No Longer A Christian

[Granite]

Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Originally posted by wickwoman

I see Sozo's towing the "party line."

You will notice, Granite, that Christians will deny you ever were a Christian. It's difficult for them to admit that any person would turn away from christianity having had an authentic Christian experience.

I hope this doesn't mean you will turn away from God, or from seeking spiritual truth. You should think of this as more of a beginning than an end.

Ex-Christians pose a problem: either they WERE "saved" somehow and left the faith, or, they were never saved to begin with. Which means anybody at any time can take a walk.

Then it becomes a "what if it happens to me?" situation. Which means nobody in the church will ever be absolutely sure.

 

[Granite]

Originally posted by Sozo

It can? That's news to me.

Has there been a time in your life, after you knew that 2+2=4, that you doubted it?

Unfortunately mathemathics isn't based on fear of eternal torture, subjective experiences, a contorted collection of scriptures, questionable history, or littered with a track record of genocide and abuse. So the analogy (like most) doesn't hold up.

Math CAN be proved. Christianity cannot.

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by granite1010

Hey Zakath. Thanks.

You're welcome.

In a way Christianity kind of takes the mystery out of things, doesn't it.

Certainly, some of the more dogmatic forms do, but I know some devout Christians who are also fine scientists. They seem to reconcile things pretty well.

When you have everything explained, where's the curiosity or the inquisition left in life?

Well I think the Christian church has already shown us plenty about their version of Inquisition over the centuries... :help:

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by granite1010
...Math CAN be proved. Christianity cannot.

That's one reason why math is considered a science and Christianity is a religion.

One can be demonstrated or proven, the other requires faith in the unpredictable, undemonstrable, and unprovable.

 

[Nineveh]

granite1010,
In the end it matters where you stand with Christ, not "Christianity".

 

[wickwoman]

Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Originally posted by Zakath

(Psst! That's "toeing", as in standing with your toe on a line...)

Really! I always thought it was like pulling a very long rope with something heavy at the end, like all that dead weight of Christians who are resting in their "eternal security."

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by granite1010

Unfortunately mathemathics isn't based on fear of eternal torture, subjective experiences, a contorted collection of scriptures, questionable history, or littered with a track record of genocide and abuse. So the analogy (like most) doesn't hold up.

Math CAN be proved. Christianity cannot.

Christianity is based on a relationship with Jesus.

You have just proved that you never knew Jesus.

If you did, than it would be more real to you than math.

 

[wickwoman]

Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Originally posted by granite1010
Then it becomes a "what if it happens to me?" situation. Which means nobody in the church will ever be absolutely sure.

Welcome to the human race! None of us are sure. Some Christians just like to pretend they are.

 

[Zakath]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: No Longer A Christian

Originally posted by wickwoman

Really! I always thought it was like pulling a very long rope with something heavy at the end, like all that dead weight of Christians who are resting in their "eternal security."

:chuckle:

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Sozo

Christianity is based on a relationship with Jesus.

You have just proved that you never knew Jesus.

If you did, than it would be more real to you than math.

Sozo,

Do you claim to "know Jesus"?

 

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by Sozo

Christianity is based on a relationship with Jesus.

You have just proved that you never knew Jesus.

If you did, than it would be more real to you than math.

Jesus is dead. One cannot have relations with dead people. It's against the law. As for Christ, the root of the word Christian, a relationship with Christ is key. However, some Christians don't demonstrate it very well.

 

[Zakath]

Wickwoman,

"One cannot have relations with dead people. It's against the law..." :chuckle:

You're cracking me up here! :thumb:

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by Zakath

Sozo,

Do you claim to "know Jesus"?

Yes, would you like to know Him?

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Sozo

Yes...

Since you know him, you do not believe in him; any more than you believe that your wife exists...

Correct?

 

[Nineveh]

Originally posted by wickwoman

Jesus is dead.

Was. He is risen! He is that One God who just won't agree with you no matter what you say, do, or believe. Maybe someday you will consider that One God who opposes you at every turn.

 

[Nineveh]

"...blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." - Jesus

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Nineveh

Was. He is risen!

Oh really? What evidence do you have to back up this claim of violation of "natural law" in which dead bodies are reanimated?

 

[Nineveh]

Originally posted by Zakath

Oh really? What evidence do you have to back up this claim of violation of "natural law" in which dead bodies are reanimated?

Eyewitness accounts

Pretty fundamental stuff an "ex pastor" should know, there Z.

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Nineveh

"...blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." - Jesus

:chuckle:

P. T. Barnum made quite a bit of money off of that very principle... :think:

 

[Sozo]

Originally posted by Zakath

Since you know him, you do not believe in him; any more than you believe that your wife exists...

Correct?

I believe in Him, because I know Him.

It is not a question of believing in His existence, but rather believing Him to be the way, the truth, and the life.

You have placed your belief in another way, another truth, and another life.

You have faith, it's just misplaced.