It has been addressed.Originally posted by Freak
jhodgeiii, is a African-Amercian brother in Christ who has raised some reasonable concerns. I'm still waiting for someone to address his concerns.
It has been addressed.Originally posted by Freak
jhodgeiii, is a African-Amercian brother in Christ who has raised some reasonable concerns. I'm still waiting for someone to address his concerns.
Originally posted by Knight
It has been addressed.
So evidently you think we are a bunch of insensitivists. What a crock. We care deeply about what God teaches about the death penalty, which according to the topic at hand, is that capitol offenders should be swiftly (not prolonged torture) but painfully (like being stoned for example) put to death.While stopping short of labeling the Enyart disciples and KGOV "racists", this looks like yet another example of total insensitivity on their part.
Wow, consider the following death by splattering a person from a supposed lethal fall, and then by trampling under foot of a horse, and then being eaten by dogs and without a respectful burial because God wanted it that way.Leviticus 10:2 So fire went out from the LORD and devoured them, and they died before the LORD.
Numbers 15:36 So, as the LORD commanded Moses, all the congregation brought him outside the camp and stoned him with stones, and he died.
Numbers 16:32 and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed them up, with their households and all the men with Korah, with all their goods.
Joshua 7:25 And Joshua said, "Why have you troubled us? The LORD will trouble you this day." So all Israel stoned him with stones; and they burned them with fire after they had stoned them with stones.
If you go against God, apparently being bludgeoned to death (stoning, or in this case falling) is a Godly remedy. And many argue that execution by the sword is also acceptable even though it may take minuets to bleed to death unless you are decapitated, which seems to not be as much recommended in the scriptures, as apparently it is too swift and not as painful and slow as stoning for example.2 Kings 9:30 Now when Jehu had come to Jezreel, Jezebel heard [of it]; and she put paint on her eyes and adorned her head, and looked through a window.
31 Then, as Jehu entered at the gate, she said, "Is it peace, Zimri, murderer of your master?"
32 And he looked up at the window, and said, "Who is on my side? Who?" So two or three eunuchs looked out at him.
33 Then he said, "Throw her down." So they threw her down, and some of her blood spattered on the wall and on the horses; and he trampled her underfoot.
34 And when he had gone in, he ate and drank. Then he said, "Go now, see to this accursed woman, and bury her, for she was a king's daughter."
35 So they went to bury her, but they found no more of her than the skull and the feet and the palms of her hands.
36 Therefore they came back and told him. And he said, "This is the word of the LORD, which He spoke by His servant Elijah the Tishbite, saying, `On the plot of ground at Jezreel dogs shall eat the flesh of Jezebel;
37 `and the corpse of Jezebel shall be as refuse on the surface of the field, in the plot at Jezreel, so that they shall not say, "Here lies Jezebel."'"
Acts 12:23 Then immediately an angel of the Lord struck him, because he did not give glory to God. And he was eaten by worms and died.
Isn’t that a wild understatement! Just think of the ridicule and irony involved. As though being put to death by hanging was a blessed or honorable way to die. How could a person be much more accursed than to be put to death for a capitol offense? As far as being “cursed” goes, that is about as bad as it gets, unless of course you don’t give the capitol offender sufficient time to repent before he is put to death. Waiting in the gallows to die is highly redemptive motivation, see the two criminals at the cross for an example of it’s effectiveness.Genesis 40:22 But he hanged the chief baker, as Joseph had interpreted to them.
Deuteronomy 21:21 "Then all the men of his city shall stone him to death with stones; so you shall put away the evil from among you, and all Israel shall hear and fear.
22 "If a man has committed a sin deserving of death, and he is put to death, and you hang him on a tree,
23 "his body shall not remain overnight on the tree, but you shall surely bury him that day, so that you do not defile the land which the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance; for he who is hanged is accursed of God.
Gods fear causing minister, baring the sword with Godly purpose as an avenger to execute wrath (punish - repay) the criminal. I think that the sword as wrathful punishment for doing evil has to mean the death penalty, otherwise what would this passage be saying about the sword, that it is to be used for flogging, or as nothing more than a symbol of an outward appearance of lethal force, but never used that way? This passage is validating capitol punishment by use of the sword and since decapitation is no where clearly specified, one may assume that mortal wounds causing circulatory failure is acceptable.Joshua 8:29 And the king of Ai he hanged on a tree until evening. And as soon as the sun was down, Joshua commanded that they should take his corpse down from the tree, cast it at the entrance of the gate of the city, and raise over it a great heap of stones that remains to this day.
Joshua 10:26 And afterward Joshua struck them and killed them, and hanged them on five trees; and they were hanging on the trees until evening.
2 Samuel 21:9 and he delivered them into the hands of the Gibeonites, and they hanged them on the hill before the LORD. So they fell, all seven together, and were put to death in the days of harvest, in the first days, in the beginning of barley harvest.
Galatians 3:13 Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree"),
Romans 13:4 For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to [execute] wrath on him who practices evil.
So you determine that there is not enough evidence to go one way or the other, but you seem to insist that it is a presentation supporting arguably the most cruel racist unjust treatment of blacks, even though the entire video presentation promotes scriptural teachings on this topic.Given the setting, the execution looks more like a mob lynching. If you cannot provide real details justifying this scene, then you cannot answer my question. It's as simple as that.
I’m certain that “Doug” McBurney and us Enyart like minded fans are willing to allow fools and swine and unfit dogs and other such filth to go to hell where they belong, we do not wish that anyone goes to hell unless they are determined to go there. Where intolerance comes in is defending our witness to the world, we want to give the truth in love that can set them free and we will not tolerate anything that goes against that (God and His truth and ways). But again, if you wont accept the truth and God’s way of salvation, then it’s to hell with jet rockets.Bigot - "One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ."
