The Myth of saying that God Loved all men in the world without exception !

[beloved57]

This scripture and others like it prove that God does not Love all without exception Heb 12:6-8

6For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

Rev 3:19

19As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Notice, Christ says as many as I love..meaning He does not Love all without exception or this statement would be meaningless..

Those God Loves He chastens. Now does He chastens the whole world without exception ? No He does not.

There is a distinction between those God loves and chasten and the rest of the world He shall condemn 1 Cor 11:32

32But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Now that portion of mankind that shall be condemned at the Judgment, were not Chastened by the Lord, and scripture says, as many as the Lord Loves they are chasten, and they will not be condemned with the world..

So this is more scripture testimony that God does not Love all men without exception..​

 

[beloved57]

To teach that God Loved all men without exception by faulty understanding of Jn 3:16, is to overlook that God's Love is grounded in Christ and not apart from Him..

Rom 8:39

Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Thats right, we must not understand Jn 3:16 apart from Rom 8:39..

Now, with this in mind, If God Loved all men without exception in Christ Jesus, then all men without exception could claim to be recipients of this declaration from the mouth of Christ Jn 17:23-24

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

This is a declaration that all True Believers in Christ were Loved by the Father in the same manner as He loved the Son, and that being before the foundation of the world...

Now, if those who recklessly teach that God Loves all men without exception, then they have all been loved to the same manner of extent as Christ has been loved even from before the foundation, and yet many of them so loved by God, will be cast into the lake of fire with the devil and his angels..

And many of them so loved will hear Him whom they were Loved in before the foundation say these words Matt 7:23

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

or these words Matt 25:41

41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

They will be called ye cursed even though they had supposedly been Loved by God in Him, before the world began..

All these conclusions are merited because men will not bow to scripture testimony that God only loved some of mankind and not all..​

 

[beloved57]

God does not Love all men without exception, because all whom He Loved are and will be more than conquerors, overcomer's through Christ..

Rom 8:37

Nay, in all these things we [Elect] are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

The word through is the prep dia which means:

through

a) the ground or reason by which something is or is not done

1) by reason of

2) on account of

3) because of for this reason

4) therefore

5) on this account


So, by reason of His Love for us [the elect] we are more than overcomer's..

So for God to have loved all without exception, then all without exception would be more than conquerors..Which certainly cannot be the case..

 

[beloved57]

John 3:16

Those whom God So Loved in Jn 3:16, could not have been every individual in the world without exception, because if So, then that would mean that He Loved them with an everlasting Love Jer 31:3, it would mean that in Love He predestinated them unto the Adoption of Children by Jesus Christ to Himself Eph 1:4-5

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

In Love here can very easily be joined with the first phrase in vs 5, Love here refers to that Love with which God loves His Chosen Ones [ Deut 7:6-7] God's Love is grounded in His Choice of A People as we can see from Deut 7:6-7, and so if God Loved everyone without exception in Jn 3:16, that is like saying God has Chosen everyone in the World without exception, which we know is not True. In this Love, its such a Love that God's Chosen Ones will experimentally become Holy and without blame before Him, and that cannot be True of those Jesus will yet say Matt 25:41


41Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Remember, the Chosen were Blessed Eph 1:3-4

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

 

[beloved57]

Did God Predestinate all without exception ? Eph 1:4-5


4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Now some Translate the two words in love at the end of vs 4 and have them instead at the beginning of vs 5 as to read:


5 in love Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

The NIV reads :

4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love 5 he[a] predestined us for adoption to son ship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will—

Here the period is put at the end of vs four after the word sight !

Now this being the case, and since God's Love here is the same as that in Jn 3:16, then we must suppose that God has predestined all without exception for adoption to Sonship in accordance with His Pleasure and will. So all without exception shall attain to The Image of Christ Rom 8:29

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Now if all without exception are not predestinated unto this Image and attain unto it, God and His Love and His Predestination have failed.

 

[Desert Reign]

B57: you are right. God does not love all men. That much is clear from scripture. However, it is also clear that God desires that all men be saved.

 

[beloved57]

dr:

However, it is also clear that God desires that all men be saved.

Yes, all men that are Chosen in Christ. And they all shall be saved. And God does not desire the salvation of any He did not love, you speak foolishly.

 

[Desert Reign]

dr:
Yes, all men that are Chosen in Christ. And they all shall be saved. And God does not desire the salvation of any He did not love, you speak foolishly.

