The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[freelight]

Rebirth series, part 2.......

Rebirth series, part 2.......

148:4.1 It was the habit of Jesus two evenings each week to hold special converse with individuals who desired to talk with him, in a certain secluded and sheltered corner of the Zebedee garden. At one of these evening conversations in private Thomas asked the Master this question: “Why is it necessary for men to be born of the spirit in order to enter the kingdom? Is rebirth necessary to escape the control of the evil one? Master, what is evil?” When Jesus heard these questions, he said to Thomas:

148:4.2 “Do not make the mistake of confusing evil with the evil one, more correctly the iniquitous one. He whom you call the evil one is the son of self-love, the high administrator who knowingly went into deliberate rebellion against the rule of my Father and his loyal Sons. But I have already vanquished these sinful rebels. Make clear in your mind these different attitudes toward the Father and his universe. Never forget these laws of relation to the Father's will:

148:4.3 “Evil is the unconscious or unintended transgression of the divine law, the Father's will. Evil is likewise the measure of the imperfectness of obedience to the Father's will.

148:4.4 “Sin is the conscious, knowing, and deliberate transgression of the divine law, the Father's will. Sin is the measure of unwillingness to be divinely led and spiritually directed.

148:4.5 “Iniquity is the willful, determined, and persistent transgression of the divine law, the Father's will. Iniquity is the measure of the continued rejection of the Father's loving plan of personality survival and the Sons' merciful ministry of salvation.

148:4.6 “By nature, before the rebirth of the spirit, mortal man is subject to inherent evil tendencies, but such natural imperfections of behavior are neither sin nor iniquity. Mortal man is just beginning his long ascent to the perfection of the Father in Paradise. To be imperfect or partial in natural endowment is not sinful. Man is indeed subject to evil, but he is in no sense the child of the evil one unless he has knowingly and deliberately chosen the paths of sin and the life of iniquity. Evil is inherent in the natural order of this world, but sin is an attitude of conscious rebellion which was brought to this world by those who fell from spiritual light into gross darkness.

- Paper 148:4 (excerpt from the chapter, "Evil, Sin and Iniquity")

~*~*~

The above relates 'rebirth' with our entering into the kingdom of heaven, and how our 'rebirth' enables us to deal with evil, sin and inquity.

195:10.6 The call to the adventure of building a new and transformed human society by means of the spiritual rebirth of Jesus' brotherhood of the kingdom should thrill all who believe in him as men have not been stirred since the days when they walked about on earth as his companions in the flesh

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[Puppet]

- Paper 148:4 (excerpt from the chapter, "Evil, Sin and Iniquity")

~*~*~

The above relates 'rebirth' with our entering into the kingdom of heaven, and how our 'rebirth' enables us deal with evil, sin and inquity.

.

Thank you for leaving source credits. How come caino gives himself credit for writing posts that sound very similar to UB?

 

[Caino]

Thank you for leaving source credits. How come caino gives himself credit for writing posts that sound very similar to UB?

I don't, I quote the UB and embolden the text in blue.

 

[freelight]

I don't, I quote the UB and embolden the text in blue.

Yes, Caino usually quotes UB text in blue....I recommend 'navy' like I do, to keep things consistent - if he'll oblige. No biggie though. I've got at least one more quote to share on 'rebirth'.

 

[patrick jane]

Yes, Caino usually quotes UB text in blue....I recommend 'navy' like I do, to keep things consistent - if he'll oblige. No biggie though. I've got at least one more quote to share on 'rebirth'.

John 3:5 KJV -

 

[patrick jane]

1 Corinthians 12:13-14 KJV -

 

[freelight]

all these essentials are contained in the 5th Epochal Revelation....

all these essentials are contained in the 5th Epochal Revelation....

John 3:5 KJV -

The UB agrees, at least on the point of spiritual rebirth, since it takes spiritual vision, regeneration, inspiration, discernment to see spiritual realities. I've shared the 4 instances of the word 'rebirth' being used in the papers. Here is the last instance in the second to last paper, concerning the kingdom -

195:10.4 “The kingdom of God is within you” was probably the greatest pronouncement Jesus ever made, next to the declaration that his Father is a living and loving spirit.

