pverty doesn't cause people to want to be terrorists... but

[Town Heretic]

Thanks for calling the poor Idiots.

No, I didn't say that, but thanks for bypassing our agreement to misread that little tidbit.

Now read it again and this time try to get it right. You noted a lot of different things go into someone falling from public grace and I agreed.

I am outa here
but 1st i say this:

told ya about those lefties...

Still not a lefty.

they don't love the poor, or Blacks or anyone, but they sure want u to THINK they do... yes siree....

You suffer from a poverty of spirit...and reading comprehension.

 

[republicanchick]

No, I didn't say that, but thanks for bypassing our agreement to misread that little tidbit.

Now read it again and this time try to get it right. You noted a lot of different things go into someone falling from public grace and I agreed.


Still not a lefty.


You suffer from a poverty of spirit...and reading comprehension.

lots of words used to obscure what you clearly said, namely that the poor are idiots

 

[Town Heretic]

lots of words used to obscure what you clearly said, namely that the poor are idiots

No, that's not what I said. That's what you want me to have said to sustain that idiotic mantra of yours about me, the one that begins with the ignorant assumption that because I'm to your left I'm a leftist.

Here it is again. Try to concentrate.

...the thing is, you have to (as a poor person who can't seem to get ahead) blame the people who are responsible. Soemtimes it is the poor person's fault he is poor. Soemtimes it is his family's fault (for not helping him when he is young.. .e tc). Soemtimes it is society's fault (Sorry to sound so unRepublican but it's true).

That actually sounds reasonable.

Usually, however, it is ALL of the ABove...

You're saying it takes a village to make an idiot? Okay, okay, yes. I think that's a responsible, reasonable way of seeing it.

Note the bold is me agreeing with you. So either you're saying that you believe the poor are idiots or you need to rethink your bias here.

 

[republicanchick]

No, that's not what I said. That's what you want me to have said to sustain that idiotic mantra of yours about me, the one that begins with the ignorant assumption that because I'm to your left I'm a leftist.

Here it is again. Try to concentrate.


Note the bold is me agreeing with you. So either you're saying that you believe the poor are idiots or you need to rethink your bias here.

again, more words used to obscure your Freudian "gaffe"

but all those words do nothing to exonerate you.

I said all those factors contribute to "making" someone poor and you said (paraphrase) Yeh, all those factors are needed to make an idiot

soo... might as well admit your prejudice against the poor. But you know, i know a poor person who has a very high IQ, a very responsible and well read person, also a Christian...

just does not have ambition. Jesus kind of does that to a person... takes away his or her desire for... dumb stuff..

but why am i defending the poor? You and all lefties wil continue to think of them as lesser-thans...

hey, i understand... we all tend to look at appearances..

but like that one rock says:

"so you think your life is complete confusion [and] your neighbor's got it made. Just remember that:

It's a grand illusion... 'cause deep inside we're all the same...

all the same.."



+++

 

[Ktoyou]

Thanks for calling the poor Idiots. I am outa here
but 1st i say this:

told ya about those lefties... they don't love the poor, or Blacks or anyone, but they sure want u to THINK they do... yes siree....

TH would be one of the last persons to fall into the category you presume to place him.

(A note to the more intelligent and educated who may read this.)
Whether you feel TH is too liberal, from what I know of him, I would say he is far more likely than many, even most, to be empathic.

 

[Ktoyou]

No, we can't. We can point to the Great Depression in the U.S. and the absence of the vast majority of people becoming criminals. People in poverty become criminals and terrorists when they succumb to a breakdown in their morals and/or become brainwashed by envy.

Not so easy, and you might consider TH has more ability than most to examine the issue correctly.

I will add, it is lack in conscience, in the first place, which normally mitigates the influence of outside forces, to leaving one liable of a loss of impulse control. The confounding factor is higher incidents of internal strife, independent of poverty, yet often accompanied by poverty, which leads to impulsive actions, by means of a general lack of trust, which, in turn, often leads to a poor sense of self identity. This complex, under stress leads to a lack of impulse control, whereby actions in violation of civil and criminal law are unable to reinforce appropriate behaviour.

In essence, it is what often accompanies poverty, which leads to crime.

