Tasted Death for every Man !
- Thread starter beloved57
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Derf
Well-known member
His position is its own challenge.
beloved57
Well-known member
Heb 2:10 makes it clear who the everyone or every man is in Heb 2:9 for whom Christ tasted death for. Its for every son that He suffered and died for, constituting Him the Captain of their Salvation which brings them to Glory:
10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
Notice it specifies their Salvation ! So He tasted death or suffered for their Salvation. Also this taste of death for them ensures their being brought to Glory.
10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
Notice it specifies their Salvation ! So He tasted death or suffered for their Salvation. Also this taste of death for them ensures their being brought to Glory.
Derf
Well-known member
You haven't actually said anything. He tasted death for every man, and he is bringing many sons into glory. Those statements don't conflict, since not everyone will be brought into glory, even though he tasted death for every man.
You really need to put aside you preconceptions and maybe listen to a different teacher for awhile. It will do you good. And if your pastor/teacher is hesitant to let you do that, then you need to question 1. whether he believes what he's teaching is really taught in the bible (else he wouldn't feel so insecure about it), or 2. whether he is insecure about his own teaching ability.
Either way, insulating yourself from non-Calvinist viewpoints can only harm you in the long run, even if Calvinism is true, as you won't have the ability to defend your beliefs (as you've shown multiple, multiple times in your many threads you've started).
beloved57
Well-known member
The Captain of our Salvation !
The every man in Heb 2:9 who Jesus tasted death for, are the same by His taste of death in Vs 10 became to them and them only, the Captain of their Salvation !
Heb 2:9-10
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings[His Death].
To be the Captain of their Salvation also describes the fact that He was and is 100% responsible for their Salvation. God made it His responsibility to save them and consequently bring them to Glory.
This coincides with Jesus words in Jn 17:2
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
It also fulfills what Isaiah wrote Isa 9:6
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
The government of the Salvation of His People is upon His shoulders !
This speaks of His Spiritual rule, prince hood. In fact that word Captain in Heb 2:10 also means Prince Acts 5:31
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
So His tasting Death was for the Salvation of His People, you cant separate His Death from Salvation !
The every man in Heb 2:9 who Jesus tasted death for, are the same by His taste of death in Vs 10 became to them and them only, the Captain of their Salvation !
Heb 2:9-10
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
10 For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings[His Death].
To be the Captain of their Salvation also describes the fact that He was and is 100% responsible for their Salvation. God made it His responsibility to save them and consequently bring them to Glory.
This coincides with Jesus words in Jn 17:2
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
It also fulfills what Isaiah wrote Isa 9:6
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
The government of the Salvation of His People is upon His shoulders !
This speaks of His Spiritual rule, prince hood. In fact that word Captain in Heb 2:10 also means Prince Acts 5:31
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
So His tasting Death was for the Salvation of His People, you cant separate His Death from Salvation !
Poor students of the Bible mistakenly think the passage reads: 'Jesus tasted death for every elect man but did not taste death for those God designed from the foundation of the earth to not be allowed to get saved so He could bring glory to Himself by torturing them forever in hell for being born sinners.'
beloved57
Well-known member
Did you understand the post ? You want to discuss the details of it ?
Derf
Well-known member
You should be asking yourself those questions, at least about @marke's post, and possibly about your own, since you don't really want to discuss anything you write--you just like to keep repeating it, hoping, no doubt, that you will finally become convinced that you are right, in absence of listening to anyone else. Except Nanja, of course, who just blindly congratulates you on how brilliant you are.
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Nanja, not Nang.
It's worse than that. She blindly congratulates b57 for how brilliant his posts are, and then gives praise to God for it, crediting Him for their (willfully ignorant) errors.
beloved57
Well-known member
We know that the every man in Heb 2:9 that Christ by the Grace of God, tasted death for, wasn't every individual without exception, because His death was a manifestation of Gods Grace towards them, and so by His death they are Justified by His Grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus Rom 3:24
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Heb 2:9
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
Those He died for are Justified by His Death/Blood Rom 5:9 !
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood or Death, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
And we know everyman individually is not Justified !
24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Heb 2:9
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
Those He died for are Justified by His Death/Blood Rom 5:9 !
9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood or Death, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
And we know everyman individually is not Justified !
Calvinists make a mockery of God's salvation plan by claiming the only reason God allowed sin into the world was to justify murdering billions of sinners made by God to do nothing but sin. God did not create sin to bring glory to Himself. That notion is stupid. God had to allow humans to sin because God wanted humans to have the freedom of choice to choose to serve God or serve themselves. Condemnation is not something that God created to make Himself feel good. God had to condemn sin even though He chose to allow men the freedom to choose sin over life. God gave humans the freedom to choose because God loved humans, and God offers to save every human who comes to him by choice to seek forgiveness and deliverance from sin.
God's gracious purpose was that Christ might taste death for everyone. He died as our representative and as our Substitute: that is he died as man and he died for man. He bore in his body on the cross all God's judgement for sin so that those who believe on him will never have to beat it. (Believers Bible Commentary)
beloved57
Well-known member
By Death delivered from Death.
We know that Christ didnt taste Death for all individuals without exception since those He tasted Death for are by His Death delivered from Death and the fear of Death Heb 2:9,14-15
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
Those who Christ tasted death for have been set free from the death the devil brought about !
We know that Christ didnt taste Death for all individuals without exception since those He tasted Death for are by His Death delivered from Death and the fear of Death Heb 2:9,14-15
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
Those who Christ tasted death for have been set free from the death the devil brought about !
Derf
Well-known member
In other words, you just start with that presupposition, and use your presupposition to reject what the Bible plainly says, that Christ died for all, but all will not believe. That puts your presupposition in a position of higher authority than the Bible.
That’s what Adam and Eve did with God’s word, too.
Nanja
Well-known member
Amen Brother !
The Calvinist prayer: "I thank thee O glorious Father of the universe that thou hast had mercy on me for no reason and that thou hast condemned all my lost relatives to burn in hell forever for no reason that makes them different than me. I will always praise you, God, for the undeserved mercy you showed on my little soul while justly burning with wrath against all those sinners you hate with a passion."
Nanja
Well-known member
Dan. 4:35 And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?
Derf
Well-known member
That doesn’t mean he takes pleasure in the eternal punishment of the wicked.
That's right. Who is man to say God must save every individual on earth because Jesus died to make it possible for every sinner on earth to have his sins forgiven if only he asks?