e4e's SPOTD 8/17/2005

[elected4ever]

Greetings All,

I have read the three rounds of presentations concerning “Openess theology.”

It should be clear to all individuals that the nature and attributes of the Godhead are being addressed.

In this debate, there is no middle ground.

Either you believe that God does not change or that He does. Whoever is on the wrong side is not a Christian.

This is not some mere academic argument.

If God can change, I cannot have trust in Him. Stop and consider.
Mal 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed

If God cannot completely know all things, my future is uncertain. Stop and consider.
Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times [the things] that are not [yet] done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

If God does not have complete power, I could be swept away. Stop and consider.
Rom 8: 36 - 39 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

God’s people always expressed confidence in their hope. Here are a couple of examples of this certainty.

Job 19:25 For I know [that] my redeemer liveth, and [that] he shall stand at the latter [day] upon the earth:.

1Jo 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, [even] in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.


Remember,
Gal 6: 7-9 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

God has written to His people in plain words and they are knowable. Stop and consider.

Leonard A.

EXCELLENTLY STATED LEONARD! :first:

 

[Turbo]

e4e, do you agree with Leonard that all OVers are unsaved?

 

[death2impiety]

I trust in God that even though He can change, by His nature, He will hold good to His promise to the faithful. It seems like you need a robotic God to have faith that he will remain faithful? Saying God can change doesn't take away from His loving nature. My father loves me, my father can change. I have faith that He will continue to love me regardless of the ability to change to the contrary. Have some faith brother.

 

[elected4ever]

e4e, do you agree with Leonard that all OVers are unsaved?

About as much as you believe that Calvinist are unsaved.

 

[elected4ever]

I trust in God that even though He can change, by His nature, He will hold good to His promise to the faithful. It seems like you need a robotic God to have faith that he will remain faithful? Saying God can change doesn't take away from His loving nature. My father loves me, my father can change. I have faith that He will continue to love me regardless of the ability to change to the contrary. Have some faith brother.

At least I don't assign to God the fallacies of a mythical Greek god

 

[Poly]

About as much as you believe that Calvinist are unsaved.

Turbo doesn't believe that Calvinists are unsaved.

So does this mean you don't agree with Leonard A regarding OVer's not being saved?

 

[elected4ever]

Turbo doesn't believe that Calvinists are unsaved.

So does this mean you don't agree with Leonard A regarding OVer's not being saved?

That is a fair assessment. I was referring to this post only. I don't know that about Lenard's belief that OVers are lost. That has nothing to do with this post anyway.

 

[Poly]

That is a fair assessment. I was referring to this post only. I don't know that about Lenard's belief that OVers are lost. That has nothing to do with this post anyway.

From Leanord's post....

Either you believe that God does not change or that He does. Whoever is on the wrong side is not a Christian.

(emphasis mine)

 

[elected4ever]

From Leanord's post....


(emphasis mine)

The belief that God changes is not Christian. That does not prevent Christians from believing it. It is a pity that so many of my brothers and sisters have been duped into believing it and worse that they sincerely defend it. The actions of the flesh and the understanding of the flesh does not make a Christian. The Heavenly Father makes Christians by his own seed. Not the seed of a man or the acts of men.

 

[Turbo]

I was referring to this post only.

Me too.

I don't know that about Lenard's belief that OVers are lost. That has nothing to do with this post anyway.

As Poly pointed out, Leonard said that whoever is on the wrong side of this debate isn't a Christian. He went on to try to establish that OVers are on the wrong side of this debate. Therefore in Leonard's post, which you awarded POTD, he claimed that all OVers are lost.

If I understand you correctly, you disagree with him on that point. (Will you please confirm this?) Therefore I would advise you to read posts more carefully before awarding them POTD.

 

[Turbo]

The belief that God changes is not Christian. That does not prevent Christians from believing it.

So then you disagree with Leonard on that point, right? After all, Leonard said that anyone who is an OVer "is not a Christian."