ECT Re: Ephesians 2:8

Danoh

New member
Then perhaps you might enlighten us as to what the devil tempting Jesus was all about?

Go fer it! Given He was the Son of God, What woud been the result had Jesus succumbed to any of those temptations by the devil, Per Luke 4:1-14 KJV? How do you suppose Vs 14 would have read had He failed?

Those three temptation issues are the three issues that 1 John 3:16 describes as the lust of the flesh (tempted Him to turn those stones into bread) the lust of the eye (tempted Him with those kingdoms He showed Him) and the pride of life (tempted Him to throw Himself off a cliff since the angels will catch Him).

They are also the same issues that prayer He taught the Twelve is about (Luke 11:1-4).

And in all that, lastly, those three temptations will be faced by Israel during Daniel's 70th Week / JACOB'S Trouble (Hebrews 4:13's "was in all points tempted like as we, yet without sin").

The Adversary was tempting Him to do those things before their due time.

Revelation 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

And so on...

But He was faithful...to the end.

Acts 17: 11, 12.
 
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Cross Reference

New member
Yep, simple as that.

Why say I need to ask why Jesus didn't sin?
It's you that wants an answer, isn't it?

Not in the least.

Since He didn't sin, it's pointless to speculate on what might have happened.

Where is the pointlessness when He WON THE VICTORY? Over what, dazed?? "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory." Luke 21:27 (KJV) Think: Jesus was the second Adam for a whole new creation, All which was purposed for in the first Adam..

Note: Why did not God immediately destroy Adam and start over?
Had God started a new creation WITHOUT destroying Adam, where would that have placed fallen Adam in the scheme of things. What would have been his relationship with God; Satan? Where would Adam have gone to reside away from the presence of God, hell? And the rest of fallen creation? How would redemption be possible for Adam? If all of that would have been the case then Satan would have won. Satan would have won in killing off God's first creation and now he is going to kill His second creation. NEVER!! That isn't the way it was could ever have been played out. Adam's race had to be redeemed. God's plan for eternity and the whole godhead hung in the balance. Angels were watching this all going down. They would soon make a choice.

The real question, then, is how was it Jesus managed to NOT SIN as Adam did. Wouldn't you say?

Which points up our need for what was IN Him. I.e., the Life of His Father; the Life of the "Word" of God. Ergo, that is what our new birth from above is all about! That is what Jesus was telling Nicodemus in Jn 3:3,5.

Right, He was fully human. In fact, one of the reasons God came in the flesh, was to be tempted as we are.

NO.NO! God has no reason to be tempted in the flesh and if He did He still couldn't be tempted. He created the tempter. Glory in flesh can't be tempted being the result of allegiance to God. It is God. Jesus was of Adam in this period of testing for God to witness as He did Adam. So what is the point in what you said if it is not to point up the vulnerability of the innocense of man, who was made a little lower than the angels? Don't you remember the story of Job? God told Satan to 'go tempt him. Test him to see if he will forsake Me'.

Jesus was tempted in all ways...as we are, that he could make reconciliation between man and God.

His death in innocence reconciled man and restored the "Word" of God to His expressive position in the Godhead. . .but now in Glorified Human Flesh which is what Jesus accomplished.. He did what God could not do insofar as the Father was Spirit and the "Word" of Him, the expression of the Father Who spoke creation into existence; who Moses saw in Exo.33:21-23. Who was sent to earth and made submissive to the human nature of the "body prepared for Me", and given the Name, Jesus, "who would save His people from their sins".

Jesus was tempted even unto His death by satan in an attempt to prevent Him from accomplishing what only He could do. If he had prevailed over Jesus, the man, he would have defeated God Almighty. Remember this: Jesus was God's ONLY begotten son in whose "Life", which represented the Godhead in un-glorified human flesh, all of creation hung in the balance. And now the new born of God are given much the same mission, i,e., become the extention of His Arm until the "Day of the Lord". [Paul] "Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church, of which I became a minister according to the stewardship from God that was given to me for you, to make the word of God fully known, the mystery hidden for ages and generations but now revealed to his saints. Colossians 1:24-26 (ESV)

[Jesus] "And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed. “I have manifested your name to the people whom you gave me out of the world. Yours they were, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word. Now they know that everything that you have given me is from you. For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. I am praying for them. I am not praying for the world but for those whom you have given me, for they are yours. John 17:5-9 (ESV)

Jesus proved His allegince to His Father and sealed the fate of Satan, redeeming mankind in the process; enableling man to BECOME a son of God by the new birth..