195:10.5 In winning souls for the Master, it is not the first mile of compulsion, duty, or convention that will transform man and his world, but rather the second mile of free service and liberty-loving devotion that betokens the Jesusonian reaching forth to grasp his brother in love and sweep him on under spiritual guidance toward the higher and divine goal of mortal existence. Christianity even now willingly goes the first mile, but mankind languishes and stumbles along in moral darkness because there are so few genuine second-milers—so few professed followers of Jesus who really live and love as he taught his disciples to live and love and serve.

195:10.6 The call to the adventure of building a new and transformed human society by means of the spiritual rebirth of Jesus' brotherhood of the kingdom should thrill all who believe in him as men have not been stirred since the days when they walked about on earth as his companions in the flesh.

I quoted a portion of this passage earlier, but we see in its 'context' it refers to the spiritual rebirth enacted within an active community of brotherhood and service, where souls inter-act and are regenerated by the Spirit of God maintaining a common-unity.

1 Corinthians 12:13-14 KJV

Again, agreed,....all those born of the Spirit are immersed in one community, a brotherhood of those joined in 'sonship' and led by the Spirit of truth.

 

[Caino]

THE MORTAL-BESTOWAL CAREERS ​

http://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-20-the-paradise-sons-of-god?criteria="spirit of truth"#U20_6_8


20:6.6 "When the bestowal Sons, Creator or Magisterial, enter the portals of death, they reappear on the third day. But you should not entertain the idea that they always meet with the tragic end encountered by the Creator Son who sojourned on your world nineteen hundred years ago. The extraordinary and unusually cruel experience through which Jesus of Nazareth passed has caused Urantia to become locally known as “the world of the cross.” It is not necessary that such inhuman treatment be accorded a Son of God, and the vast majority of planets have afforded them a more considerate reception, allowing them to finish their mortal careers, terminate the age, adjudicate the sleeping survivors, and inaugurate a new dispensation, without imposing a violent death. A bestowal Son must encounter death, must pass through the whole of the actual experience of mortals of the realms, but it is not a requirement of the divine plan that this death be either violent or unusual.

20:6.7 When bestowal Sons are not put to death by violence, they voluntarily relinquish their lives and pass through the portals of death, not to satisfy the demands of “stern justice” or “divine wrath,” but rather to complete the bestowal, “to drink the cup” of the career of incarnation and personal experience in all that constitutes a creature's life as it is lived on the planets of mortal existence. Bestowal is a planetary and a universe necessity, and physical death is nothing more than a necessary part of a bestowal mission.

20:6.8 When the mortal incarnation is finished, the Avonal of service proceeds to Paradise, is accepted by the Universal Father, returns to the local universe of assignment, and is acknowledged by the Creator Son. Thereupon the bestowal Avonal and the Creator Son send their conjoint Spirit of Truth to function in the hearts of the mortal races dwelling on the bestowal world. In the presovereignty ages of a local universe, this is the joint spirit of both Sons, implemented by the Creative Spirit. It differs somewhat from the Spirit of Truth which characterizes the local universe ages following a Michael's seventh bestowal.

20:6.9 Upon the completion of a Creator Son's final bestowal the Spirit of Truth previously sent into all Avonal-bestowal worlds of that local universe changes in nature, becoming more literally the spirit of the sovereign Michael. This phenomenon takes place concurrently with the liberation of the Spirit of Truth for service on the Michael-mortal-bestowal planet. Thereafter, each world honored by a Magisterial bestowal will receive the same spirit Comforter from the sevenfold Creator Son, in association with that Magisterial Son, which it would have received had the local universe Sovereign personally incarnated as its bestowal Son." UB

 

[Puppet]

I don't, I quote the UB and embolden the text in blue.

If I saw that, I wouldn't have replied. Just wanted to know what's from UB and what's from the direct inspired word of God.

 

[freelight]

If I saw that, I wouldn't have replied. Just wanted to know what's from UB and what's from the direct inspired word of God.

Not only is Caino's posts of UB text in blue or navy,....it has at its end "UB", indicating its source - most of our commentary is in reg. font (black), separate from UB text.

I don't know if your comparison above of the 'UB' from whats "direct inspired word of God" was a 'quirk' or clearly intended,...but that's a matter of 'opinion' ya know. A UB enthusiast may consider the UB as 'inspired' or more 'trustworthy' than the Bible, and a bible-only reader vice-versa. Many UB readers also read the Bible and other religious books too. I'm curious as to how you determine whats the "direct inspired word of God" from something that may be less inspired

In any case,...as you see on this thread,...we share text and commentary opening up for dialogue on generals and particulars.

