nikolai_42
Well-known member
If we cannot qualify on our own merits to be justified in God's eyes - and by extension cannot merit salvation - what sense does it make to say we can lose that which we never qualified for?
To use an analogy to deepen the point, take someone who has gone through primary school, elementary school, through junior high, senior high, obtained a bachelor's degree, a master's and finally has obtained a Ph.D. That individual has earned the right to guard, preserve, perpetuate and advance the cause and fount of understanding in his particular field. His earning that right to do so implies many years of training and preparation that mean he has not only earned the right but shown himself to be capable and trustworthy. Take a man who has little or no training and put him in the same position. Would you expect the same level of performance? Of ability? Of trustworthiness? Does he even want to be there? Unless he is properly equipped, he will neither want to be there (except to have some fun, maybe) nor uphold the standards expected of a Doctor of (whatever).
When Christ justifies someone, He is making him to sit in heavenly places with Christ Jesus. That individual is being given a place that is above his natural function and capacity (the natural man receiveth not the things of God...for they are spiritually discerned). How can that man - being put in a position he may not have either been prepared for or even fully desired (knowing the full ramifications of it) - be entirely responsible for losing the position? That is, until there is a natural (read : innate) ability to fulfill the office and meet all demands that go with it, how can it be considered reasonable that he should meet those demands - and by extension, how can that individual lose what he never qualified for to begin with?
I say this, in part, with Hebrews 6 in mind - and with trying to understand how a justification apart from works can give rise to any sense of a maintaining that justification by the individual's own works.
Or is this a straw man...something that no one really holds to....?
To use an analogy to deepen the point, take someone who has gone through primary school, elementary school, through junior high, senior high, obtained a bachelor's degree, a master's and finally has obtained a Ph.D. That individual has earned the right to guard, preserve, perpetuate and advance the cause and fount of understanding in his particular field. His earning that right to do so implies many years of training and preparation that mean he has not only earned the right but shown himself to be capable and trustworthy. Take a man who has little or no training and put him in the same position. Would you expect the same level of performance? Of ability? Of trustworthiness? Does he even want to be there? Unless he is properly equipped, he will neither want to be there (except to have some fun, maybe) nor uphold the standards expected of a Doctor of (whatever).
When Christ justifies someone, He is making him to sit in heavenly places with Christ Jesus. That individual is being given a place that is above his natural function and capacity (the natural man receiveth not the things of God...for they are spiritually discerned). How can that man - being put in a position he may not have either been prepared for or even fully desired (knowing the full ramifications of it) - be entirely responsible for losing the position? That is, until there is a natural (read : innate) ability to fulfill the office and meet all demands that go with it, how can it be considered reasonable that he should meet those demands - and by extension, how can that individual lose what he never qualified for to begin with?
I say this, in part, with Hebrews 6 in mind - and with trying to understand how a justification apart from works can give rise to any sense of a maintaining that justification by the individual's own works.
Or is this a straw man...something that no one really holds to....?
