lightbringer
TOL Subscriber
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A combined 98 years of Christian life and this is all that you guys can say?
It's no wonder there are those that feel Christianity is illogical.
toldailytopic: Is homosexuality genetic?
- Thread starter Nathon Detroit
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A combined 98 years of Christian life and this is all that you guys can say?
It's no wonder there are those that feel Christianity is illogical.
alwight
New member
You would seem to think you might be a potential gay yourself then Clete?
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
csuguy
Well-known member
That's the same logic the OSASers - "he was never really saved to begin with." It's stupid.
Yes. Inclinations are like that. You don't choose to have an inclination. You have an inclination and then choose. You don't go: "Hey, I want to want to have an apple." You go: "Hey, I have a desire for an apple. Let me think whether or not it's for the best for me to eat one."
csuguy
Well-known member
I submit that your initial attractions are not your choice, though I wouldn't say they are genetic as much as they are a product of your environment and raising.
But, as evidenced by people I personally know, you are not limited to your initial attractions. You can "expand your horizons" if you so choose.
Now, that doesn't mean that your initial attraction goes away by any means, but it does mean that a homosexual can acquire heterosexual attractions if they so choose, and visa versa.
"I have no desire to eat squash. It's just not that yummy. In fact, the sight of squash alone makes me want to vomit. However, I'm going to choose to implant the desire in myself and start enjoying it."
No, CSU. Your friends didn't change their orientations. They already had the orientation lying dormant.
csuguy
Well-known member
"I have no desire to eat squash. It's just not that yummy. In fact, the sight of squash alone makes me want to vomit. However, I'm going to choose to implant the desire in myself and start enjoying it."
No, CSU. Your friends didn't change their orientations. They already had the orientation lying dormant.
Ah, but it is true that people acquire tastes for foods and such. Beer for example - I've acquired a taste for it, though I didn't like it at first. Of late, I am fond of Sierra Nevada's Kellerweis. A Stone Cold Ruination is also good, but harder to find.
Yes, if one so chooses they can "experiment" and come away with differently. You are just being close-minded to think that everyone is made a certain way and there's nothing you can do about it. If anyone has a right to say anything on the matter its people who have done it.
Here's an example of where someone might "experiment": they come to the conclusion that sex is all about pleasure. It doesn't matter who your with, or even what - just so long as you enjoy it. And believe me - being in a college town - many people have this conception. Starting from here, they will try many things - one of which is experiment with gender. Historically, and even today, people will even do things with animals and such. Depravity knows no bounds. Would you say then that they were born with a sexual orientation of a horse or something? Of course not.
"I have no desire to eat squash. It's just not that yummy. In fact, the sight of squash alone makes me want to vomit. However, I'm going to choose to implant the desire in myself and start enjoying it."
No, CSU. Your friends didn't change their orientations. They already had the orientation lying dormant.
Actually, people have been known to develop a taste for certain foods.
lain:
Actually, people have been known to develop a taste for certain foods.
Good point, Kmo and CSU.
On the other hand:
It's a well known fact that many homosexuals have been engaged in heterosexual marriages, and their homosexuality constituted grounds for their separation. If it were possible to "develop a taste," as it were, I fail to see why such homosexuals (involved over an extended period of time in a heterosexual marriage) wouldn't develop said taste, especially given the social/legal pressures involved.
csuguy
Well-known member
Just because you acquire a taste for something doesn't mean that your default desires go away. I may have acquired a taste for beer, but that doesn't mean I've given up Dr. Pepper
Just because you acquire a taste for something doesn't mean that your default desires go away. I may have acquired a taste for beer, but that doesn't mean I've given up Dr. Pepper
That's just it, though. Their marriages didn't fail because they retained a default desire. Plenty of bisexual couples are able to stay together, I'm sure. The problem with these marriages is that they simply couldn't bring themselves to enjoy the heterosexual relationship.
csuguy
Well-known member
You have to look on a case by case basis to really evaluate why it fell apart. Most likely, seeings how they married them, they likely did have desires for that person. But after a while, they were tempted by their other desire. Since they had one desire satisfied, they felt like going back and satisfying the unfulfilled desire.
So you are right, a heterosexual marriage won't satisfy homosexual desires - but that doesn't mean that the one leaving doesn't have heterosexual desires.
Of course, we can evaluate this kind of thing without looking at genders - marriages fall apart because men and women have affairs or want them all the time. The criteria may not be a gender difference, but age perhaps. Beauty. Maybe they've spent too much time with someone and have developed an emotional bond with them. etc.
So you see, just because a man/woman breaks up their marriage for homosexual desires doesn't mean that they don't or never had heterosexual desires. It just means that they chose their homosexuality over their love and desire for their heterosexual partner.
That's just an argument for it being biological rather than choice. :chuckle:
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
We develop a 'palette' for plenty of things since children. Like most kids I would venture, I enjoyed sweets. Not so much nowadays as I tend to prefer savoury foods. The same with beer, which again as a child tasted pretty awful. Nowadays I like a nicely chilled San Miguel...
This is just natural development as oppose to choice. Acquiring a 'taste' isn't simply choosing to want to like something. If it were I still wouldn't have an aversion to peanut butter. Using your approach I could will myself to start liking the stuff which makes no sense. You might as well say I could choose to start enjoying hitting myself on the knee with a ballpeen hammer, do you see my drift?
If people are open to experimenting with their own gender then they don't have an aversion to it to start off with. I do and so do most people I know. Some don't which is also fair enough but it's not being 'closed minded' to acknowledge that for myself it's only the opposite sex where my attraction lies. It simply is.
Arthur Brain
Well-known member
Actually, people have been known to develop a taste for certain foods.
Funnily enough Count I could care less whether I ever see a sprout again in my life. A bit unfortunate that this fate seems destined to befall yourself...
:ha:
If you could care less, you must care some. That's good. I knew you liked sprouts. :thumb: :chew:
:noid:
csuguy
Well-known member
You may never like peanut butter, but some foods you don't like off hand you may acquire a taste for. Its not about being hard wired to like/not like it. Beer is not something your body just naturally likes after a certain age, people don't suddenly like it when they turn 21. Many drink it and think its disgusting. Many women may never like it, since they tend to stick with fruity sweet tasting drinks.
So the question is, can people acquire different sexual 'tastes'? The answer, as is evidenced by people who do, is yes. You won't ever acquire such a taste because you won't let yourself do so. But you can't use your lack of desire to do so as evidence that you can't. Non-sequitur.
PlastikBuddha
New member
Like so many other things about human behaviour the answer seems to be: it's complicated.
Trying to pretend sexuality is either entirely determined or entirely chosen just doesn't fit the facts.
Trying to pretend sexuality is either entirely determined or entirely chosen just doesn't fit the facts.
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