ECT Who for the joy set before Him endured the cross

[Cross Reference]

Hey CR, this is off topic, so if you don't want to go in that direction, I understand. You say there is more about God's wrath towards humans in the bible than about his love.

Tell me, do you consider love a defining attribute of who God is? That is, when the Bible says, "God is love," does love lend a definition of who God is in his inner-most being throughout eternity? I'll leave that question open, for now.

We are compelled to believe that because only Love can create. [place the man Jesus into this to see some things from His Life while working this out] Therefore, when considering all else written for our understanding the scriptures, we must take that “Absoluteness” of Him into account and etch it in stone.

Second question: When we read, as we do, that the wrath of God is "revealed" against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men..., is this a revelation

I don’t understand your use of the words “revelation that speaks to the inner-most being of God; i.e., does it speak to who God is substantively, prior to and apart from his creation? ”. Do you mean in me or in Him?

If He is absolute then He is unchangeable, is He not? Therefore, He is compelled in His judgment to do what He does irrespective of His Love which is also by His love that He preforms it, isn’t He? How ‘bout, if He is absolute Love then by all that is sacred His also absolute “Righteousness” __ and cannot waver in His opinions. I hope you will take all of this into consideration when reading John 17:3 to maybe understand more of what Jesus is trying convey.

OMT: Can any form of unrighteousness stand in the “Absoluteness” of His presence? Why not define what you believe about God to see how it might affect any mysticism you/we might believe about Him. After all, we were created in His image and much of what He is He has intended for us to become by the “washing of regeneration and the “continual” renewal of the Holy Spirit””.

I hope that won't come across as convoluted thinking. . .

 

[Nick M]

Question: When and What was the joy set before Jesus?




He reconciled all men to God with his death.

 

[oatmeal]

You should learn them and get rectified in your thinking.

I Timothy 2:4-5

 

[Cross Reference]

I Timothy 2:4-5

Get on with it then.

 

[nikolai_42]

I would rather believe it was because Jesus knew the outcome of the Father's Will which implies the need to know God, as He desires to be known, by His new born creation that such knowledge might also sustain them when the time comes for them to be proven. Wouldn't you agree?

While I don't disagree that what you say is true, it seems to me that you are rather saying that God is worthy of all trust. That God will provide. That trusting God implies relationship with Him (through Christ who displayed the Father's character in full display in the flesh). Or are you saying God gives us joy as we trust Him?

 

[TFTn5280]

We are compelled to believe that because only Love can create. [place the man Jesus into this to see some things from His Life while working this out] Therefore, when considering all else written for our understanding the scriptures, we must take that “Absoluteness” of Him into account and etch it in stone.



I don’t understand your use of the words “revelation that speaks to the inner-most being of God; i.e., does it speak to who God is substantively, prior to and apart from his creation? ”. Do you mean in me or in Him?

If He is absolute then He is unchangeable, is He not? Therefore, He is compelled in His judgment to do what He does irrespective of His Love which is also by His love that He preforms it, isn’t He? How ‘bout, if He is absolute Love then by all that is sacred His also absolute “Righteousness” __ and cannot waver in His opinions. I hope you will take all of this into consideration when reading John 17:3 to maybe understand more of what Jesus is trying convey.

OMT: Can any form of unrighteousness stand in the “Absoluteness” of His presence? Why not define what you believe about God to see how it might affect any mysticism you/we might believe about Him. After all, we were created in His image and much of what He is He has intended for us to become by the “washing of regeneration and the “continual” renewal of the Holy Spirit””.

I hope that won't come across as convoluted thinking. . .

Hey, CR, I don't think it was convoluted at all. And 99% of it I would agree with, if not all of it; BUT it doesn't get to the questions that I am asking. Two questions: is God in his inner-most being, love; and is God in his inner-most being, wrath? I believe those questions when answered correctly get at something about God, that is potentially misunderstood and misapplied otherwise. But I apologize; all I have time to do right now is throw the questions out there and leave you with them as a teaser, only because I am at work and can't give them my attention right now. I assure you, I'll be back on topic as soon as I get off work. Have a good day.

 

[Cross Reference]

Hey, CR, I don't think it was convoluted at all. And 99% of it I would agree with, if not all of it; BUT it doesn't get to the questions that I am asking. Two questions: is God in his inner-most being, love; and is God in his inner-most being, wrath?

Why does His "inner most being" have to include a disposition of wrath when His wrath doesn't originate with Him but with man as a result of him violating God's "Holiness" otherwise, God is never wrathful, in the pure sense of the word. His Judgment, immediate and/or eternal is the issue the unrighteous, to whatever degree, have to deal with.

 

[Cross Reference]

While I don't disagree that what you say is true, it seems to me that you are rather saying that God is worthy of all trust. That God will provide. That trusting God implies relationship with Him (through Christ who displayed the Father's character in full display in the flesh). Or are you saying God gives us joy as we trust Him?

All of the above and more. . . . Thanks for your agreement, Nikolai. "It is like the precious ointment upon the head, that ran down upon the beard, even Aaron's beard: that went down to the skirts of his garments; Psalm 133:2 (KJV) . . .

 

[TFTn5280]

Why does His "inner most being" have to include a disposition of wrath when His wrath doesn't originate with Him but with man as a result of him violating God's "Holiness" otherwise, God is never wrathful, in the pure sense of the word. His Judgment, immediate and/or eternal is the issue the unrighteous, to whatever degree, have to deal with.

First of all, I was not going to argue that God's inner-most being does have to include a disposition of wrath; in fact, my conclusion was going to be just the opposite of that. But, my friend, right now I am going to have to just apologize for setting this up as I did, because I am in a position of not being able to follow through. I will return to it as soon as I am able, and when I do, it will be just as pertinent as it is now. But I am involved in another thread that I thought had pretty much expired. That's why I came to yours, but during the course of today I was asked to engage a topic in that thread at a very intense level. I am not one who can spread himself too thin without everything suffering. So, out of respect for all, I must delay this latest endeavor. In the meantime, I wish you the best. I'll be looking you up when I get back. T