Knight, you are saying that Craig McBurney is not intolerant of particular groups, say homosexuals, and does not fit that definition?
Can only someone who disagrees with your viewpoint be a bigot?
Uhg....Originally posted by jhodgeiii
It has? How? That "Bob teaches against vigilantism" but proudly displays vigilantism at the end of his tape?
I almost made a point like this..... but I didn't want to mudddy the waters. I think we all know what type of bigot is being discussed here.Originally posted by Zakath
Bigot - "One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ."
Knight, you are saying that Craig McBurney is not intolerant of particular groups, say homosexuals, and does not fit that definition?
Can only someone who disagrees with your viewpoint be a bigot?
Thank you for answering in his place.Originally posted by 1Way
Zakath – As to your comment to Knight.
Foolse, swine, and unfit dogs?I’m certain that “Doug” McBurney and us Enyart like minded fans are willing to allow fools and swine and unfit dogs and other such filth to go to hell where they belong, we do not wish that anyone goes to hell unless they are determined to go there.
Intolerance tends to close the door.Where intolerance comes in is defending our witness to the world, we want to give the truth in love that can set them free and we will not tolerate anything that goes against that (God and His truth and ways).
So you hope, since it justifies your intolerance.But again, if you wont accept the truth and God’s way of salvation, then it’s to hell with jet rockets.
I'm only going by what I see. I'm not color- or shade-blind so I'm not being hypocritical here if that's what you're implying.Originally posted by 1Way
As to jhodgeiii’s statement to Knight. So you determine that there is not enough evidence to go one way or the other, but you seem to insist that it is a presentation supporting arguably the most cruel racist unjust treatment of blacks, even though the entire video presentation promotes scriptural teachings on this topic.
This is where your ignorance on lynchings shows. Take a look at this link and see all the "business people" at these lynchings:Business people in a public hanging is not the picture of a criminal lynching that we might imagine from white hooded KKK members for example.
I reject the first argument. You can't even see his skin (which is completely covered with clothing) other than his "face." And PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE note that I never insisted that the guy was black, but that he appeared to be, assuming that his head wasn't covered with a dark hood.Do you have ANY responses to the several claims in support that it was a white person being hanged?
- His skin was very light
- He may have been wearing a black facial hood
A hanging from a tree is not typical of an illegal racial lynching? You're kidding, right?- The scene is not typical of an illegal racial lynching
This is true. This video gives great arguments on righteous execution. I only question the scene of choice the producers of the tape decided to leave the viewer with. It leaves too much to ponder, especially for us blacks.The entire video's message and BEL’s ministry deplores such a terrible injustice as illegally hanging anyone
Perhaps because I've seen many, many photos of unjust lynchings similar to this setting???Suppose it was a black man that was being hung, why would you automatically think that the hanging was unjust or representative of unjust lynchings?
Actually, I did give the scene the benefit of the doubt, knowing Bob's nature. It's upsetting, however, that a tape so well done had to be marred with an ambiguous ending scene reminding us blacks of an unjust, painful history. Perhaps if blacks were the majority and years ago whites were unrighteously hung from trees among smiling blacks you would understand.- Why don’t you rather assume that the graphic representations were chose to be consistent with the teachings and style of the producers instead of contrary to them?
I'll make it clear that Bob is NOT a racist. Bob is a role model for me, and I'd never want to slander his ministry. I credit him for my Christian fervency. However, being black and having mostly black friends, I KNOW that this scene will cause blacks to stumble. I really, really wish that the producers had used a different scene.Or do you suggest that Bob has problems with racism and has no clearly expressed convictions against such an unloving and unrighteous thing?
You do not understand the spirit of my letter to Bob. If by this point you still don't, then I will forgive your ignorance, brother.It seems to me that it is you who is being insensitive to the fact that the entire message of the video would completely condemn the notion that you think this one scene seems to promote. Ignorance is forgivable, it's outgrown all the time.(!) Praise God.
I pray that your diatribe edifies someone else because I have been a Bible-believing Christian since age 13, thank you. You know, one thing about Bob is that he seems to have a gift for revealing unbelievers. I can clearly see that you lack this gift 1WAY.I’m certain that “Doug” McBurney and us Enyart like minded fans are willing to allow fools and swine and unfit dogs and other such filth to go to hell where they belong, we do not wish that anyone goes to hell unless they are determined to go there. Where intolerance comes in is defending our witness to the world, we want to give the truth in love that can set them free and we will not tolerate anything that goes against that (God and His truth and ways). But again, if you wont accept the truth and God’s way of salvation, then it’s to hell with jet rockets.
I just talked to Bob. Bob said the picture is of a white man being hung in a public execution in the mid-west some time around the late 1800's.Originally posted by Jefferson
If there is someone on this forum who is a member of the church Bob pastors please ask him where he got that photograph. From a book? From a website? Then we could possibly track down the real story behind the picture instead of just speculating and guessing about it.
It depends on what your definition of 'white' is, Knight.Originally posted by Knight
I just talked to Bob. Bob said the picture is of a white man being hung in a public execution in the mid-west some time around the late 1800's.
Any details of the like that Jefferson mentions? If I have a source, I could preempt misinterpretation of this scene for those whom I want to show this tape.Originally posted by Knight
I just talked to Bob. Bob said the picture is of a white man being hung in a public execution in the mid-west some time around the late 1800's.
I think I have taken this as far (even further) than I care to.Originally posted by jhodgeiii
Any details of the like that Jefferson mentions? If I have a source, I could preempt misinterpretation of this scene for those whom I want to show this tape.
For myself, race really isn't the issue, but the rightfulness of the execution IS. If you could even give me just the book it came from I would dig up the details myself.