No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

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beloved57

Well-known member
Jn 6:44

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

The word “can” is a word of ability not merely will not accept. Why doesn’t man have the ability to come to Christ? Simply because they are dead in sins. Colossians 2:13

And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

The word dead nekros :


  1. metaph.
    1. spiritually dead
      1. destitute of a life that recognises and is devoted to God, because given up to trespasses and sins
      2. inactive as respects doing right
    2. destitute of force or power, inactive, inoperative

A spiritually dead person can only be one thing and that is dead until a resurrection occurs.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Wonder if The Father doesnt draw a person to believe in Christ ? Does that person have the ability to believe in Christ with their own freewill ?
 

beloved57

Well-known member
What we as natural men dont comprehend is that by nature we are dead to God, in such a condition we are without any hope in and of ourselves, like these gentiles Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

This means nothing can possibly done by man to change his plight, he can not do anything spiritually good towards salvation. Without spiritual life its a dead end. By nature we cant even think a spiritual thought 2 Cor 3:5

Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

Jesus even told His disciples in regards to spiritual matters Jn 15:5

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

So what about a person dead in sin ? How can they come to Christ, a spiritual act, by their own freewill in the flesh ?
 

beloved57

Well-known member
A person comes to Christ only because the Father causes him to come to Christ,

Thats what in essence Jn 6:44 is saying, Similar to Psalm 65:4

4 Blessed is the man whom thou choosest, and causest to approach unto thee, that he may dwell in thy courts: we shall be satisfied with the goodness of thy house, even of thy holy temple.

Its a Covenant Blessing Ezk 36:27

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

The drawing of the Father in Jn 6:44 is His causing His Chosen People to believe in Christ !
 

marke

Well-known member
A person comes to Christ only because the Father causes him to come to Christ,

Thats what in essence Jn 6:44 is saying, Similar to Psalm 65:4

4 Blessed is the man whom thou choosest, and causest to approach unto thee, that he may dwell in thy courts: we shall be satisfied with the goodness of thy house, even of thy holy temple.

Its a Covenant Blessing Ezk 36:27

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

The drawing of the Father in Jn 6:44 is His causing His Chosen People to believe in Christ !
The Calvinist view of God and sin is wrong and evil. Calvinists claim God created humans to die in hell for their sins after creating them as hopeless sinners incapable of repenting from sin. By burning them alive in hell God is somehow bringing glory to Himself for sparing those few He decides to spare so they will praise Him forever for his unfair selection of them for undeserved 'forgiveness.'
 

beloved57

Well-known member
The Calvinist view of God and sin is wrong and evil. Calvinists claim God created humans to die in hell for their sins after creating them as hopeless sinners incapable of repenting from sin. By burning them alive in hell God is somehow bringing glory to Himself for sparing those few He decides to spare so they will praise Him forever for his unfair selection of them for undeserved 'forgiveness.'
Did you know its God which causes a person to believe on Christ ?
 

marke

Well-known member
Did you know its God which causes a person to believe on Christ ?
That's what poor students of the Bible claim. God invented humans. God invented sin. God caused humans to be born in sin without recourse. God hates humans for sinning but refuses to make any provision for humans to stop sinning. God will burn sinners He made to sin in hell forever in great wrath for sinning. And God does make some sinners turn to God to escape condemnation but not for anything they thought, said, or did, but because He simply decided to spare them from the rest so they could glorify Him forever for sparing them from the rest.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
That's what poor students of the Bible claim. God invented humans. God invented sin. God caused humans to be born in sin without recourse. God hates humans for sinning but refuses to make any provision for humans to stop sinning. God will burn sinners He made to sin in hell forever in great wrath for sinning. And God does make some sinners turn to God to escape condemnation but not for anything they thought, said, or did, but because He simply decided to spare them from the rest so they could glorify Him forever for sparing them from the rest.
Thats what Jn 6:44 states ! God must cause a person to believe in Christ.
 