 

[Town Heretic]

again, more words used to obscure your Freudian "gaffe"

No, but I'm done worrying about your misrepresentation. Again, I was agreeing with you, so it's funny either way.

but all those words do nothing to exonerate you.

Us. Exonerate us. lain:

I said all those factors contribute to "making" someone poor and you said (paraphrase) Yeh, all those factors are needed to make an idiot

No, I said you were saying it takes a village to raise an idiot, playing on the book title by a certain Clinton. You'd said (and I agreed) that it's not as simple as blaming the poor for their plight, that it can also be society's fault.

soo... might as well admit your prejudice against the poor.

Well, no. Some of the best people and worst people I've known were poor. I recognize that the poor are disproportionately responsible for things like violent crime, but if I disdained them I'd hardly have spent most of my professional life working among them for teacher's wages.

But you know, i know a poor person who has a very high IQ, a very responsible and well read person, also a Christian...

Me too. And?

just does not have ambition. Jesus kind of does that to a person... takes away his or her desire for... dumb stuff..

And I know rich men of ability who use that ability to help others. Jesus also does that to some. Or are you prejudiced against them.

but why am i defending the poor?

Who knows?

You and all lefties wil continue to think of them as lesser-thans...

Two lies in one line. You're on a roll...now if we can substitute roll for medication you might come around at some point.

 

[republicanchick]

Us. Exonerate us. lain:


oint.

nice little Alinksy-esque trick:

accuse the other of saying what YOU said (because you know what you said is wrong). Now we are both calling the poor Idiots...

yeh... Alinsky would love it... assuming he didn't invent such a tactic... which he actually did..

but you know...

lots of us just don't like that guy...


+

 

[Town Heretic]

...I will add, it is lack in conscience, in the first place, which normally mitigates the influence of outside forces, to leaving one liable of a loss of impulse control. The confounding factor is higher incidents of internal strife, independent of poverty, yet often accompanied by poverty, which leads to impulsive actions, by means of a general lack of trust, which, in turn, often leads to a poor sense of self identity. This complex, under stress leads to a lack of impulse control, whereby actions in violation of civil and criminal law are unable to reinforce appropriate behaviour.

In essence, it is what often accompanies poverty, which leads to crime.

I think that's it. Nicely done.

 

[Sitamun]

nice little Alinksy-esque trick:

accuse the other of saying what YOU said (because you know what you said is wrong). Now we are both calling the poor Idiots...

yeh... Alinsky would love it... assuming he didn't invent such a tactic... which he actually did..

but you know...

lots of us just don't like that guy...




+

Just wondering, do you even know who Alinsky is or is that just a name you've heard a lot on Fox "News"?

As to the other comments, you really need to go back and re read what TH wrote SLOWLY, allow it to sink in.... It's okay, we all make mistakes.

 

[Town Heretic]

nice little Alinksy-esque trick:

No, you're just so blindly driven by your ideology that you a) can't credit anyone else with making up their own mind and b) agreement on a thing once you've pigeon holed them in that myopic, negative way of yours simply doesn't work for you.

accuse the other of saying what YOU said

I literally set out my agreement in the post you misapprehended and clarified a point you apparently didn't get (though I'd have thought you being a child of right wing propaganda you'd have been familiar with the tome and author and the point inferred), a thing that would have been understandable had you not insisted on holding that narrative after being informed on the point.

Or, now you're just another dishonest crank to me. But bluster away on the point and step around the easy rebuttal. It just helps underscore something worth noting.

 

[Town Heretic]

TH would be one of the last persons to fall into the category you presume to place him.

She didn't get the "Okay, okay, yes" groan at my own play on that novel. Now she's making it worse...well, for herself, I think.

(A note to the more intelligent and educated who may read this.)
Whether you feel TH is too liberal, from what I know of him, I would say he is far more likely than many, even most, to be empathic.

The liberal business mostly comes from my defense of unreasonable attacks on the President and not from a particular understanding of my positions. I launched a thread to address that once. Went into my pro gun/anti abortion/pro republic/anti populist foundation, but you can't really make some horses drink...especially when they seem determined to back into the water.

I place a hair left of dead center (about as moderate as you can be) on most the tests that quantify that sort of thing. My leftist tendencies are found in areas like healthcare and a strong belief in the value of public education. I'm pro market, but believe in stronger and more intelligent regulation (along with abandoning some regulations currently on the books to market forces)...or, it's complicated.

