it? Heir is one of the most Scripturally
sound posters on TOL. Yet, you seek to do battle with her?
I agree that she does at least make an argument. A rare thing around here. But no, I don't seek to do battle with her, she's the one attacking me!
And as for worldly matters vs spiritual matters, I couldn't disagree with you more. God is the one who instituted human government and God is the one who said to execute the murderer, adulterer, rapist and homosexual (among others). The government doesn't say that, the world doesn't say that, God says that. The only question is whether one is going to get their understanding of what justice is from God or from the government or from the majority (i.e. the world) or from the fuzzy feeling they get in their stomach.
Resting in Him,
Clete
The executions, for adultery, homosexuality, murder, etc, was
written for the Israelite's. We're leaving in the "Dispensation of
Grace." However, we still need laws that protect our society from
criminal elements. We need the death penalty (my opinion) for
those who, "Lie in Wait" to murder another person. We need to
have harsh sentences for rapists, child molesters, violent
offenders, etc. What we don't need is to execute adulterers and
homosexuals. The ONLY thing that can change criminals hearts
is the hearing of the Grace Message and the placing of one's
faith in Christ as their Savior. That is the work of the Holy Spirit.
The gays and adulterers need to hear the Message of God's Grace
towards mankind, through faith in Jesus Christ. Some may reject
and some will accept truth. That's the way it is with every kind of
lost sinner.
Yes, let the police worry about criminals, Christians should preach the good news and stay away from the condemnation game.
The religious (i.e. non moral) law like circumcision laws, the dietary laws, Sabbath day laws, etc had to do with Israel exclusively but the laws concerning issues of morality like stealing, perjury, assault, murder, incest, rape, adultery, etc aren't about religion and they aren't about maintaining a particular nation's separation from the rest of the world. They are about justice. Objective, God ordained justice.The executions, for adultery, homosexuality, murder, etc, was
written for the Israelite's.
Are you seriously suggesting that God would have us vote on such matters? Nobody cares what anyone's opinion is! I mean seriously! Your opinion! That's the basis upon which you've thrown out the only system of justice found in the Scripture - your opinion?!We're living in the "Dispensation of
Grace." However, we still need laws that protect our society from
criminal elements. We need the death penalty (my opinion) for
those who, "Lie in Wait" to murder another person. We need to
have harsh sentences for rapists, child molesters, violent
offenders, etc. What we don't need is to execute adulterers and
homosexuals. The ONLY thing that can change criminals hearts
is the hearing of the Grace Message and the placing of one's
faith in Christ as their Savior. That is the work of the Holy Spirit.
Premeditated murders don't need to hear about God's grace?The gays and adulterers need to hear the Message of God's Grace
towards mankind, through faith in Jesus Christ. Some may reject
and some will accept truth. That's the way it is with every kind of
lost sinner.
And so I suppose Christians aught not be in the police business, right?Yes, let the police worry about criminals, Christians should preach the good news and stay away from the condemnation game.
Go to any church that does not recognize the unique and exclusive message of paul. You will find your proof there after hearing several sermons. I guarantee you will find yourself doubting your salvation because they will have you examining your BEHAVIOR. After they have you look closely at your behavior, they have you ask yourself if you really are saved or not. If they understood the exclusivity of pauls gospel to the church age, they would know that behavior has no bearing whatsover upon ones salvation.
re: poll
With the horrible doctrinal mixed-bag/Lordship Salvation/Baptist upbringing I had as a baby Christian, I was long unable to make sense of the N.T., and hated it. Then I had my eyes opened to the distinctive aspects of Paul's ministry. I am nowhere near comprehending all the details of God's Word and don't pretend to be, but at least trying to figure out how (or even if) all of God's Word fit together is no longer frustrating.![]()
Hold on just a doggone minute.
I think Clete is right on when he says that certain behaviors should be shamed PUBLICLY.
And it has nothing to do with their salvation.