glorydaz
Well-known member
It's too bad you are so easily offended. Perhaps forums are not your cup of tea. :think:
The earth is flat and we never went to the moon--Part II
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It's too bad you are so easily offended. Perhaps forums are not your cup of tea. :think:
What's not his cup of tea is not being treated "nicely".
He's using it as an excuse to not have to deal with the fact that his pet conspiracy theory was blown apart inside of a day of him posting on this thread. He figured it would be a lot harder for people to knock him off the high horse that all these flat-earthers seem to think they're sitting on.
What's sad is that if he'd just engage the debate and be intellectualy honest, he'd very easily learn something here, but that's not why he showed up.
Bladerunner
Member
I guess you like to be called a liar, stupid among about 5-6 other insults.....
I have seen very few facts cross my screen except Cleve's opinion, which everything seems to considered a fact coming straight out of his mouth. Yet, I am the one not willing to debate and causing the confusion because I refuse to follow these people like a lost sheep or something.
You have it at least half right? I probably will not revisit this thread on this forum.
glorydaz, I do wish you have a good evening.
Blade
Bladerunner
Member
To Clete:
I would like to offer my sincere apology for the pronouncing/spelling your name wrong. There is not excuse for such lack of attention on my part.
Blade
I would like to offer my sincere apology for the pronouncing/spelling your name wrong. There is not excuse for such lack of attention on my part.
Blade
glorydaz
Well-known member
I don't mind if they're honest enough to come right out and say what they think. It's when someone plays the hypocrite and uses fancy words in a condescending manner that I get ruffled. {I'm not talking about you or any other poster in this thread when I say that.) Just letting you know what I can and can't abide.
I think you are misjudging what is being expected in this debate. No one wants or needs sheep to follow blindly...certainly not Clete or Right Divider. Just plain honesty and a listening ear is all that is required.
I'm sure you could enjoy this thread if you just started anew...without taking things so personally. It's simply not intended that way from everything I've read.
Don't worry about it at all. I didn't even notice! :chuckle:
By the way, if you're writing a quick note like that to someone where using the quote tag doesn't really make sense, if you put a hash tag in front of the user's name, they'll get a notification that someone mentioned them in a post.
#Bladerunner
So just what is it that I've said in regards to the FET (Flat Earth Theory) that you think is an opinion? I mean, the whole argument is based on two observations of the angle of the Sun above the horizon and then some highschool level math, the results of which falsify the FET. What is there that can rightly be called an opinion?
Be specific.
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George Affleck
TOL Subscriber
If any flat-earther chooses to know the truth for themselves by way of irrefutable proof, please request it and I will provide here in this thread.
There is a simple undeniable proof that the earth is a globe, spins on it's axis and orbits the sun. The problem is that flat-earthers do not want it. Ignorance is bliss.
There is a simple undeniable proof that the earth is a globe, spins on it's axis and orbits the sun. The problem is that flat-earthers do not want it. Ignorance is bliss.
Right Divider
Body part
You can continue to take that position. But we can all see the truth that you have no courtesy or respect for others and think that you can "fix us".
The facts are clear in this case. You and your fellow FE's are wrong and just can't admit it.
I don't know about any of the flat earthers but you've piqued my interest. What's your argument?
George Affleck
TOL Subscriber
There are many so-called proofs that are never accepted by flat-earthers because there are objections that they think are reasonable to each of them. But this one has no objection that even they can be comfortable with.
The sun moves, in our sky, it's own arc diameter at precisely the same amount of time.
In other words, how long does it take for the sun to move the distance of it's apparent diameter in the sky? And is it the same at noon as it is at 2 or 4 or any other time? This experiment can be done by anyone in their own backyard if they don't believe anyone else. You don't have to go up in a spaceship to see the curvature or investigate mirages or any of the other stupidity that they engage in.
It is roughly 2 minutes depending on where you are located. But the key is that it is identical and constant. It is roughly 1/2 of a degree of movement.
No flat-earth model can account for this phenomena. Only a heliocentric model does.
Right Divider
Body part
The simpler way to say this is that the apparent size of the sun is the same all day long.
The FE's will show over-saturated videos in an attempt to refute this simple fact. They will also scream "perspective" until they're blue in the face (while not even understanding how perspective works).
It's a clown parade.
Okay, so let me make sure I understand this argument.
You're saying that, for a particular observer (i.e. location), the length of time that it takes the sun to move an apparent distance across the sky that is equal to it's apparent size is the same no matter where the sun is in the sky.