I suspect one side fits all lever pullers of being (and have mostly found it the case) ill or under thought.

 

[Nick M]

Perhaps nuking is the answer?

lain:

Cutting your head off is their answer. Why does this not concern you?

 

[Nick M]

my defense of unreasonable attacks on the President

My rebuke of him is completely based on ideologies. You should accept that all of his decisions are the same and not because he thinks something will or will not work. Unlike say, Bush 2, Clinton, Bush 1 and even Reagan. They all compromised. He does not.

 

[resodko]

The liberal business mostly comes from ....

...the fact that you voted for obama in 2008 and argue forcefully for gay marriage and other liberal, politically correct issues

 

[Town Heretic]

...the fact that you voted for obama in 2008

Sure, I voted for the President the first time around. Most moderates did. And a lot of us didn't the second time around. I've never run from either. And the second time around I put my support behind Hunstman and I've also told him that the majority of my votes in any election have been rather strongly on the conservative/Republican side of it. If you know the one you should be aware of the other.

and argue forcefully for gay marriage

I've said there's no on objective justification for discriminatory law on point, just as I've been clear on how I feel about homosexuality as a practice.

and other liberal, politically correct issues

Nah, you just found a couple of less than accurate representations to try this. I have any number of conservative and liberal leaning positions, but so do most moderates and many people who identify on either side of that designation.

 

[resodko]

really?

you wonder why people think you're a liberal and when it's explained to you clearly and concisely you dissemble?


i spose you wonder why people think you're a dishonest scumbag, too :idunno:

 

[Ktoyou]

................

I place a hair left of dead center (about as moderate as you can be) on most the tests that quantify that sort of thing. My leftist tendencies are found in areas like healthcare and a strong belief in the value of public education. I'm pro market, but believe in stronger and more intelligent regulation (along with abandoning some regulations currently on the books to market forces)...or, it's complicated.

Yes it is complicated. I am most right wing on fiscal policy (independent); although that position would be naturally presumed.

TOL is more focused on what stems from the spiritual, religious, cultural and social (interdependent), and individual freedom (independent), and regarding this, personally, while still 'to-the-right', I would say my ideals (interdependent and independent) are typical of what most consider as 'right wing', being a kind, both interdependent than independent, conservative, family, and government (interdependent), individual rights, (independent), opposed to self expression (independent) when it confronts standards of morality, (interdependent), while the left, self expression, egalitarianism,(interdependent) government intervention (interdependent), oppose liberty (independent) when it confronts equality (interdependent).

The problem with models for political mapping is the fiscal is linear, while the cultural-social is non-linear.

 

[Town Heretic]

Yes it is complicated. I am most right wing on fiscal policy (independent); although that position would be naturally presumed.

TOL is more focused on what stems from the spiritual, religious, cultural and social (interdependent), and individual freedom (independent), and regarding this, personally, while still 'to-the-right', I would say my ideals (interdependent and independent) are typical of what most consider as 'right wing', being a kind, both interdependent than independent, conservative, family, and government (interdependent), individual rights, (independent), opposed to self expression (independent) when it confronts standards of morality, (interdependent), while the left, self expression, egalitarianism,(interdependent) government intervention (interdependent), oppose liberty (independent) when it confronts equality (interdependent).

The problem with models for political mapping is the fiscal is linear, while the cultural-social is non-linear.

It's problematic to be sure. I tend to vote conservatively in our judiciary races and on local politics, mix it up at the state level, depending on the candidate. Nationally it's purely a candidate by candidate, issue by issue with me and my mixture of likes and dislikes has led me to support different candidates, depending. I was excited about Huntsman, who I thought would be a reasonable, thoughtful voice for conservative thought and principled negotiation.

When he packed it in there was no chance I would support Romney so I wrote in and resigned myself that the winner wasn't going to particularly impress me regardless.

 

[Arthur Brain]

Cutting your head off is their answer. Why does this not concern you?

It does, as does any advocating of terrorism or extremism, including that of nuking nations so why do you so blithely do so knowing full well that numerous born and unborn children would be exterminated in the process you endorse?