Practically, this verse has got to be speaking of the Comforter which was to come.

Heb. 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.​

OK. I see that. Now how will His success in us be realized unless there is time of testing that we also know we are able to be an extension of His Arm to the 'needy' of this world?

Romans 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.​

Think Pentecost. Think this through from Paul when he wrote: ". . . . I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. Galatians 2:20 (KJV)

Hope this summary is helpful.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Whose faith is Ephesians 2:8 referring to?
the faith of Jesus Christ

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
 

Cross Reference

New member
the faith of Jesus Christ

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Whose faith is Eph 2:8 referring to? It is not the faith of Jesus. His faith IN you [or me] is progressive for our maturing IN Him with the result being our sonship in the Father.. . .The Body of Christ.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
His faith IN you [or me] is progressive for our maturing IN Him with the result being our sonship in the Father.. . .The Body of Christ.
made up

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
 

Cross Reference

New member

Nope

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Faith is NOT the gift. Salvation is.

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

This faith is a Gift, one of the Gifts of the Spirit from the day of Pentecost.


Ponder all that before replying.
 

DAN P

Well-known member
If Dan didn't hit it, then I don't stand a chance.


Hi and in Luke 4:2 Jesus could NOT be Tempted and the correct translation is TESTED !!

In verse 4 it says it is written which is in the Greek PERFECT TENSE , PASSIVE VOICE and in the Indicative Mood and is a FACT !!

Verse 2 shows that He hungered , just like any man !!

In verse 6 we see that Satan , tried to TEST Jesus by saying ALL THIS POWER I will give thee , so Satan still did not understand the Jesus was REALLY God and shows that Satan would not understand the purpose of the cross and his disciple NEVER under stood it either as Satan is not all KNOWING and not Omnipresence !!

In verse 7 we see that same thing as we see today , REFUSE to acknowledge and WORSHIP God and it is mostly PRIDE !!

And in Rom 12:3-8 we that God gives to , as God has DIVIDED OUT to each a measure of FAITH and is obvious that those are NOT DISPENSATIONAL are not given MUCH FAITH to believe Paul !!

I have your back !!

dan p
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
Yep



Faith is NOT the gift. Salvation is.
For by grace are we saved through the faith of Jesus Christ! We didn't DO anything to save ourselves! We didn't and couldn't lift a finger for our salvation! By faith, the Lord Jesus Christ was made to be sin for us, died on the cross for our sins and God proved that the wages of sin (which is death) was paid in full by raising the Lord Jesus Christ from the dead for our justification! 100% God, 0% us!

This faith is a Gift, one of the Gifts of the Spirit from the day of Pentecost.
:chuckle:


Ponder all that before replying.
We look back to the cross as the means of salvation. God did all of the work then (2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV). We are partakers of Christ by the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Ephesians 3:6 KJV)!
 

Cross Reference

New member
Yep



For by grace are we saved through the faith of Jesus Christ! We didn't DO anything to save ourselves! We didn't and couldn't lift a finger for our salvation! By faith, the Lord Jesus Christ was made to be sin for us, died on the cross for our sins and God proved that the wages of sin (which is death) was paid in full by raising the Lord Jesus Christ from the dead for our justification! 100% God, 0% us!

:chuckle:


We look back to the cross as the means of salvation. God did all of the work then (2 Corinthians 5:19 KJV). We are partakers of Christ by the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV, Ephesians 3:6 KJV)!

All contingent upon OUR faithfulness to Him. God does not bless the un-blessable. Only by our faith is He pleased when in Christ..

