beloved57
Well-known member
Those who heard the Gospel had been Born of the Spirit, one must be of God to hear Gods Words Jn 8:47 !
The Calvinist Doctrine of Total Depravity, Totally Refuted
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
Those who heard the Gospel had been Born of the Spirit, one must be of God to hear Gods Words Jn 8:47 !
Brother Ducky
New member
All well and good. Just more of your stock phrases, which would be OK if they spoke to the issue. They do not.
It seems to me that you have not really attempted to deal with your original post and refuting the doctrine of Total Depravity. At least try to refute it before you claim that it is totally refuted.
If those who had participated in the crucifixon of Christ could hear and believe the Gospel and be saved, then anyone can hear and believe the Gospel and be saved.
There is an order to salvation, here it is.
1. They hear the Gospel.
2. They believe the Gospel.
3. They receive the Holy Spirit.
Here is the reason. God does NOT give his Holy Spirit to anyone unless he first sees them "In Christ".
They enter into eternal life by hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2.
beloved57
Well-known member
You must be of God to hear Gods words John 8:47 !
Right,
Why would anyone want to believe the doctrine of a man that was a murderous tyrant?
beloved57
Well-known member
You cant escape the Truth, read Jesus words Jn 8:47
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
So John Calvin has a man burned at the stake, and we call him a murderer, and call Luther a saint. However did Luther not practice racial hate against Jews, quoting " burn their synagogues and destroy them. To bring justice to Gods wrath on them." He hated Jews and in the bible it says you hate you commit murder. So it is suffice to say that Luther was a murder as well
Brother Ducky
New member
I agree that nobody is beyond the saving reach of God. But if your defense of your thesis is that some bad people were saved, therefore there is no Total Depravity it is an epic fail.
Brother Ducky
New member
But do you not say that God sees all in Christ?
In a universal sense God sees ALL THINGS in his Son Jesus Christ. As far as God is concerned Jesus has reconciled the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.
In an individual sense there will be a judgment of the lost. Those that are not found to be "In Christ" will have their sins imputed back to them, Romans 4:8.
Brother Ducky
New member
Thought I would help you out here with some things you should deal with in your refutation of Total Depravity:
Man’s heart is evil (Mark 7:21-23) and sick (Jer. 17:9)
Man is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:20).
He does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12).
He cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14).
He is at enmity with God (Eph. 2:15).
by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3).
Man’s heart is evil (Mark 7:21-23) and sick (Jer. 17:9)
Man is a slave of sin (Rom. 6:20).
He does not seek for God (Rom. 3:10-12).
He cannot understand spiritual things (1 Cor. 2:14).
He is at enmity with God (Eph. 2:15).
by nature a child of wrath (Eph. 2:3).
beloved57
Well-known member
God has not reconciled those under His Wrath Jn 3:36, so you do lie !
Of course all men are wicked sinners, Romans 3:10.
But when the Gospel which is... "The power of God unto salvation" Romans 1:16, is preached, men can hear and believe, just like on the day of Pentecost when 8,000 Jews heard and believed and were saved, Acts 2:41 and Acts 4:4.
"Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God" Romans 10:17.
beloved57
Well-known member
One must be of God to Hear Gods Words ! Jn 8:47
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
We hear them not if we are not of God !
beloved57
Well-known member
Its you who rejects the Gospel of Gods Grace in Christ, also known as Calvinism, Tulip !
Brother Ducky
New member
Nothing but a bunch of non scriptural hogwash.