ECT Truth of Protestantism
- Thread starter Sheila B
- Start date
The world, to you: If Christianity is true, why in 2000+ years has there not been far more unity? Why the increasing fragmentation of beliefs?
So there.
EOT. RIP. DOA. CLOSED. SHUT DOWN. DO NOT ENTER-CONDEMNED. QED.
You are all welcome, respective members of the body of Christ.
genuineoriginal
New member
Most of this can be directly traced to the anti-semitism of Augustine and John Chrysostom.
Aimiel
Well-known member
Because iron sharpens iron. Jesus wants us to argue, so that we think of Him all day and night and cause others to do the same.
Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
Livelystone
New member
The false doctrines prophesied of by the apostles and the OT prophets were already entering the church by the time the last of the apostles were departing the scene.
Without them guarding the church, apostasy began to flourish in churches who at one time had worshipped God in truth. Then apostasy manifested within the RCC so when Protestant churches finally did appear they took on many of the same erroneous foundational doctrines the RCC had possessed before them. Then, they passed them onto the various denominations that followed them
Pentecost denominations had some flirtations with works of the Holy Spirit but other than understanding a little of Pentecost their doctrines were just as corrupt as those before them that by the time of the end of the church age (the time we are now entering) has caused God to turn His back again leaving them and their offshoots (Charismatics) just as powerless as everyone else
Long story short....... when you point your finger at someone else you need to pay attention to your three fingers pointing right back at you
Jedidiah
New member
Lots of people think that Our Lord Jesus Christ is actually against unity, because of Matthew 7:13 "...wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which goe in thereat...."
The larger the group, the more the unity ? Is that necessarily true ?
But surely, the larger the group, the more the people who do think of Matthew 7:13 as against larger groups, think about Matthew 7:13.
The larger the group, the more the unity ? Is that necessarily true ?
But surely, the larger the group, the more the people who do think of Matthew 7:13 as against larger groups, think about Matthew 7:13.
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Sheila B
Member
Are you saying the anti-semitism of Martin Luther came from these 2 church fathers? How would this contribute? After all, most groups are less than 75 years old.
Sheila B
Member
Jedidiah
New member
:idunno: I'm just telling you what people think. Some of them are on this forum.
1 From whence come warres and fightings among you? come they not hence, euen of your lusts, that warre in your members ?
2 Ye lust, and haue not: yee kill, and desire to haue, and cannot obtaine: yee fight and warre, yet yee haue not, because ye aske not.
3 Ye aske and receiue not, because ye aske amisse, that yee may consume it vpon your lusts.
4 Ye adulterers, and adulteresses, know yee not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoeuer therefore will be a friend of the world, is the enemy of God.
5 Doe ye thinke that the Scripture saith in vaine, the spirit that dwelleth in vs lusteth to enuy?
6 But he giueth more grace, wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proude, but giueth grace vnto the humble.
7 Submit your selues therefore to God: resist the deuill, and hee will flee from you.
8 Draw nigh to God, and hee will draw nigh to you: cleanse your hands ye sinners, and purifie your hearts yee double minded.
9 Bee afflicted, and mourne, and weepe: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your ioy to heauinesse.
10 Humble your selues in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you vp.
11 Speake not euill one of another: he that speaketh euill of his brother, and iudgeth his brother, speaketh euill of the Law, and iudgeth the Law: but if thou iudge the Law, thou art not a doer of the Law, but a iudge.
1 From whence come warres and fightings among you? come they not hence, euen of your lusts, that warre in your members ?
2 Ye lust, and haue not: yee kill, and desire to haue, and cannot obtaine: yee fight and warre, yet yee haue not, because ye aske not.
3 Ye aske and receiue not, because ye aske amisse, that yee may consume it vpon your lusts.
4 Ye adulterers, and adulteresses, know yee not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoeuer therefore will be a friend of the world, is the enemy of God.
5 Doe ye thinke that the Scripture saith in vaine, the spirit that dwelleth in vs lusteth to enuy?
6 But he giueth more grace, wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proude, but giueth grace vnto the humble.
