Vaccination progress

JudgeRightly

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Ha!
Prolonged because of lockdowns? What is the mechanism? Or shall I guess? We would have had herd immunity by now!

"Tribal" immunity, is a better term. Humans aren't animals, despite the claims of atheists. But you otherwise nailed it. Also, there are many ways a lockdown itself kills people, so on top of the virus killing people, you also have people dying because of the lockdown.

Sure, maybe at a cost in human lives- but who cares!

You realize that the quicker an epidemic ends, the fewer lives are lost, right?

What gives you the idea that having a quicker burn through of a virus and a sustained economy would result in more deaths than locking down the world and causing death through both the virus AND the lockdown?
 

Yorzhik

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I'm realizing now that you aren't actually reading my posts. Yet you reply as if you have. You should either stop lying to yourself or break out of your NPC lifestyle and actually listen to both sides. That's something I do. I listen to both sides. I can describe your position but you can't describe mine.

You have a curious idea of logic:

1. Attributing the non-COVID excess deaths to the COVID lockdowns isn't justified. One could just as easily say that they are due to undiagnosed COVID cases
No one couldn't. All those excess deaths, like all deaths, have a cause that is pretty well known. What shows this to be true is that health officials openly admitted to attributing a death to COVID when the death could have been as easily attributed to other factors. Get it? They were quite aware of the cause of death but any possibility it could have been a COVID death was attributed to COVID.

So yeah, before we go on you have to admit the idea of attributing excess non-COVID deaths to secret COVID is wrong.

2. Looking at the deaths in the with all the hated precautions that were taken, and then saying "see, the lockdowns were pointless and harmful" is not logical either. The question is- how bad would it have been without those lockdowns? To answer that (within limits, I admit), one has to look at other countries.
I covered this in my reply, which is how I know you didn't read it. We know how bad it would have been by the charts, both between states and countries. They show, if one is willing to follow the science, that no lockdowns or social distancing and mask mandates had much of an effect.

3. The idea that you personally care more about people all over the world than I do ("Objectively", no less!) because your country gives more to foreign aid is so absurd that I wonder if you are worth arguing with. You can do better than that.
Wow, what a grandiose display of misreading what was written. Read it again. I was sad that, as a country, we wouldn't be able to help people because our politicians hurt our economy. Since I care about people outside of our country how our economy affects others should have been considered. So because you didn't read you thought something I wrote was absurd when it was perfectly reasonable. It's you that can do better.
 

Yorzhik

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Ha!
Prolonged because of lockdowns? What is the mechanism?
If you were curious you'd be aware of the obvious - more people die in a bad economy because of poorer diet decisions, work related stress, marital stress (finance is the #1 stress factor in a marriage), and general higher risk taking chasing some kind of benefit.

Add to that the people that don't get help from other people with charity-bound income when that extra income dries up.

Or shall I guess? We would have had herd immunity by now! Sure, maybe at a cost in human lives- but who cares!
The charts show us, if you follow the science, that few more lives would have been lost to COVID if we hadn't mandated masks or social distancing or lockdowns. Not anywhere near the lives that were lost because of them.
 

chair

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Wow, what a grandiose display of misreading what was written. Read it again. I was sad that, as a country, we wouldn't be able to help people because our politicians hurt our economy. Since I care about people outside of our country how our economy affects others should have been considered. So because you didn't read you thought something I wrote was absurd when it was perfectly reasonable. It's you that can do better.
You are right- I read your post too quickly, and jumped to a wrong conclusion.

I do not understand how you know whether I care about people in other countries or not. You can claim that my thinking will cause them more damage, but that I don't care?
 

expos4ever

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At what point do those risks become significant enough to outweigh the potential benefits?

What can you tell us about the long term risks of these vaccines that have been rushed through the development and testing process in a manner unprecedented?
First of all, how do you know things have been rushed? Your claim - please substantiate it. Need I state the obvious: the fact that something has happened much more rapidly than usual does not, of course, necessarily mean it was "rushed".

Now then, about long-term risks. I suspect that there are technical reasons beyond both our respective understandings as to why it is reasonable to not expect any serious long-term risks. Having said that, and in strict departure from the "I-went-to-community-college-so-I knows-what's-what" school, I will concede that I am speculating.

But I will continue to remind you and others that while there may indeed be long-term risks of the vaccine, these need to be traded off against the long-term risks of getting Covid (if ever there were a statement of painfully obvious.....).
 
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way 2 go

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First of all, how do you know things have been rushed? Your claim - please substantiate it.
3000 deaths in 15 years from all vaccines vs 3000 deaths in 4 months from wuflu vaccine indicates rushed

Screenshot_2021-05-10 Israel develops new drug to treat coronavirus.png
 

Yorzhik

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You are right- I read your post too quickly, and jumped to a wrong conclusion.

I do not understand how you know whether I care about people in other countries or not. You can claim that my thinking will cause them more damage, but that I don't care?
Ok. So you are ok with damaging people if they aren't part of your own country. If say that qualifies as evidence that you don't care about them.

But let's get back to the root cause you don't want to address: before we go on you have to admit the idea of attributing excess non-COVID deaths to secret COVID is wrong.

And: according to the charts, if you want to follow the science, masks don't make a measurable difference - they are nothing but making someone's face a David's star.

And admit the truth about lockdowns: more people die in a bad economy because of poorer diet decisions, work related stress, marital stress (finance is the #1 stress factor in a marriage), and general higher risk taking chasing some kind of benefit.

If you trust the vaccines then good for you, but mandating them through vaccine passports will lead to the same outcome as lockdowns.
 

chair

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Ok. So you are ok with damaging people if they aren't part of your own country. If say that qualifies as evidence that you don't care about them.
Um, No. Just because I don't agree with your analysis of the situation doesn't mean that I don't care.

And no, I will not respond to the rest of your post.
 

Yorzhik

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Um, No. Just because I don't agree with your analysis of the situation doesn't mean that I don't care.
Have it your way. If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

And no, I will not respond to the rest of your post.
Great YouTube title "Yorzhik exposes the facts of COVID and leaves NPC chair speechless"
 

chair

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We're having a war here right now, so I have more important things to worry about than answering some strangers' comments. The whole world is wrong, and a few geniuses here are right? Fine, if it makes you happy.
 
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