ECT No 7 year trib.

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
Jesus made it clear that the prophecy in Daniel was not yet fulfilled.

(Matt 24:15-16) “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

Yet, you say it was already fulfilled. Which is it?


Daniel 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
 

SaulToPaul 2

Well-known member
Daniel 8 was fulfilled by Antiochus.

Surrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre


Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
 

genuineoriginal

New member
this part of Dan ch 11--

Dan 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
Dan 11:41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
Dan 11:42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.
Dan 11:43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.
Dan 11:44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.
Dan 11:45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
That was fulfilled during the time of Antiochus.




Inpossible, the desolater was not destroyed then.
What makes you think that there is a desolator to be destroyed by the end of the 70 weeks?

The 70 weeks were not decreed on "the desolator", they were decreed on Daniel's people and the Holy City.
Because of abominations during the 70 weeks, Jerusalem was decreed to become desolate again, and Daniel's prophecy stated that the desolation would last "even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."
It is the desolate city of Jerusalem that would receive what was poured out, not some "desolator."


No scripture says that.

The prophecy is of what will occur, not something anyone failed to do.
You were taught to read the prophecy wrong by dispensationalist eschatology.

The prophecy stated exactly what God demanded from His people in order to remain in the land, and He gave them 490 years (7 times 70 years) in order to comply.

Failure to comply resulted in the desolation of Jerusalem, which is exactly what Jesus prophesied.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
That was fulfilled during the time of Antiochus.

No.

Just look at the text.

Dan 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
Dan 11:41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
Dan 11:42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.
Dan 11:43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.
Dan 11:44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.
Dan 11:45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.



What makes you think that there is a desolator to be destroyed by the end of the 70 weeks?

The 70 weeks were not decreed on "the desolator", they were decreed on Daniel's people and the Holy City.

Two things.

The NASB correctly has it as the desolator, not the desolate, and this is supported by the facts that the prophecy is about the restoration of Jerusalem AFTER the desolater is destroyed as Rev. teaches.



Because of abominations during the 70 weeks, Jerusalem was decreed to become desolate again, and Daniel's prophecy stated that the desolation would last "even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."
It is the desolate city of Jerusalem that would receive what was poured out, not some "desolator."

It just means Jerusalem would be desolate until the desolator is destroyed.



You were taught to read the prophecy wrong by dispensationalist eschatology.

Maybe I could tell you that you learnt your view from the devil. Would you appreciate that?

If you want to talk like that then stay in your error.

The prophecy stated exactly what God demanded from His people in order to remain in the land, and He gave them 490 years (7 times 70 years) in order to comply.

Failure to comply resulted in the desolation of Jerusalem, which is exactly what Jesus prophesied.

That is not true, and I must say, ridiculous.

The prophecy is about what will happen, and made to happen by the LORD.

LA
 

OCTOBER23

New member
Revelation 19:10 ... the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

First the Israel / Iran War for Territory

and then the 7 year Peace Pact backed up by the United Nations and the Pope

making JERUSALEM an International City.
=============================
 

genuineoriginal

New member
No.

Just look at the text.

Dan 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
Dan 11:41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.
Dan 11:42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.
Dan 11:43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.
Dan 11:44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.
Dan 11:45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.
I looked at the text, and the explanation:
_____
40. The difficulty of reconciling this with Antiochus' history is that no historian but PORPHYRY mentions an expedition of his into Egypt towards the close of his reign. This Daniel 11:40 , therefore, may be a recapitulation summing up the facts of the first expedition to Egypt (171-170 B.C.), in Daniel 11:22Daniel 11:25 ; and Daniel 11:41 , the former invasion of Judea, in Daniel 11:28 ; Daniel 11:42Daniel 11:43 , the second and third invasions of Egypt (169 and 168 B.C). in Daniel 11:23Daniel 11:24Daniel 11:29Daniel 11:30 . AUBERLEN takes rather PORPHYRY'S statement, that Antiochus, in the eleventh year of his reign (166-165 B.C.), invaded Egypt again, and took Palestine on his way. The "tidings" ( Daniel 11:44 ) as to the revolt of tributary nations then led him to the East. PORPHYRY'S statement that Antiochus starting from Egypt took Arad in Judah, and devastated all Phoenicia, agrees with Daniel 11:45 ; then he turned to check Artaxias, king of Armenia. He died in the Persian town Tabes, 164 B.C., as both POLYBIUS and PORPHYRY agree. Doubtless, antitypically, the final Antichrist, and its predecessor Mohammed, are intended, to whom the language may be more fully applicable than to Antiochus the type. The Saracen Arabs "of the south" "pushed at" the Greek emperor Heraclius, and deprived him of Egypt and Syria. But the Turks of "the north" not merely pushed at, but destroyed the Greek empire; therefore more is said of them than of the Saracens. Their "horsemen" are specified, being their chief strength. Their standards still are horse tails. Their "ships," too, often gained the victory over Venice, the great naval power of Europe in that day. They "overflowed" Western Asia, and then "passed over" into Europe, fixing their seat of empire at Constantinople under Mohammed II [NEWTON].