 

[freelight]

Jesus living out his life fully before experiencing natural death

Jesus living out his life fully before experiencing natural death

THE MORTAL-BESTOWAL CAREERS ​

http://truthbook.com/urantia-book/paper-20-the-paradise-sons-of-god?criteria="spirit of truth"#U20_6_8


20:6.6 "When the bestowal Sons, Creator or Magisterial, enter the portals of death, they reappear on the third day. But you should not entertain the idea that they always meet with the tragic end encountered by the Creator Son who sojourned on your world nineteen hundred years ago. The extraordinary and unusually cruel experience through which Jesus of Nazareth passed has caused Urantia to become locally known as “the world of the cross.” It is not necessary that such inhuman treatment be accorded a Son of God, and the vast majority of planets have afforded them a more considerate reception, allowing them to finish their mortal careers, terminate the age, adjudicate the sleeping survivors, and inaugurate a new dispensation, without imposing a violent death. A bestowal Son must encounter death, must pass through the whole of the actual experience of mortals of the realms, but it is not a requirement of the divine plan that this death be either violent or unusual.

20:6.7 When bestowal Sons are not put to death by violence, they voluntarily relinquish their lives and pass through the portals of death, not to satisfy the demands of “stern justice” or “divine wrath,” but rather to complete the bestowal, “to drink the cup” of the career of incarnation and personal experience in all that constitutes a creature's life as it is lived on the planets of mortal existence. Bestowal is a planetary and a universe necessity, and physical death is nothing more than a necessary part of a bestowal mission.
UB

It is interesting to note that if Jesus sudden, violent death was not necessarily in the plan of divine providence (a vicarious blood-atonement being unnecessary), then perhaps Jesus would have lived his life out and died a natural death at an older age,...but we do wonder what life would be like for him and the world if he continued his ministry, the religious and political leaders tolerating his freedom to preach and teach. If this were the case, would he pass naturally in his sleep, there being no need for a 'resurrection' or would he still appear to his disciples in his 'morontial' form after his death, to bid his disciples well and give them some final instructions before he assumes his rule in glory? Curious about your take on this.

The other passages about the Avonal and Magisterial Sons, I'd need to study again, its been awhile since I've read those sections.

 

[Caino]

"(2060.6) 194:2.1 Jesus lived on earth and taught a gospel which redeemed man from the superstition that he was a child of the devil and elevated him to the dignity of a faith son of God. Jesus’ message, as he preached it and lived it in his day, was an effective solvent for man’s spiritual difficulties in that day of its statement. And now that he has personally left the world, he sends in his place his Spirit of Truth, who is designed to live in man and, for each new generation, to restate the Jesus message so that every new group of mortals to appear upon the face of the earth shall have a new and up-to-date version of the gospel, just such personal enlightenment and group guidance as will prove to be an effective solvent for man’s ever-new and varied spiritual difficulties." UB 1955​

 

[Interplanner]

1, the Bible is not prognostication as though it was a 'safe' form of Nostradamus. It does however say that the judgement day of God through Christ is coming. And that there is a little rebellion that oppresses believers just before that.

2, NT eschatology is either about 1st century Judea OR about the above day of judgement. There is utter confusion mixing these or thinking that Bible is a NASA-timeline-quality prediction of world events.

 

[freelight]

Jesus in the UB, and the NT records.....

Jesus in the UB, and the NT records.....

"(2060.6) 194:2.1 Jesus lived on earth and taught a gospel which redeemed man from the superstition that he was a child of the devil and elevated him to the dignity of a faith son of God. Jesus’ message, as he preached it and lived it in his day, was an effective solvent for man’s spiritual difficulties in that day of its statement. And now that he has personally left the world, he sends in his place his Spirit of Truth, who is designed to live in man and, for each new generation, to restate the Jesus message so that every new group of mortals to appear upon the face of the earth shall have a new and up-to-date version of the gospel, just such personal enlightenment and group guidance as will prove to be an effective solvent for man’s ever-new and varied spiritual difficulties." UB 1955​

:thumb:

I thought to look up the first use of the word 'gospel' in the UB,...its in Paper 5, in a sub-chapter of 'God in Religion' -

:4.6 The Hebrews based their religion on goodness; the Greeks on beauty; both religions sought truth. Jesus revealed a God of love, and love is all-embracing of truth, beauty, and goodness.