Nanja

Well-known member
Banned
Temp Banned
What we as natural men dont comprehend is that by nature we are dead to God, in such a condition we are without any hope in and of ourselves, like these gentiles Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

This means nothing can possibly done by man to change his plight, he can not do anything spiritually good towards salvation. Without spiritual life its a dead end. By nature we cant even think a spiritual thought 2 Cor 3:5

Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

Jesus even told His disciples in regards to spiritual matters Jn 15:5

I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

So what about a person dead in sin ? How can they come to Christ, a spiritual act, by their own freewill in the flesh ?
Not a chance !
 

marke

Well-known member
Thats what Jn 6:44 states ! God must cause a person to believe in Christ.
Calvinists wrongly believe that God hates humans for their sins but has no desire to help any but a few turn from sin so He can burn the majority in hell forever to get some sort of thrill and self-glory from those He decides to spare for no given reason.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Man cannot by His own freewill come to Jesus Christ or believe on Him for Salvation. Its all of God to cause the man or women to believe in Christ Jn 6:44. God must draw the person, or cause the person to believe in Christ, for its written Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Thats part of the drawing, to be given to believe on Him. Its given not on behalf of mans freewill, but on behalf of Christ. Also in the drawing, the causing to believe in Christ certain spiritual blessings are given #1 Spiritual eyes will be open to see Christ spiritually Jn 6:40

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

#2 Will be given spiritual ears to hear His voice. Men naturally are spiritually dead and deaf and cannot hear with understanding Jn 8:43

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

In believing in Christ via the Gospel it requires some spiritual understanding Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Naturally man doesnt have this understanding Rom 3:11

There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

And this word understandeth is the same greek word for understand in Mat 13:23. Now in drawing to Christ its given to see Him Spiritually and hear Him spiritually with spiritual understanding.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Jn 6:44 is describing the effectual call or the irresistible grace in what religionist call calvinism, or tulip;

When God calls/draws chosen sinners, he gives them hearing ears, seeing eyes, believing hearts, and understanding minds.

These things are Gifts of God, for as Moses wrote Deut 29:4

Yet the Lord hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.

That word given can also me to cause like in Deut 28:7

The LORD shall cause thine enemies that rise up against thee to be smitten before thy face: they shall come out against thee one way, and flee before thee seven ways.

So when God draws us by His power He causes us hear, see, perceive Spiritually, they are His Gifts and not natural to man !
 

marke

Well-known member
Man cannot by His own freewill come to Jesus Christ or believe on Him for Salvation. Its all of God to cause the man or women to believe in Christ Jn 6:44. God must draw the person, or cause the person to believe in Christ, for its written Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Thats part of the drawing, to be given to believe on Him. Its given not on behalf of mans freewill, but on behalf of Christ. Also in the drawing, the causing to believe in Christ certain spiritual blessings are given #1 Spiritual eyes will be open to see Christ spiritually Jn 6:40

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

#2 Will be given spiritual ears to hear His voice. Men naturally are spiritually dead and deaf and cannot hear with understanding Jn 8:43

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

In believing in Christ via the Gospel it requires some spiritual understanding Matt 13:23

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Naturally man doesnt have this understanding Rom 3:11

There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

And this word understandeth is the same greek word for understand in Mat 13:23. Now in drawing to Christ its given to see Him Spiritually and hear Him spiritually with spiritual understanding.
Calvinists believe that humanity is immaterial to God who loves only Himself and desires to save some of His helpless creatures only to have them praise Him forever for showing them special mercy He refuses to show others.
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Calvinists believe that humanity is immaterial to God who loves only Himself and desires to save some of His helpless creatures only to have them praise Him forever for showing them special mercy He refuses to show others.
You still dont understand do you ?
 

marke

Well-known member
You still dont understand do you ?
Does God love sinners? All sinners? Some sinners? Only sinners He has decided for whatever reason to save? If He only loves saved sinners then why does HE love them and hate others? Was it something evil the lost did more than the saved to earn God's hatred?
 

beloved57

Well-known member
Does God love sinners? All sinners? Some sinners? Only sinners He has decided for whatever reason to save? If He only loves saved sinners then why does HE love them and hate others? Was it something evil the lost did more than the saved to earn God's hatred?
You still dont understand !
 

beloved57

Well-known member
I cannot understand what you refuse to say. Tell me plainly why you think God hates sinners.
The only way a man can come to Christ is if God Almighty causes it friend Jn 6:44 Man can do it by his so called on freewill, because hes dead !
 
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