WMT: For understanding, try looking back before the cross to understand He purposed life to live by His Life. Man was not to live by bread alone but by every word the came from His mouth. Man did not need a gift of faith to believe that and neither does he need one to believe Jesus Christ. We are without excuse.
Where do you think you fit in?

Something more for your consideration:

If we have faith the size of a mustard seed then we can move mountains......is that not awesome?

However,

Jesus was referring to having a grain of HIS faith. Now what would that require of us when we say are born again if not an uncompromised life . . .just for starters?
 
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eleos

New member
The point of Ephesians 2:8 is described in Ephesians 2:9 .... and the point is one can not be saved by their works. Faith is trusting in Jesus and is not a "work" ... when we repent and accept Jesus as our savior (we accept His gift of salvation), we are trusting in Him and He begins His work in us through the Holy Spirit leading us through the Holy Word thereby He increases our faith (trust)in Him.

Hebrews 12

2 looking to Jesus, the founder (originator) and perfecter (completer) of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.

Revelation 3:20 - He originates, we accept

20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.
 

Cross Reference

New member
:doh:

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Close the thread. You're embarrassing yourself.

If your condescension is what you are going offer up in each reply, I will assume that is all you are made of and leave you to infantilism.. Get my drift?
 

Cross Reference

New member
The point of Ephesians 2:8 is described in Ephesians 2:9 .... and the point is one can not be saved by their works. Faith is trusting in Jesus and is not a "work" ... when we repent and accept Jesus as our savior (we accept His gift of salvation), we are trusting in Him and He begins His work in us through the Holy Spirit leading us through the Holy Word thereby He increases our faith (trust)in Him.

Hebrews 12

2 looking to Jesus, the founder (originator) and perfecter (completer) of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.

Revelation 3:20 - He originates, we accept

20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.

"Simply" Beautiful. . . :) Thank you.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
If your condescension is what you are going offer up in each reply, I will assume that is all you are made of and leave you to infantilism.. Get my drift?
Translation: punt

You can't take something (in this case salvation by grace through faith) that is "not of yourselves" and make it of yourselves as you did. You're a mess.
 

Cross Reference

New member
Translation: punt

You can't take something (in this case salvation by grace through faith) that is "not of yourselves" and make it of yourselves as you did. You're a mess.

Thats twice! Three times yer out!

My faith is my own. So is yours, irrespective of what it may be in. And it is by that same quality of faith from birth by which we might be saved. I was saved and remain saved by what I just submitted to you.
 

heir

TOL Subscriber
The point of Ephesians 2:8 is described in Ephesians 2:9 .... and the point is one can not be saved by their works. Faith is trusting in Jesus and is not a "work" ... when we repent and accept Jesus as our savior (we accept His gift of salvation), we are trusting in Him and He begins His work in us through the Holy Spirit leading us through the Holy Word thereby He increases our faith (trust)in Him.
Our salvation is not based on our faith, but His. The gospel of our salvation is WHY Christ died for us (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV). We can't and didn't do anything to save ourselves. The saved are those who have trusted Him believing what He did (Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV) and that by grace through His faith (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV).

Hebrews 12

2 looking to Jesus, the founder (originator) and perfecter (completer) of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
The Hebrews had to hold out til the end to be partakers of Christ (Hebrews 3:14 KJV). We do not as we are made partakers by the gospel (Ephesians 3:6 KJV).
 

Cross Reference

New member
Our salvation is not based on our faith, but His. The gospel of our salvation is WHY Christ died for us (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV). We can't and didn't do anything to save ourselves. The saved are those who have trusted Him believing what He did (Ephesians 1:13-14 KJV) and that by grace through His faith (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV).

The Hebrews had to hold out til the end to be partakers of Christ (Hebrews 3:14 KJV). We do not as we are made partakers by the gospel (Ephesians 3:6 KJV).

Translation: I can live my life as it has always been and have Jesus too.
 

Cross Reference

New member
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Paul said that about himself living by the faith OF the son of God. Can you claim that for your yourself? Are you living by the LIfe of Christ Jesus because that is what Paul was saying?

?
 
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