41. Antiochus, according to PORPHYRY, marching against Ptolemy, though he turned from his course to wreak his wrath on the Jews, did not meddle with Edom, Moab, and Ammon on the side of Judea. In I Maccabees 4:61 5:3; &c., it is stated that he used their help in crushing the Jews, of whom they were the ancient enemies. Compare Isaiah 11:14 , as to Israel's future retribution, just as the Maccabees made war on them as the friends of Antiochus (I Maccabees 5:1-68). Antitypically, the Turks under Selim entered Jerusalem on their way to Egypt, and retain "the glorious land" of Palestine to this day. But they never could conquer the Arabs, who are akin to Edom, Moab, and Ammon ( Genesis 16:12 ). So in the case of the final Antichrist.

42, 43. Egypt . . . Libyans . . . Ethiopians--The latter two, being the allies of the first, served under Antiochus when he conquered Egypt. Antitypically, Egypt, though it held out long under the Mamelukes, in A.D. 1517 fell under the Turks. Algiers, Tunis, and other parts of Africa, are still under them.
at his steps--following him ( Exodus 11:8 , Margin;Judges 4:10 ).

44. tidings out of the east and out of the north--Artaxias, king of Armenia, his vassal, had revolted in the north, and Arsaces, leader of the Parthians, in the east (I Maccabees 3:10, &c., I Maccabees 3:37; TACITUS, Histories, 5.8). In 147 B.C. Antiochus went on the expedition against them, on the return from which he died.
great fury--at the Jews, on account of their successes under Judas Maccabeus, whence he desired to replenish his treasury with means to prosecute the war with them; also at Artaxias and Arsaces, and their respective followers. DE BURGH makes the "tidings" which rouse his fury, to be concerning the Jews' restoration; such may be the antitypical reference.

45. plant . . . between the seas--the Dead Sea and the Mediterranean.
tabernacles of . . . palace--his palace-like military tents, such as Oriental princes travel with. Antiochus' attack on Judea, and his subsequent "end" at Tabes, which was caused by chagrin both at hearing that his forces under Lysias were overcome by the Jews, and at the failure of his expedition against the temple of Elymais (II Maccabees 9:5).
holy mountain--Jerusalem and Mount Zion. The desolation of the sanctuary by Antiochus, and also the desecration of the consecrated ground round Jerusalem by the idolatrous Roman ensigns, as also by the Mohammedan mosque, and, finally, by the last Antichrist, are referred to. So the last Antichrist is to sit upon "the mount of the congregation" ( Isaiah 14:13 ), but "shall be brought down to hell" 2 Thessalonians 2:8 ).
_____​




Two things.

The NASB correctly has it as the desolator, not the desolate, and this is supported by the facts that the prophecy is about the restoration of Jerusalem AFTER the desolater is destroyed as Rev. teaches.

It just means Jerusalem would be desolate until the desolator is destroyed.
The NASB does not have it correct.

Daniel 9:27 YLT
27 And he hath strengthened a covenant with many -- one week, and [in] the midst of the week he causeth sacrifice and present to cease, and by the wing of abominations he is making desolate, even till the consummation, and that which is determined is poured on the desolate one.'​

The desolate one is Jerusalem, the Holy City mentioned at the beginning of the prophecy.


Maybe I could tell you that you learnt your view from the devil. Would you appreciate that?

If you want to talk like that then stay in your error.
There is a big difference between observing that the widespread stories that comes from Dispensational eschatology having a great impact on the ability of people to read and understand the prophecy of the seventy weeks in any manner other than the one taught by Dispensational eschatology and your claims that anything that does not fit your beliefs comes from the devil.

You should be ashamed of your infantile behaviour.



That is not true, and I must say, ridiculous.

The prophecy is about what will happen, and made to happen by the LORD.
That kind of remark is typically made by people that fail to see how the prophecy of the seventy weeks was given in answer to the prayer of Daniel that preceded it.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
I looked at the text, and the explanation:
_____
40. The difficulty of reconciling this with Antiochus' history is that no historian but PORPHYRY mentions an expedition of his into Egypt towards the close of his reign. This Daniel 11:40 , therefore, may be a recapitulation summing up the facts of the first expedition to Egypt (171-170 B.C.), in Daniel 11:22Daniel 11:25 ; and Daniel 11:41 , the former invasion of Judea, in Daniel 11:28 ; Daniel 11:42Daniel 11:43 , the second and third invasions of Egypt (169 and 168 B.C). in Daniel 11:23Daniel 11:24Daniel 11:29Daniel 11:30 . AUBERLEN takes rather PORPHYRY'S statement, that Antiochus, in the eleventh year of his reign (166-165 B.C.), invaded Egypt again, and took Palestine on his way. The "tidings" ( Daniel 11:44 ) as to the revolt of tributary nations then led him to the East. PORPHYRY'S statement that Antiochus starting from Egypt took Arad in Judah, and devastated all Phoenicia, agrees with Daniel 11:45 ; then he turned to check Artaxias, king of Armenia. He died in the Persian town Tabes, 164 B.C., as both POLYBIUS and PORPHYRY agree. Doubtless, antitypically, the final Antichrist, and its predecessor Mohammed, are intended, to whom the language may be more fully applicable than to Antiochus the type. The Saracen Arabs "of the south" "pushed at" the Greek emperor Heraclius, and deprived him of Egypt and Syria. But the Turks of "the north" not merely pushed at, but destroyed the Greek empire; therefore more is said of them than of the Saracens. Their "horsemen" are specified, being their chief strength. Their standards still are horse tails. Their "ships," too, often gained the victory over Venice, the great naval power of Europe in that day. They "overflowed" Western Asia, and then "passed over" into Europe, fixing their seat of empire at Constantinople under Mohammed II [NEWTON].