You are welcome to your opinion. However, I shall go with the Bible, which states that God desires that all men be saved.

But, may I ask you something? You are clearly not ashamed of calling yourself "other". It is good that you are honest in stating that you are not a Christian. But I am wondering why you would want to be proud of that, given that non-Christians will not receive eternal life. What kind of hope can you possibly have?

 

[beloved57]

dr:

You are welcome to your opinion.

Its fact ! For the God I serve !

 

[beloved57]

Now if God Loved all without exception, then in Love, He predestnated all without exception. If He predestinated all without exception, then He must have foreknew all without exception according to Rom 8:29

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

 

[Trumpetfolker]

beloved57,
I had not hoped to see you write anything worth repeating.
I was wrong. Please forgive me.
God created a world dominion over which He gave to Adam to run according to the wisdom that was from above.
He loved that world.
When Adam decided to submit himself to his wife and her deceiver, the earthly wisdom began to be a part of Adam's dominion and the creation was made subject to vanity.
Corruption filled the world which God loved so much. Not only that. Corruption became institutionalized in the kingdoms of the world by spiritual wickedness in heavenly place.
Then, the Word of God moved into a body prepared by God to do His will, and Jesus was born of a virgin. Laying His life down for the lost sheep of the house of Israel, seeking that which was lost, and, as the Lamb of God who took away the sins of the world, Christ was reconciling ALL things to God.
Now, we who believe on Him are His body prepared by God to do His will. Let us, therefore, preach the gospel to every creature.

 

[beloved57]

If God foreknew all without exception, then He predestinated all without exception, if He predestinated all without exception, then He called everyone without exception.

Rom 8:29-30

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

And if He called all without exception, then He Justified all without exception, and if He Justified all without exception, then He Glorified all without exception. This must be True if God Loved all without exception !

 

[beloved57]

He called or named all without exception!

And if God called [named] all without exception, Them, He Justified all without exception.

Interesting also about the word called here in vs 30, its not the same word in vs 28 where the word for call is klētos which means:


called, invited (to a banquet)

a) invited (by God in the proclamation of the Gospel) to obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom through Christ

This word means more of an invite or a Divine summons

The word for called in vs 30 is the word kaleō which means:


to call

a) to call aloud, utter in a loud voice

b) to invite

2) to call i.e. to name, by name

a) to give a name to

1) to receive the name of, receive as a name

2) to give some name to one, call his name

It means to call by Name, or name someone, for instance here Matt 1:21

21And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

So this call refers to God naming those that are His. Remember in John 10:

To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.

So the called in Rom 8:30 is the naming of the Sheep, and so as we continue to look at those God Loved, if its all mankind without exception, then all mankind without exception has been named, all are His Sheep, His own Sheep. If that is True, then we have serious problems with what Jesus said to some of the unbelieving jews of His day, notice John 10:26

26But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

Also, we have a problem with Jesus statement here in Matt 7:23

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

This would be a flat out lie and contradiction if Jesus Loved them, and they were His Sheep once, because its written here John 10:14

14I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

So if Christ Loved them, He knew them as His Sheep, and that would make Christ a Liar if He states to them in Matt 7:23 He NEVER KNEW THEM !

All this is the ramifications of insisting that God,and the Lord Jesus Christ loved all mankind without exception, the scriptures lead to this conclusion !

 

[beloved57]

Now them He called or named He also Justified, observe Rom 8:29

Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Now remember, we are following the thought that God Loved all mankind without exception. And since He supposedly did, then He must have in Love Predestinated all mankind without exception unto the adoption of Children as stated in Eph 1:4-5

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

Now, with that connection, All whom He predestinated He foreknew Paul says in Rom 8:

29For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

So we arrive at our next step in God's predestination to them He loved, and that is them He Justified. So according to them who teach God Loved all men without exception, to be consistent, then they must believe and teach all men without exception are Justified before God. The word Justified is the greek word dikaioō and means:


to render righteous or such he ought to be

2) to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered

3) to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be

It means to be declared righteous.

So everyone because God Loved them, are declared righteous, there should not be one unrighteous person of all mankind according to this view. Everyone is righteous, or else God's predestination is a farce and failure.
​

 

[Jordan Fontenot]

2 Peter 3:9
"The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance."

Keep in mind that in greek there are 4 words for love and 2 for hate and in Hebrew there are 2 for love and 3 for hate. All of your verses seem to be taken out of context.