7 Submit your selues therefore to God: resist the deuill, and hee will flee from you.
8 Draw nigh to God, and hee will draw nigh to you: cleanse your hands ye sinners, and purifie your hearts yee double minded.
9 Bee afflicted, and mourne, and weepe: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your ioy to heauinesse.
10 Humble your selues in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you vp.
11 Speake not euill one of another: he that speaketh euill of his brother, and iudgeth his brother, speaketh euill of the Law, and iudgeth the Law: but if thou iudge the Law, thou art not a doer of the Law, but a iudge.
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Well I was driving past some churches in town one day and I asked the Lord why He does not join them together.
He said He was not going to join all that flesh together.
(I get surprised sometimes when He answers so fast like that)
LA
genuineoriginal
New member
The anti-semitism of the early church fathers led to the allegorization of the Bible, which led to the disputes over which of the profusions of allegories to believe, which led to increased denominationalization of Christianity.
Hi and you all know Matt 16:18 , BUT Luke 11:51 says ' Suppose ye that I am come to give you PEACE on earth ? I tell you , Nay , but rather DIVISION ??
Dispensationalism was here before the so-called RCC , AND STOLE the Jewish religion , with its Priesthood , and then added Purgatory and then MARY !!
DAN P
Levolor
New member
This state of affairs will sure make the separation and gathering up at the end of who is a tare and who is a wheat obvious, and therefore easier...
27 So the servants of the owner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’ 28 He said to them, ‘An enemy has done this.’ The servants said to him, ‘Do you want us then to go and gather them up?’ 29 But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them. Matthew 13:27-29 (NKJV)
Pardon my attempt at a little levity.
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well i was raised catholic until 5th grade. i'm 45. in a nutshell, protestant started when we realize The Bible does not require a priest to commune with God. you can't pay money for transgressions. i know catholics don't practice that anymore. as far as all the denominations. Selfishness. misinterpretation. but always Selfishness in the end. SELF. individually or in groups. everyone thinks they know, nobody does, and we all want to. go figure :rapture:
csuguy
Well-known member
The Protestant Movement wasn't/isn't perfect, but there were some legitimate issues with the Catholic Church that they were not, and are not, willing to address. Like the issue of the papacy.
Protestants, in general, need to learn that while truth is important - you don't need to start a church over a minor difference in understanding. This is particularly a problem with those denominations that place all the emphasis on belief vs. works. They fail to understand that what is important is doing God's will, helping those in need, and keeping oneself pure from the world.
Catholics need a similar lesson: you don't need to agree on every piece of doctrine to be unified. In addition: the Church Fathers were just men like you and me. They had to study the scriptures and philosophy and debate to establish their doctrines - and these debates weren't necessarily settled in Godly manners. Accept that while tradition is a solid starting point for one's study of God, there is bound to be some error in there as well - and one needs to be able to openly disagree while maintaining Christian unity.
Remember: many of the early protestants didn't want to depart from Catholicism, but wanted to address issues internally. Rather, they were forced to because the Catholic Church at the time would rather kill them then open discussions on the matters at hand.
oatmeal
Well-known member
There are as many Protestant groups as there are scriptural reasons not to be Roman Catholic
Evidently, people are discovering from scripture, more and more reasons not to be Roman Catholic, hence, more and more groups
If there are 50,000 splinter groups, it is because there are 50,000 scriptural reasons not to be an RC
Sheila B
Member
East and west split on 1095 AD and Martin Luther and Calvin, etc came along in the 1500-1600's. Then the recent fragmentations are from the early 1900's. These are historical facts.
None of these were over allegories of scripture.
Livelystone
New member
What do you think the Tower of Babel that represents mans way of trying to get to heaven with man made bricks (works) was an OT prophecy of if not of all of the man made religions today?
HisServant
New member
Mostly because of pride, arrogance and the belief that fringe 'doctrines' have equal footing with the core of the Gospel.
It's no different than what is going in within the RCC and orthodox churches... they just manage it better.
It's no different than what is going in within the RCC and orthodox churches... they just manage it better.