41. Antiochus, according to PORPHYRY, marching against Ptolemy, though he turned from his course to wreak his wrath on the Jews, did not meddle with Edom, Moab, and Ammon on the side of Judea. In I Maccabees 4:61 5:3; &c., it is stated that he used their help in crushing the Jews, of whom they were the ancient enemies. Compare Isaiah 11:14 , as to Israel's future retribution, just as the Maccabees made war on them as the friends of Antiochus (I Maccabees 5:1-68). Antitypically, the Turks under Selim entered Jerusalem on their way to Egypt, and retain "the glorious land" of Palestine to this day. But they never could conquer the Arabs, who are akin to Edom, Moab, and Ammon ( Genesis 16:12 ). So in the case of the final Antichrist.

42, 43. Egypt . . . Libyans . . . Ethiopians--The latter two, being the allies of the first, served under Antiochus when he conquered Egypt. Antitypically, Egypt, though it held out long under the Mamelukes, in A.D. 1517 fell under the Turks. Algiers, Tunis, and other parts of Africa, are still under them.
at his steps--following him ( Exodus 11:8 , Margin;Judges 4:10 ).

44. tidings out of the east and out of the north--Artaxias, king of Armenia, his vassal, had revolted in the north, and Arsaces, leader of the Parthians, in the east (I Maccabees 3:10, &c., I Maccabees 3:37; TACITUS, Histories, 5.8). In 147 B.C. Antiochus went on the expedition against them, on the return from which he died.
great fury--at the Jews, on account of their successes under Judas Maccabeus, whence he desired to replenish his treasury with means to prosecute the war with them; also at Artaxias and Arsaces, and their respective followers. DE BURGH makes the "tidings" which rouse his fury, to be concerning the Jews' restoration; such may be the antitypical reference.

45. plant . . . between the seas--the Dead Sea and the Mediterranean.
tabernacles of . . . palace--his palace-like military tents, such as Oriental princes travel with. Antiochus' attack on Judea, and his subsequent "end" at Tabes, which was caused by chagrin both at hearing that his forces under Lysias were overcome by the Jews, and at the failure of his expedition against the temple of Elymais (II Maccabees 9:5).
holy mountain--Jerusalem and Mount Zion. The desolation of the sanctuary by Antiochus, and also the desecration of the consecrated ground round Jerusalem by the idolatrous Roman ensigns, as also by the Mohammedan mosque, and, finally, by the last Antichrist, are referred to. So the last Antichrist is to sit upon "the mount of the congregation" ( Isaiah 14:13 ), but "shall be brought down to hell" 2 Thessalonians 2:8 ).
_____​





The NASB does not have it correct.

Daniel 9:27 YLT
27 And he hath strengthened a covenant with many -- one week, and [in] the midst of the week he causeth sacrifice and present to cease, and by the wing of abominations he is making desolate, even till the consummation, and that which is determined is poured on the desolate one.'​

The desolate one is Jerusalem, the Holy City mentioned at the beginning of the prophecy.


There is a big difference between observing that the widespread stories that comes from Dispensational eschatology having a great impact on the ability of people to read and understand the prophecy of the seventy weeks in any manner other than the one taught by Dispensational eschatology and your claims that anything that does not fit your beliefs comes from the devil.

You should be ashamed of your infantile behaviour.

Man you show your true colors.

So you can claim I learnt from dispys and when I suggest you would not like it if I said you learnt from the devil then you come up with that trash.





That kind of remark is typically made by people that fail to see how the prophecy of the seventy weeks was given in answer to the prayer of Daniel that preceded it.

Well I am not typical and I have no longer any respect for you.

You talk like the dispies and madists and use the same techniques

Have a happy prayer life.

LA
 

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
Man you show your true colors.

So you can claim I learnt from dispys and when I suggest you would not like it if I said you learnt from the devil then you come up with that trash.

you get so much right, and then . . . :patrol:






Well I am not typical and I have no longer any respect for you.

You talk like the dispies and madists and use the same techniques

Have a happy prayer life.

LA
 
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