Obviously God loves all men otherwise there would be some that are condemned with absolutely no shot at redemtion. All of your verses are in context about those who disobeyed God and were displeasing to Him because of that. They persih because they choose not to enter Christ and that is where the hatred (greek: kakos) comes in. it is not the lack of love but confrintation with God's love. They are the enemy but that does not mean that God does not love them.

 

[beloved57]

jordon:

Obviously God loves all men otherwise there would be some that are condemned with absolutely no shot at redemtion.

Thats the case, some men are born that way and


2Pet 3:9 says nothing about Loving all men without exception, not even close.

 

[The Barbarian]

If God hated all who break His commandments, then He would love none of us.

2Peter 3:9 The Lord delayeth not his promise, as some imagine, but dealeth patiently for your sake, not willing that any should perish, but that all should return to penance.

If the Bible is trustworthy, then God loves us all enough to desire that we all come to repent and be with Him.

 

[beloved57]

Them he also glorified.

And finally, them that He Justified, them He also Glorified !

Rom 8:30

30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Notice that scripture uses the past tense here, them He also glorified. All for whom God Loved have been and will be Glorified. They were glorified first of all when they rose together with their Glorious Head, when He was Glorified after having been raised up from the dead. Remember when Jesus said, speaking of His impending death Lk 24:26

26Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?

His Glory was entered into when He sat down at the Right Hand of God after completing the redemption of His People ! Heb 1:3

3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

This is of that Glory He had with the Father before the world was John 17:5

5And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Now, when Christ was raised up to enter into this Glory, all for whom He represented also was raised up together with Him and also made to sit together with Him in heavenly Places Eph 2:6

6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

In this connection, lets look at Col 3:

1If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

2Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

3For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

I made this connection because its vital to the point I am making about those Christ died and rose in behalf of, were raised up with Him above where He sits at the right hand of God, and so do they.

Now in this connection, we should more clearly understand Christ words to Nicodemus John 3:3

3Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

This word born again is actually being born from above, so it can be read " Except a man be born from above, he cannot see or perceive the Kingdom of God.

Lets look at at a few other translations of this verse !

ISV Jesus replied to him, "Truly, I tell you with certainty, unless a person is born from above he cannot see the kingdom of God."

GWT Jesus replied to Nicodemus, "I can guarantee this truth: No one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above."

YLT Jesus answered and said to him, 'Verily, verily, I say to thee, If any one may not be born from above, he is not able to see the reign of God;'


Its referring to a New Birth from above !

ESV Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

In other words, unless one is born again anew out from above, where Christ and they in Him sit at the Right Hand of God, they cannot see the Kingdom of God.

Yes, to make it plain, only those Glorified together with Christ [Rom 8:30] are being born again anew, being born again requires having been raised up together with Christ at His resurrection and being seated at the Right Hand of God in Heavenly Places Eph 2:

6And hath raised us up together[Glorified], and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Now, if God Loved all without exception, then all them He Loved have been Glorified together with Him and will be born again from above.

Those of you who insist that God Loved all without exception, are insisting [ though unwittingly] that all without exception shall be born from above where they sit with Christ on God's Right hand, there is no way around it.

But the truly enlightened know better, we know that all without exception were not raised up together with Christ and shall not be born anew from above, and so we rightly conclude, that God did not Love all men without exception !

 

[beloved57]

Jn 3:16

Jn 3:16

John 3:16

16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The World that God so Loved here in this text, has to be a world Chosen in Christ, and had to have a previous Union with Him or Else, there is another Love of God besides that which He has that is in Christ Jesus Per Rom 8:38-39

38For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,

39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

God has no Love for any who He does not consider in Christ Jesus. Now Does He consider all without exception in Christ Jesus ? What about the devil and his children, the children of the wicked one as per Matt 13:38

38The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Are they in that world that God so Loved in Christ Jesus ?

 

[beloved57]

Eternal Love for the Reprobate !

Eternal Love for the Reprobate !

John 17:23-24

20Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

21That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

23I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

24Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

If God Loved all men without exception, this implies that all men without exception were in a Eternal Union with Christ before the foundation of the world.

This would also mean that the children of the wicked one, the tares as described here Matt 13:38

The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

That they were Eternally Loved and in Union with Christ before the foundation of the world. Such thinking is utter madness and blasphemous.

Its to say that God so Loved the children of devil as He Loved Christ !