That much I understand but the apparent size of the sun does not change appreciably from one part of the day to another. The Sun seem bigger at sunrise and sunset because your brain interprets what it's seeing and thinks the Sun is closer near the horizon than it appears to be at mid-day and so your brain says close = bigger but it's just an illusion. The apparent size of the sun (or moon) is pretty much exactly the same when it rises as it at noon. All that to say this, the apparent size of the Sun does not seem to be relevant to the argument. Pick any time of day and any arbitrary number of degrees of movement and the argument is that the Sun covers that amount of distance at the same rate, regardless of what time it is.
Does that sound right to you?
If so, then the next question is how does that disprove a flat Earth? In other words, what would one expect to see if the Earth was flat and why?
Clete
No, I don't think that's what he's arguing. See my previous post.
Right Divider
Body part
I'm pretty sure that was what he was saying.
The sun moving its own diameter per the same unit time all day long is the same as saying that its apparent size is the same all day long.
George Affleck
TOL Subscriber
That is exactly the observable fact. Correct.
This is a related but separate arguement that is also true but I don't think is as convincing as the first. It is for me, but flat-earthers will talk about the sun appearing different sizes throughout the day. Their arguments about this are not true, but they think they have an answer. For the arc-diameter argument they have no answers.
In all flat-earth scenarios, the time for the sun to move one arc-diameter would increase through the morning and decrease in the afternoon because it would be moving toward or away from the observer. It would not be constant.
It is important to do this calculation when the sun is not near the horizon where it is subject to the lensing effect of the atmosphere which is negligible a few hours after sunrise and before sunset.
This came across my newsfeed...
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jimdob...tarctica-expedition-to-the-edge-of-the-world/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jimdob...tarctica-expedition-to-the-edge-of-the-world/
No, it's saying that whether it changes or not, the time it takes to travel one arc diameter remains the same. In effect, it implies that the Sun slows its apparaent speed with a reduction of it's apparent size. That's why I asked him what I did. The fact that the Sun's apparent size does remain the same throughout the day seems to force a modification to his argument.
They'll go, they'll figure out that they were wrong and it won't convince ANYONE who didn't go with them.
They'll either fade into obscurity and be forotten (ignored) by the flat earthers or they'll be turned into villians who were never really flat earthers to begin with but where really NASA plants who only showed up to create more disinformation (or some variant of that) or else they will come back and lie.
The article discusses a recent expedition that has already been done with constant coordinate updates and everything and instead of being convinced they all deny the existence of any evidence that the expedition actually took place - including the continuous cooridinate updates. These people are insane. They cannot be convinced by anything rational.
Clete
On Wednesday, March 20, 2019, at 5:58 p.m. ET we all have a chance to prove once and for all that the Earth is not only not flat but that it is, in fact, spherical in shape.
That's right every single person on this thread along with ever single person who belongs to any Flat Earth Society, Group or Association along with every other person on the planet who has a clear sky tomorrow will witness the Sun rise due Ease and set due West of their location. It doesn't matter whether you're in Florida, Main, Oklahoma or New Mexico. It matters not whether you're in the U.S. or Mexico, Chile, France, Russia, Egypt or South Africa. You can be on the Pacific Ocean, the Atlantic Ocean, the Indian Ocean or on Lake Fork near Dallas, TX. You pick the spot - any spot - and if the Sun rises or sets in that location then it will rise due East and set due West of your location.
This cannot happen on a planet that is a flat disk or a flat anything for that matter. It cannot occur any shape of a planet other than one that is round and who's Sun is very far away.
I'm pretty sure that I'm going to have cloudy skies but if not then I'll be taking photos of the sunrise and sunset tomorrow with the same app that we used before to record the position of the Sun.
Look up the precise time of sunrise and sunset for your specific location and take the same photos and we can all post them here. They should all be due East/West, within a quite small margin of error.
Clete
P.S. The app is call Spyglass and is available at the App store.
That's right every single person on this thread along with ever single person who belongs to any Flat Earth Society, Group or Association along with every other person on the planet who has a clear sky tomorrow will witness the Sun rise due Ease and set due West of their location. It doesn't matter whether you're in Florida, Main, Oklahoma or New Mexico. It matters not whether you're in the U.S. or Mexico, Chile, France, Russia, Egypt or South Africa. You can be on the Pacific Ocean, the Atlantic Ocean, the Indian Ocean or on Lake Fork near Dallas, TX. You pick the spot - any spot - and if the Sun rises or sets in that location then it will rise due East and set due West of your location.
This cannot happen on a planet that is a flat disk or a flat anything for that matter. It cannot occur any shape of a planet other than one that is round and who's Sun is very far away.
I'm pretty sure that I'm going to have cloudy skies but if not then I'll be taking photos of the sunrise and sunset tomorrow with the same app that we used before to record the position of the Sun.
Look up the precise time of sunrise and sunset for your specific location and take the same photos and we can all post them here. They should all be due East/West, within a quite small margin of error.
Clete
P.S. The app is call Spyglass and is available at the App store.
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