5:4.7 The Zoroastrians had a religion of morals; the Hindus a religion of metaphysics; the Confucianists a religion of ethics. Jesus lived a religion of service. All these religions are of value in that they are valid approaches to the religion of Jesus. Religion is destined to become the reality of the spiritual unification of all that is good, beautiful, and true in human experience.

5:4.8 The Greek religion had a watchword "Know yourself"; the Hebrews centered their teaching on "Know your God"; the Christians preach a gospel aimed at a "knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ"; Jesus proclaimed the good news of "knowing God, and yourself as a son of God."

As we shared earlier, the papers do include the concept of 'rebirth' of the spirit as an essential in coming to know/experience and interact with spirit-realities of communion, fellowship and worship, those things concerning the kingdom, since spiritual things are spiritually discerned. However, a difference in the papers is that man is already understood to be a son of God and awakens to this realization in the 'new birth' of the spirit, which inspires the soul as it receives the good news of the kingdom, - the 'recognition' of man's sonship with God is realized.

The terminology and experience is the same or similar as described in the NT, but expressed a bit differently as far as 'mechanics' is concerned, in articulating the 'process' or 'details' of the inner working of the Spirit in the soul, affecting fellowship, communion and the inspiration of worship. In the papers there is the 'thought-adjuster' inter-acting with the soul, which is an interesting and complex association, so that brings in new dymanics never before revealed elsewhere. Any other similarities or differences that you see in the papers description of 'rebirth of the spirit' as compared to what is described in the NT?

 

[freelight]

1, the Bible is not prognostication as though it was a 'safe' form of Nostradamus. It does however say that the judgement day of God through Christ is coming. And that there is a little rebellion that oppresses believers just before that.

2, NT eschatology is either about 1st century Judea OR about the above day of judgement. There is utter confusion mixing these or thinking that Bible is a NASA-timeline-quality prediction of world events.

Hi Interplanner,

Not sure what you're responding to or what this relates to in our thread or the UB in general upon these subjects :idunno: - can you supply a reference point, passage or post you're responding to?

 

[Charity]

Good old British John. Celtic mary. French peter! UK :K:Has anyone ever considered the history of Nations that have been forced to their knees to observe a foreign God. Naturally their seed WILL look without seeing an PERHAPS read without remembrance.

Abraham Migrated to a new country where he created a covenant to seize the Land he sat on THREW HIS GOD, that his seed would rise up in time to receive his promise as Stars of the heavens. (they) were later exiled from their promised Land to returned again 40 years latter, entering Israel under what christians mirror was a christian cloud lead by Moses.

I believe todays Christians are the product of their historical ancestors faith being conquered. I also believe that all evidence of what that faith stood for has be reduced to nil by a barbaric an greedy alliance to split the spoil.. the looting of the Temple Gold, turning Stones an claiming the land an estate. evidence of ongoing Matinance, suppressing the memory of the Kingdom where Harps Pipes an strings sounded as a nation of people Danced an wrote poetry is a will or will not observation.

Please reply if your Brave enough to consider that an ancestor may have been forced to the knees to worship a strange God!

 

[Caino]

Parliament of World Religions annual meeting. UB well represented among the 10,000 in attendance.

​

 

[patrick jane]

yeah, a 10X10 space in a convention center is real good representation

 

[Caino]

yeah, a 10X10 space in a convention center is real good representation

Well, didn't your mother tell you that if you cant say something nice don't say anything at all???

BTW. Jesus was a local contractor from a small town with a bad rep. His followers were mainly uneducated common laborer's. In Rome the Jesus story was most popular among the poor and slaves in the beginning.

 

[freelight]

See what is being 'communicated'.......read between the lines

See what is being 'communicated'.......read between the lines

yeah, a 10X10 space in a convention center is real good representation

General consensus or mass-belief is not necessarily an indicator of the truth of something. In estimating the value of something we are diligent to study and research the article in question, then see how it relates to life and what is being 'communicated'. That is 'key'.